Pool C

[Gregory Sager]

Sure, but the common understanding is that they are going to evaluate results vRRO based upon evidence that is public knowledge -- the games themselves taken singly, the games themselves taken collectively, or a combination of the two. If they're evaluating vRRO in part or in whole based upon a Top 50 or a Top 100 that nobody else sees and whose construction is equally mysterious, then that makes the vRRO criterion opaque.

[Ralph Turner]

Sure, but the common understanding is that they are going to evaluate results vRRO based upon evidence that is public knowledge -- the games themselves taken singly, the games themselves taken collectively, or a combination of the two. If they're evaluating vRRO in part or in whole based upon a Top 50 or a Top 100 that nobody else sees and whose construction is equally mysterious, then that makes the vRRO criterion opaque.

+1!

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

It is nearly time to tip off the 2019 Division III Men's and Women's Championship Tournaments, but not without checking with Hoopsville first.

We talk to a number of programs getting ready for their first round games. From those dancing for the first time to those whose programs are a mainstay, we will cover the gamete on Thursday's show. Tune in starting at 7:00 p.m. ET to also hear who experts and friends of the show think will be in the final fours, even winning it all, in a few weeks time.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show in the video player above. If you miss any of the program, you can always watch it On Demand or listen to the audio-only podcast to the right (available shortly after the show goes off air).

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to dave.mchugh@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Matt Hunter, York (Pa.) men's coach
- Bobby Hughes, Rosemont men's coach
- Women's final four predictions
- Brian Morehouse, No. 10 Hope women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Brad Fischer, No. 13 UW-Oshkosh women's coach
- Terry Butterfield, Texas-Dallas men's coach
- Men's final four predictions

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville




Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville

[Titan Q]

(I can't confirm the order of these selection...just my best guess at the time.)

2018-19 Season
1. (C) Augustana: .889, 24-3/.547/8-3
2. (S) Randolph-Macon: .893, 25-3/.534/6-3
3. (NE) Hamilton: .885, 23-3/.553/4-3
4. (NE) Williams: .769, 20-6/.598/6-5
5. (C) UW-Oshkosh: .885, 23-3/.542/3-3
6. (W) Loras: .778, 21-6/.587/2-2
7. (GL) Marietta: .769, 20-6/.549/6-4
8. (MA) York (Pa.): .750, 21-7/.561/6-4
9. (W) St. Thomas: .846, 22-4/.532/4-1
10. (GL) Wooster: .821, 23-5/.543/3-4
11. (E) Rochester: .800, 20-5/.539/5-2
12. (GL) Capital: .741, 20-7/.546/6-4
13. (E) Plattsburgh State: .760, 19-6/.531/6-6
14. (AT) New Jersey City: .741, 20-7/.551/6-6
15. (NE) MIT: .846, 22-4/.555/1-0
16. (NE) Middlebury: .708, 17-7/.600/4-5
17. (MA) Salisbury: .704, 19-8/.575/4-7
18. (C) Wheaton: .704, 19-8/.574/4-5
19. (AT) Ramapo: .667, 18-9/.567/8-5
20. (C) UW-La Crosse .654, 17-9/.574/4-4

