MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Titan Q]

A kid for IWU to recruit from the class of 2014...

http://www.galesburg.com/sports/x1058234767/Bloomington-stops-Silver-Streaks-boys-77-67

The Streaks stayed within 59-55 with 3:26 left in the game before Bloomington's Brady Rose _ the son of Illinois Wesleyan coach Ron Rose _ took over. He scored 11 points in the next minute on a pair of 3-pointers, a traditional 3-point play and a field goal to put his team ahead 70-58 with 2:20 remaining.

Led by Rose, Bloomington made 10 of 11 shots in the fourth quarter and was 10-for-13 from the line in the period.

Rose finished with 24 points to lead Bloomington.

Dare we even dream that Brady Rose can follow in the footsteps of Steve Djurickovic and Derek Raridon among coaches' sons, or is that unfair pressure and out of reach?

You love to take things to extremes, don't you Chuck? 

[Mr. Ypsi]

No need to take my head off, Bob.  I was only asking.  I know nothing about the kid except what you posted (until then, I didn't even know Ron Rose had a son).

[kiko]

New Top 25:

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2012-13/week8

North Central remains at #5 with a flat vote total.

Illinois Wesleyan up from 18 to 16 with +5 points versus last week.

Wheaton falls from 20 to 25 and drops 129 of their previous 180 points after their loss to Carthage.

Augie's home loss to Wheaton sends them out of the top 25 into Others Receiving Votes with 12 points -- down from 68 the prior week.  The Vikings are behind seven other teams in the ORV category.

---

There was minimal movement at the top of the table as the #1 through #5 teams remained static and collectively gained a total of two points on the ballots.  #2 Rochester, #3 Middlebury, and #5 North Central all remained flat to their prior week's total, while #1 St. Thomas and #4 Whitworth each gained a point.  The Tommies did poach one of Rochester's first place votes, so there was clearly some movement on individual ballots.

Brandeis (+74 points after winning at Wash U) and Hampden-Sydney (+60) were the big gainers, pointwise, and both moved into the Top 25.

[Titan Q]

No need to take my head off, Bob.  I was only asking.  I know nothing about the kid except what you posted (until then, I didn't even know Ron Rose had a son).

I wasn't trying to take your head off, Chuck.  Just seemed a little "extreme" that after I mentioned a high school junior who is becoming a good player you asked if he might up being as good as one of the best players ever to play in the CCIW (Djurickovic) or a guy who was a 1st Team All-CCIW player last year (Raridon).  It reminded me of past attempts to put odds on undefeated seasons, Final Fours, and stuff like that.

[Mr. Ypsi]

No need to take my head off, Bob.  I was only asking.  I know nothing about the kid except what you posted (until then, I didn't even know Ron Rose had a son).

I wasn't trying to take your head off, Chuck.  Just seemed a little "extreme" that after I mentioned a high school junior who is becoming a good player you asked if he might up being as good as one of the best players ever to play in the CCIW (Djurickovic) or a guy who was a 1st Team All-CCIW player last year (Raridon).  It reminded me of past attempts to put odds on undefeated seasons, Final Fours, and stuff like that.

You (and Pat) can't seem to recognize how much I've tempered things in recent years, and still have me pegged as the overly giddy guy from SEVEN YEARS ago.  For example, just last year I was not even sure the Titans would get into the tourney; I never even entertained dreams of the Final Four until I watched them defeat #1 Hope in Holland.  Years of following d3 hoops (after 30 years of not doing so at all) really can make a guy more realistic!

Obviously, no one is sure about how a hs junior is gonna turn out (unless, maybe, he is LeBron!), and we don't even know for sure he'll be a Titan.  I was just wondering if his seeming upside was role player, solid starter, or 'the sky's the limit'?  (And I'm well aware how good Steve and Derek were/are - that's why I used the phrase 'Dare we even dream ...?')

[voiceofseason]

I've seen over half of Brady's games this year.  He has a really soft touch, and is playing in a very chaotic system where it is 94-feet of pressure the entire game.  Because of this style, they go 11 or 12 deep some games - he watches a lot as well, yet still puts up good numbers.  My thoughts are that he would be an even better player in a more structured setting such as many D3 schools employ, if he doesn't matriculate to a higher level by the time he graduates.  Shooting and intelligence are definitely strengths of his.

[Gregory Sager]

North Central 69
North Park 61

Mark Holmes: 15 pts
Zach Cassita: 13 pts, 4 asts
Ryan Hyrn: 12 pts
Reggie McGee: 10 pts
Chris Benjamin: 6 rebs
Cameron Burnett: 4 asts

Derek Raridon: 18 pts
Landon Gamble: 14 pts
Jack Burchett: 13 pts, 10 rebs
Charlie Rosenberg: 11 pts
Vince Kmiec: 12 rebs

NPU had a golden opportunity today to steal an upset on the #5 team in the nation -- and in reaching for it, the Vikings tripped over their own feet.