2017-18 Season
1. Hamilton (NE/NESCAC): .846 (22-4)/.573/6-3 
2. Wesleyan (NE/NESCAC): .778 (21-6)/.590/8-4   
3. UW-Platteville (CE/WIAC: .833 (20-4)/.577/4-1   
4. Whitman (WE/NWC): .962 (25-1)/.515/4-1
5. Swarthmore (MA/CC): .815 (22-5)/.542/3-4   
6. St. John's (WE/MIAC): .880 (22-3)/.524/3-2 
7. Middlebury (NE/NESCAC): .760 (19-6).590/4-6   
8. Wooster (GL/NCAC): .778 (21-6)/.565/4-3
9. Marietta (GL/OAC): .778 (21-6)/.564/4-5   
10. New Jersey City (AT/NJAC): .731 (19-7)/.567/6-4   
11. Emory (SO/UAA): .840 (21-4)/.530/4-2 
12. Christopher Newport (MA/CAC): .777 (21-6)/.546/3-2   
13. UW-Oshkosh (CE/WIAC): .741 (20-7)/.554/2-4   
14. St. Olaf (WE/MIAC): .731 (19-7)/.544/3-2   
15. Albright (MA/Commonwealth): .769 (20-6)/.544/3-2   
16. Franklin and Marshall (MA/CC): .769 (20-6)/.536/3-4 
17. North Central (CE/CCIW): .692 (18-8)/.563/4-5   
18. Illinois Wesleyan (CE/CCIW): .731 (19-7)/.550/3-6 
19. Springfield (NE/NEWMAC): .692 (18-8)/.558/4-2 
20. Brockport (E/SUNYAC): .731/.529/3-3
21. LeTourneau (SO/ASC): .852 (23-4)/.511/2-2

2016-17 Season
1. Babson (NE/NEWMAC): .926/.574/4-1
2. Williams (NE/NESCAC): .731/.592/7-4   
3. Susquehanna (MA/LAND): .800/.556/4-4
4. UW-Whitewater (C/WIAC): .769/.567/3-5
5. Rochester (E/UAA): .840/.534/4-2
6. Amherst (NE/NESCAC): .708/.598/5-5
7. Tufts (NE/NESCAC): .769/.566/4-4
8. Wesleyan (NE/NESCAC): .760/.560/4-3
9. Whitworth (W/NWC): .852/.544/0-3
10. Salisbury (MA/CAC): .741/.546/3-4
11. New Jersey City (AT/NJAC): .750/.533/5-4
12. Hope (GL/MIAA): .800/.525/2-1
13. Cabrini (AT/CSAC): .760/.531/2-3
14. Emory (S/UAA): .720/.547/2-3
15. Skidmore (E/LL): .731/.527/6-1
16. St. Lawrence (E/LL): .769/.526/3-5
17. Augustana (C/CCIW): .704/.542/2-2
18. Keene State (NE/LEC): .679/.575/3-4
19. Endicott (NE/CCC): .786/.532/1-1
20. St. Thomas (W/MIAC): .731/.530/1-2
21. UW-Oshkosh: (C/WIAC): .630/.601/5-6

Pool C Bids: 2019/2018/2017 = Total
* Northeast: 4/4/7 = 15

* Central: 4/4/3 = 11

* Great Lakes: 3/2/2 = 7

* Mid Atlantic: 2/4/1 = 7

* West: 2/3/2 = 7

* East: 2/1/3 = 6

* Atlantic: 2/1/2 = 5

* South: 1/2/1 = 4

We might talk some Pool C (high level stuff) on Hoopsville tonight.  Pasting this here in case we do.

[Dave 'd-mac' McHugh]

What a start to the 2019-20 season! As we head into the holidays "break," there is a lot to talk about. We don't have enough time in a show to cover it all, but we will do our best.

Tune into Hoopsville Thursday night as Dave is joined not only by a couple of coaches who have their programs humming along, but also three of the show's best prognosticators who will open up a few Christmas gifts for Division III fans.

Marietta men are once again playing very well in the first half of the season, but do you know why the Pioneers are this good? Jon VanderWal gives us some insight of what is going on in Southern Ohio. Plus, the Augsburg women are one of four MIAC teams ranked in the Top 25 this past week. The Auggies are coming off an unprecedented win over St. Thomas (Minn.) as well. Ted Riverso discusses how it is the perfect bow before their three-week break.

Plus, Bob Quillman and Ryan Scott give us their individual takes on the first part of the season and what they expect in the final two months. And Gordon Mann gives us his exceptional takes on the women's side of the ledger. Who really are the best teams in the country and who should we be watching?

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show On Demand in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2EBOzt2 (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/dec19)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (only the first 45 minutes aired; may have had a copyright problem haha)
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Bob Quillman, Hoopsville contributor
- Jon VanderWal, No. 6 Marietta men's head coach
- Ryan Scott, D3hoops.com Around the Nation columnist
- Ted Riverso, No. 16 Augsburg women's head coach
- Gordon Mann, D3hoops.com Senior Editor

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville








We also have the podcast now on Tune-In and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
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[Titan Q]

My 20 Pool Cs as of Christmas Day.

Data courtesy of Matt Snyder - https://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html.

(WP/SOS/notable wins)

1. (C/UAA) Wash U .900/.579 (vs Eau Claire, vs Augustana, at IWU)
2. (MA/CC) Johns Hopkins .889/613 (vs Christopher Newport, at Muhlenberg)
3. (NE/NEWMAC) Springfield .889/.644 (n/a)
4. (C/WIAC) UW-Eau Claire .800/.599 (at Whitworth)
5. (NE/NESCAC) Hamilton .900/.547 (vs Nichols)
6. (GL/OAC) Mount Union .750/.601 (vs Carnegie Mellon, at Wooster)
7. (GL/NCAC) Wooster .875/.591 (vs Wabash, vs Brockport)
8. (S/ODAC) Virginia Wesleyan .875/.576 (at Guilford, vs Christopher Newport)
9. (S/ODAC) Guilford .800/.617 (vs Mary Hardin-Baylor)
10. (C/WIAC) UW-La Crosse 1.000/.523 (vs Augsburg)
11. (NE/NESCAC) Middlebury 1.000/.526 (n/a)
12. (C/CCIW) Illinois Wesleyan .700/.615 (vs Carthage, at Augustana)
13. (C/CCIW) Augustana .700/.647 (vs Loras, at UW-Stevens Point)
14. (C/WIAC) Stevens Point .778/.597 (at Christopher Newport, vs Hope)
15. (C/CCIW) Carthage .900/.509 (vs UW-Oshkosh, vs North Central)
16. (NE/NEWMAC) WPI .800/.573 (vs Tufts)
17. (W/MIAC) Augsburg .778/.555 (vs UW-River Falls)
18. (C/CCIW) Elmhurst .900/.467 (vs St. Norbert, at UW-Oshkosh)
19. (C/WIAC) UW-River Falls .750/.590 (vs Nebraska Wesleyan)
20. (S/SAA) Centre: .800/.579 (at Wabash)
--------
21. (W/ARC) Buena Vista .900/.526 (n/a)
22. (E/UAA) Rochester .889/.572 (n/a)
23. (S/ASC) LeTourneau .857/.563 (n/a)
24. (W/MIAC) St. Johns .900/.474 (n/a)
25. (W/MIAC) Bethel .667/.549 (at UW-Stevens Point)
26. (NE/NESCAC) Tufts .778/.652 (n/a)
27. (GL/NCAC) Allegheny .700/.594 (vs Carnegie Mellon)
28. (AT/NJAC) Rutgers-Newark .700/.551 (vs Utica)
29. (C/WIAC) UW-Oshkosh .556/.646 (at Augustana, at North Central)
30. (C/CCIW) North Central .700/.519 (at Elmhurst)
31. (E/LL) Union .800/.563 (n/a)
32. (MA/CC) Muhlenberg .800/.523 (n/a)
33. (MA/CAC) Christopher Newport .636/.615 (n/a)
34. (GL/UAA) Carnegie Mellon .778/.576 (n/a)
35. (GL/MIAA) Albion .750/.571 (n/a)
36. (E/E8) Nazareth .750/.542 (n/a)
37. (W/ARC) Loras .800/.508 (n/a)


Assumed Pool A (not all conferences are listed here)
SAA - Berry
CAC - York (Pa)
NESCAC - Colby
NCAC - Wittenberg
Centennial - Swarthmore
MIAC - St. Thomas
ODAD - Randolph-Macon
OAC - Marietta
ARC - Nebraska Wesleyan
UAA - Emory
WIAC - UW-Platteville
CCIW - Wheaton
MWC - St. Norbert
NACC - Benedictine
NEWMAC - Babson
Liberty - Hobart
NJAC - Stockton
ASC - Mary Hardin-Baylor
MIAA - Hope
NWC - Whitworth
SCIAC - Pomona-Pitzer
E8 - Utica

[Baldini]

Great stuff Titan Q. Who would of thought at Christmas that both North Central and UW-Oshkosh would be off the Pool C radar.