Picture this scenario: NCC was missing two starters today, Aaron Tiknis and Brandon Williams. Then Landon Gamble rolls his ankle at the 5:16 mark of the first half, sidelining him for the remainder of the game. Then Derek Raridon picks up his fourth foul with 15:39 to go in the game. That's four out of five NCC starters who were either not dressed at all, out with an in-game injury, or sidelined by fouls -- and three-quarters of a half still left to play. As if that wasn't enough of a situation in which the Vikings had the potential upset handed to them on a silver platter, Jack Burchett -- who played a whale of a game for North Central -- picked up his fourth foul with 13:06 to go.

So, how on Earth does North Central win the game? Simple: North Park can't rebound, and North Park can't figure out how to solve a zone.

Any chance that at least part of the reason North Central won was the ability of the NC subs to step up, and just plain gut it out and do what they needed to do?
I mean somebody in red was able to get the rebounds NP couldn't get, and somebody in red had to know where to both set up and and slide over to when the Cardinals fell back into zone defensive posture.

Also, given the fact the NCC defense came into the game ranked 5th nationally in scoring defense (55.4 ppg), and 3rd nationally in field goal percentage defense (36.3%) is there any chance the Cardinals just know how to play good defense--be it man or zone?

Rather than NCC's win being virtually totally dependent on what NP couldn't/can't do as the given answer to the above original question suggests, perhaps the win had as much to do with NCC's ability to prevent those things from happening?

C'mon AndOne as if you've never reported on a game exclusively from the NCC perspective.  Everybody does that.

Granted sac. Most people report with emphasis on what their team did.
However, I think "exclusively" is the key word here. Also, its not often a game is played under similar circumstances, where one of the involved teams is effectively playing with 1 1/2 (Derek Raridon was about 50%) starters.
I think that makes what the subs do both a little more unexpected, and noteworthy.

* I didn't say Greg was wrong. It just seemed to me that the final result was almost solely due to what NP didn't do, as opposed to at least partially due to what NCC did do. Thats all. 

Besides, if everybody does it, why the surprise? 

Give me a flippin' break, Mark. Talk about selective reading!

I said that Jack Burchett "played a whale of a game." I called Burchett and Charlie Rosenberg "monsters," and I even cited Burchett's dramatically-better-than-usual performance at the free-throw line as a positive factor in North Central's win (a point that you, in your desire to leave no stone unturned to praise the Cardinals, actually neglected to mention). And I gave Derek Raridon just about as high a note of praise as I've given to any opponent of NPU all season:

Raridon did everything that a team could ask for in spite of taking another blow to his aching shoulder that had him wincing for the rest of the game.

I cited the fact that NCC was down three and a half starters. I not only considered what the NCC subs did as noteworthy, I praised them for their performance. Yet, for some unknown reason -- perhaps because I didn't devote as many pixels to NCC as I did to NPU, or because I was insufficiently thorough in licking your team's sneakers -- this was all cause for you to bloviate about my relating the game "exclusively" from the NPU perspective.

Look, as sac noted, I -- like everybody else who does game recaps -- focus upon what my team did. My team is NPU, so it should come as absolutely no shock to anyone that that's the perspective with which I'm going to approach the recap. But to insinuate that I "exclusively" focused upon NPU, or that I completely neglected to attribute anything to NCC in terms of the game's outcome, is patently wrong.

The problem here isn't my reporting the game from a partisan perspective. It's your reading the reportage from a partisan perspective.

[Gregory Sager]

Mark Holmes missed a dunk with 10:52 remaining that would've put NPU in the lead and, quite possibly, would've given the Vikes the mental lift that they needed to believe in themselves. Instead, NCC rebounded the ball after it flew out to halfcourt and promptly scored the next four points.

* Mark Holmes missed dunk with 10:52 remaining and NP behind by only 1, was perhaps the turning point of the game. For, in addition to giving NP the lead, a successful finish would have allowed the Parkers to seize the momentum which we all know can go a very long way in propelling a team to victory.
However, rather than completing the brake away by just dribbling all the way to the basket and going up for a two-handed jam, Holmes had to have a little extra hot sauce on his dog, and took off from about half way down the lane. While airborne, he appeared to wind up as if for a windmill slam. However, the added relish only resulted in the ball clanking violently off the rim at about the two o'clock position and flying out to almost half court where the Cards corralled it.