[ronk]

My 20 Pool Cs as of Christmas Day.

Data courtesy of Matt Snyder - https://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html.

(WP/SOS/notable wins)

1. (C/UAA) Wash U .900/.579 (vs Eau Claire, vs Augustana, at IWU)
2. (MA/CC) Johns Hopkins .889/613 (vs Christopher Newport, at Muhlenberg)
3. (NE/NESCAC) Springfield .889/.644 (n/a)
4. (C/WIAC) UW-Eau Claire .800/.599 (at Whitworth)
5. (NE/NESCAC) Hamilton .900/.547 (vs Nichols)
6. (GL/OAC) Mount Union .750/.601 (vs Carnegie Mellon, at Wooster)
7. (GL/NCAC) Wooster .875/.591 (vs Wabash, vs Brockport)
8. (S/ODAC) Virginia Wesleyan .875/.576 (at Guilford, vs Christopher Newport)
9. (S/ODAC) Guilford .800/.617 (vs Mary Hardin-Baylor)
10. (C/WIAC) UW-La Crosse 1.000/.523 (vs Augsburg)
11. (NE/NESCAC) Middlebury 1.000/.526 (n/a)
12. (C/CCIW) Illinois Wesleyan .700/.615 (vs Carthage, at Augustana)
13. (C/CCIW) Augustana .700/.647 (vs Loras, at UW-Stevens Point)
14. (C/WIAC) Stevens Point .778/.597 (at Christopher Newport, vs Hope)
15. (C/CCIW) Carthage .900/.509 (vs UW-Oshkosh, vs North Central)
16. (NE/NEWMAC) WPI .800/.573 (vs Tufts)
17. (W/MIAC) Augsburg .778/.555 (vs UW-River Falls)
18. (C/CCIW) Wheaton: .800/.482 (vs UW-River Falls, at Illinois Wesleyan)
19. (C/WIAC) UW-River Falls .750/.590 (vs Nebraska Wesleyan)
20. (S/SAA) Centre: .800/.579 (at Wabash)
--------
21. (W/ARC) Buena Vista .900/.526 (n/a)
22. (E/UAA) Rochester .889/.572 (n/a)
23. (NE/NESCAC) Tufts .778/.652 (n/a)
24. (S/ASC) LeTourneau .857/.563 (n/a)
25. (W/MIAC) St. Johns .900/.474 (n/a)
27. (W/MIAC) Bethel .667/.549 (at UW-Stevens Point)
28. (MA/CC) Muhlenberg .800/.523 (n/a)
29. (AT/NJAC) Rutgers-Newark .700/.551 (vs Utica)
30. (MA/CAC) Christopher Newport .636/.615 (n/a)
31. (C/WIAC) UW-Oshkosh .556/.646 (at Augustana, at North Central)
32. (C/CCIW) North Central .700/.519 (at Elmhurst)
33. (E/LL) Union .800/.563 (n/a)
34. (GL/NCAC) Allegheny .700/.594 (vs Carnegie Mellon)
35. (GL/UAA) Carnegie Mellon .778/.576 (n/a)
36. (GL/MIAA) Albion .750/.571 (n/a)
37. (E/E8) Nazareth .750/.542 (n/a)
38. (W/ARC) Loras .800/.508 (n/a)


Assumed Pool A (all conferences not listed here)
NESCAC - Colby
NCAC - Wittenberg
Centennial - Swarthmore
MIAC - St. Thomas
ODAD - Randolph-Macon
OAC - Marietta
ARC - Nebraska Wesleyan
UAA - Emory
WIAC - UW-Platteville
CCIW - Elmhurst
MWC - St. Norbert
NACC - Benedictine
NEWMAC - Babson
Liberty - Hobart
NJAC - Stockton
ASC - Mary Hardin-Baylor
MIAA - Hope
NWC - Whitworth
SCIAC - Pomona-Pitzer

Good stuff, Titan. Suggest that u add a Pool A 4 whichever conferences u have a Pool C; e.g., CAC would be York(PA).

[Titan Q]

Good stuff, Titan. Suggest that u add a Pool A 4 whichever conferences u have a Pool C; e.g., CAC would be York(PA).

Yes, good call.  Added CAC and SAA.

[Greek Tragedy]

9 of 20 from the central? Obviously a long way to go...

[Titan Q]

9 of 20 from the central? Obviously a long way to go...

The "long way to go" part is the key.  That is where I see things at this very early point.  Conference play will change the picture pretty dramatically.

Looks like Matt Snyder has 7 Central now - https://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html.

Massey would have 9 Central - https://www.masseyratings.com/cb2020/ncaa-d3/ratings.
1 Elmhurst
2 UW-La Crosse
3 Wash U
4 Johns Hopkins
5 Middlebury
6 UW-Oshkosh
7 Augustana
8 Tufts
9 UW-Stevens Point
10 St. John's
11 Springfield
12 Illinois Wesleyan
13 Carthage
14 Mount Union
15 Virginia Wesleyan
16 Hamilton
17 Amherst
18 North Central
19 Guilford
20 Rochester

[Greek Tragedy]

Unfortunately for the WIAC and CCIW, that's true because they'll beat each other up in conference play while other leagues are top heavy and the big dogs will just continue to win.

[Titan Q]

Unfortunately for the WIAC and CCIW, that's true because they'll beat each other up in conference play while other leagues are top heavy and the big dogs will just continue to win.

For sure.  Conferences that are deep and balanced will be the most impacted as we get full-time into league play.  While that depth is great for SOS, it obviously hurts WP...and generally when WP dips below .700 that is Pool C trouble.

There are 6 CCIW teams in the Massey top 50, and 5 WIAC teams.  Even the regular season champions of these leagues are going to have a bunch of conference losses...not to mention finishers 2, 3, and 4.

CCIW
#8 Elmhurst
#13 Wheaton
#18 Augustana
#26 Illinois Wesleyan
#27 Carthage
#32 North Central

WIAC
#5 UW-Platteville
#10 UW-La Crosse
#17 UW-Oshkosh
#23 UW-Stevens Point
#38 UW-Eau Claire
(#52 UW-River Falls) - beat Nebraska Wesleyan

Contrast that with, say, the NEWMAC, that has 3 in the Massey top 50 -- #9 Babson, #25 Springfield, #45 WPI.

Or the OAC, with 2 - #2 Marietta, #28 Mount Union.

NWC with 2 - #20 Whitworth, #43 Whitman.

NCAC with 2 - #7 Wittenberg, #40 Wooster.

Etc.


Safe to say a lot of those CCIW/WIAC teams in my 12/25/19 Pool C projection will fall out by Selection Sunday because winning percentages will fall so dramatically.

While the CCIW and WIAC are always deep, I don't think I can recall this much balance from 1 down to 5 or 6.  This is a pretty unique year for the two Central powers.

[D3RetiredHooper]

Question with regards to Pool C and amount of teams from one Region (Titan Q having 9 from the Central!).  Do you have to finish ranked in the final regional rankings to be eligible for a Pool C berth? If not, who decides which team is next to be brought to the table?

[Pat Coleman]

You do not have to be in the final regional rankings in order to get into the playoffs as an at-large bid. It has happened -- rarely, but it has happened, in both women's and men's basketball.

In addition to the published regional rankings, the regional committee ranks additional teams, in case they are needed in the at-large process.