See, right here is where we obviously can tell that I'm doing this whole game-recap thing wrong. I cited the missed Holmes dunk and the subsequent rebound, noted that NCC scored the next four points after garnering the ensuing long rebound, and added that NPU never came as close as it was when Holmes missed the dunk. But I clearly missed the point here, because you saw fit to repeat the entire incident. It was apparently my lack of metaphoric description of the missed dunk, as well as where exactly on the rim it landed, that caused me to stumble. After all, as the NPU guy I'm expected to go into fulsome detail to describe every missed NPU dunk, right?

* The Cards benefitted from the fact that Peterson played as many minutes as he did as opposed to Reggie McGee being on the court for some of those minutes. McGee looked good even during warmups before the game, and was a much more dangerous offensive force than Peterson, who the Cards could sluff off of a bit, thereby devoting more attention to NP's scorers.

Reggie McGee is a much more dangerous scorer than Brett Peterson. Everybody knows that. But McGee has played sparingly all season for NPU, because he has exhibited only timidity and ineffectiveness when he's been out on the court, whereas at least the offensively-challenged Peterson sticks his nose in there and gets involved. That changed on Saturday afternoon, when McGee finally showed some confidence and had a solid game. That explains why Peterson was on the floor for so many minutes, as compared to McGee. Each game, and each coaching strategy, is built upon the performances of what's gone on before (which is why McGee will probably see his minutes increase tomorrow night in Kenosha). Since you're not following NPU closely, you did not recognize this. Instead, you merely criticized without informing yourself as to the causes.

* Cassita hit 2 threes very early in the game, and a 3rd trey by about the half way point of the opening stanza. Thereafter, he, for some reason, began to either pass off when he had an open shot, or to take a poor shot when he was closely guarded, off balance, or both.

Cassita has to increase his offensive load without Weaver around, which means that he's under even more pressure with the ball in his hands. And he took some bad shots. Some of that was NPU's inability to solve the NCC zone leading to frustration or concession shots.

* Burnett was a very positive force for NP. He brought the dimension of speed to the court, and dished out 4 helpers.

Cameron Burnett's a very nice piece for NPU's future. Like Chris Benjamin and Ryan Hyrn, he's been a bright spot in a dark season for NPU.

* Holmes, Benjamin, and especially Hyrn, need to remember they aren't in the NBA just yet. I understand Hyrn is a very dangerous three point shooter, but it would be a good idea for him to be inside the gym before pulling the trigger. Holmes made 6 baskets, but took 15 shots, including 0 for 6 from three, to do so. I think lobbing up long 3 point bombs from a range beyond which they can reasonably be expected to find their target has historically been one of NP's problem points.

"Historically" has nothing to do with it. Ryan Hyrn didn't chuck up NBA trey attempts because Kendell Greer did so last year, or because Clayton Cahill did so the year before. He did it because the outside shooters collectively either panicked, or gave up, or were simply too confused by the zone to work for a better shot than that.

Don't know why you saw fit to go over this ground, too, as I noted on Saturday night that Holmes, Benjamin, and Hyrn went a combined 2-19 from downtown.

* Pat Rourke and Jack Merrithey may have played "undistinguished" games, but they effectively ran the offense, and hit a total of 5 FTs at important and late junctures of the game to help cement the victory.

They were also a combined 0-4 from the field and had three assists to four turnovers. I call that "undistinguished" PG work.

* NCC SG Vince Kmiec was quiet offensively, but pulled down a game high 12 rebounds.

... which I cited.

* Landon Gamble played only 12 minutes before going down with a game ending injury, but scored 14 points on 6 of 7 shooting in those 12 points. Had he played the entire game, he may have had 30 as NP had absolutely no answer inside for Landon prior to his injury.

File under: No Duh. NPU not only doesn't have an answer to the best center in the league, it doesn't have an answer to anybody's center. NPU is a team without a big man, as I must've repeated about eight thousand times already this season.

[Titan Q]

Greg, what happened to Aaron Weaver?  I apologize if I missed a previous post.

[Gregory Sager]

Academic casualty. I'm hoping that he sticks with it and gets his act together in the classroom, even if he never plays another minute in an NPU uniform. A bachelor's degree is much too important a steppingstone to success in American society for him to miss out on his opportunity to earn one.

[Gregory Sager]

I guess I read the boards with posters in mind

Greg Sager = North Park perspective and resident novelist, also historian  (sadly dark and depressing for most of the decade, rootin' for ya Greg)

TitanQ = only one shade of green really, in a former life i'm convinced Q was an excellent stock pumper, still quality observations from Nebraska which is not in the CCIW

any Wheaton poster =  lots of good Wheaton representation without the dancing post-game celebrations to rub it in

AndOne =  the North Central perspective,  no van or bus jokes please

Mr Ypsi =  the never seen a game I couldn't  place odds on without having seen a CCIW game in 40 years perspective

Knighslappy =  the Calvin perspective with some actual fact based rationality

Oldknight  =  years and years and years of quality basketball viewing experience, also years of experience.

any Wooster poster =  the refs sucked and they were against Wooster all night but we still managed to dominate the conference we've been dominating for a decade somehow

BTW, this was classic, sac. The Wooster point, especially, got a big chuckle out of me.

(The Ypsi bit was funny, too, but I don't want Chuck to think that everybody's piling on him today -- especially since people should be nice to him on Posters' Poll Deadline Day. )

[Mr. Ypsi]

I guess I read the boards with posters in mind

Greg Sager = North Park perspective and resident novelist, also historian  (sadly dark and depressing for most of the decade, rootin' for ya Greg)

TitanQ = only one shade of green really, in a former life i'm convinced Q was an excellent stock pumper, still quality observations from Nebraska which is not in the CCIW

any Wheaton poster =  lots of good Wheaton representation without the dancing post-game celebrations to rub it in

AndOne =  the North Central perspective,  no van or bus jokes please

Mr Ypsi =  the never seen a game I couldn't  place odds on without having seen a CCIW game in 40 years perspective

Knighslappy =  the Calvin perspective with some actual fact based rationality

Oldknight  =  years and years and years of quality basketball viewing experience, also years of experience.

any Wooster poster =  the refs sucked and they were against Wooster all night but we still managed to dominate the conference we've been dominating for a decade somehow

BTW, this was classic, sac. The Wooster point, especially, got a big chuckle out of me.

(The Ypsi bit was funny, too, but I don't want Chuck to think that everybody's piling on him today -- especially since people should be nice to him on Posters' Poll Deadline Day. )

Don't worry - I too thought that was both accurate and funny.   (Though I was disappointed he failed to note that the first year of CCIW Pickems, I won the conference games portion of the contest! )

And, Greg, being nice to Mr. Y on PP Deadline Day means 'send him a ballot'!!

[oldknight]

I guess I read the boards with posters in mind

Greg Sager = North Park perspective and resident novelist, also historian  (sadly dark and depressing for most of the decade, rootin' for ya Greg)

TitanQ = only one shade of green really, in a former life i'm convinced Q was an excellent stock pumper, still quality observations from Nebraska which is not in the CCIW

any Wheaton poster =  lots of good Wheaton representation without the dancing post-game celebrations to rub it in

AndOne =  the North Central perspective,  no van or bus jokes please

Mr Ypsi =  the never seen a game I couldn't  place odds on without having seen a CCIW game in 40 years perspective

Knighslappy =  the Calvin perspective with some actual fact based rationality

Oldknight  =  years and years and years of quality basketball viewing experience, also years of experience. Wow; this guy is really old--older in fact, than them Knollcrest hills over yonder.

any Wooster poster =  the refs sucked and they were against Wooster all night but we still managed to dominate the conference we've been dominating for a decade somehow

There; I corrected sac's politically correct summary so it now says what he really meant to say.

[Gregory Sager]

Well, as long as we're correcting sac's politically correct summary to reflect what he really meant to say ...

I guess I read the boards with posters in mind

Greg Sager = North Park perspective and resident novelist and unrepentant culprit behind the longest, most eye-glazing posts in all of d3boards.com, also historian  (sadly dark and depressing for most of the decade, rootin' for ya Greg)

TitanQ = only one shade of green really, in a former life i'm convinced Q was an excellent stock pumper, still quality observations from Nebraska which is not in the CCIW

any Wheaton poster =  lots of good Wheaton representation without the dancing post-game celebrations to rub it in

AndOne =  the North Central perspective,  no van or bus jokes please

Mr Ypsi =  the never seen a game I couldn't  place odds on without having seen a CCIW game in 40 years perspective

Knighslappy =  the Calvin perspective with some actual fact based rationality

Oldknight  =  years and years and years of quality basketball viewing experience, also years of experience. Wow; this guy is really old--older in fact, than them Knollcrest hills over yonder.

any Wooster poster =  the refs sucked and they were against Wooster all night but we still managed to dominate the conference we've been dominating for a decade somehow

[D-3 watcher]

Well no word from any NCC insiders about who's suiting up and who's not. Trying to keep IWU guessing? Coaches orders??
I'm thinking coach Rose is preparing his boys for the full team. Which, when healthily is more than a handful.
Not sure which team needs the win most. Sure NCC needs to win, so not to go down 2 games down. But IWU needs to win just to prove to themselves that they can beat NCC, something they couldn't do last year. Lose this game at home, and the path to the conference title is a lot tougher.
Even though this is a different year, there is a lot of returning players on both sides, so there has to be some memories of last years games.
Either way this game won't determine the conference title, as a lot of games remain, but it will have a big say as to who has the upper hand.