Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 20, 2007, 11:46:13 PM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 20, 2007, 03:18:51 PM
Let me explain it for you, never said you interering,  re-read the post it says "seems". Unfortunately you took this as some kind of personal attack.

No, I didn't. I haven't taken anything personally in this conversation. I can assure you that my attitude is completely dispassionate regarding your insinuations about my reply to TAA.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 20, 2007, 03:18:51 PM
Refer to above. Apparently obscurity comes from the inability to fully read and understand.

No, obscurity comes from the inability to get one's point across with clarity. It's a "sender" word, not a "receiver" word.

I can assure you that as someone who has made his living as a professional writer and editor I can fully read and understand the written word quite well, thank you. Writing is a two-step means of communication; it requires a writer to convey information properly in order for the reader to have any chance at all to interpret the information properly. The primary burden to make yourself understood, therefore, is upon you as the writer. That is why I asked you to reiterate whatever it was that your second point was supposed to be.

Here's a helpful hint regarding getting your meaning across to a reader: When someone asks you to reiterate a point, simply go ahead and honor the request rather than insult him.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 20, 2007, 03:18:51 PMas for the terse nature in your last post, I can only speculate where that comes from.

Why would you wish to speculate about that? My brevity carried with it no ulterior meaning. Contrary to popular belief on d3sports.com, I can actually write a short post when the situation calls for one.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 20, 2007, 03:18:51 PMThis is a forum right? You stated your opinion on how to handle TAA post. I stated a different opinion on TAA and why 2007 could not get an answer to his question. As i have previously stated you appear to be long time contributor to these boards. I would have expected a different  approach and attitude from and "elder statesman"of this and many other boards contained here.

This is a digression on my part from what is essentially your recap of this conversation, but I must add at this point that my position vis-a-vis ignoring trolls, as Pat and others proceeded to demonstrate, is not only a standard approach and attitude on these message boards and on the Internet in general (both among "elder statesmen" and not-so-elder statesmen) but is a commonplace within society as well.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 20, 2007, 03:18:51 PMapparently you missed my attempt to diffuse the situation in the above post. sorry, I gues the smiley faces were too subtle again.

Again, you failed to adequately convey your meaning. I had no idea from your 8/20 12:18 am reply -- "If you read my original post, it said to squelch a response to augies reply [sic] sounded like censorship, I guess I was too subtle also  " -- that you were attempting to defuse the situation. To me it appeared that you were lobbing a pair of veiled insults my way, one in implying that I hadn't read your original post properly before responding and another in attaching an eye-roll smiley to the words, "I guess I was too subtle also". An eye-roll smiley in that context is not an attempt to defuse the situation, in my estimation. It's an attempt to imply that the reader (me) is so thick that explaining oneself requires excessive patience and forbearance.

Smileys don't always connote innocence or light-heartedness. They're semiotic devices that are used as substitutes for the facial aspect of conversational discourse that gets lost when the written word is left by itself. And eye-rolling is by no means a disarming or even neutral gesture in every given conversation. In certain contexts, an eye-roll smiley can be a quite haughty response to someone (especially following a declaration that one's subtlety -- one's cleverness, in other words -- is beyond the ability of the reader to grasp), just as a real-life eye-roll can be. Believe me, I speak from firsthand experience on the matter of sending condescending eye-roll smileys on d3sports.com message boards. Your subsequent gibe about my "inability to fully read and understand" bears out my interpretation of your eye-roll smiley post.

In other words, while you may have thought that you were defusing the situation, instead you were coming across as being condescending towards me. Again, this is not a matter of subtlety. It's a matter of properly conveying one's intent and meaning in the written word.

Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 20, 2007, 12:42:52 AM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 19, 2007, 08:27:51 PMApparently still too subtle for some. Dr. while you addresd one of my points there is stil one left.

I have no idea what you are talking about. I addressed the only point that I see in your posts, which was that I was somehow interfering with this room's freedom of speech.

Let me explain it for you, never said you interering,  re-read the post it says "seems". Unfortunately you took this as some kind of personal attack.

Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 20, 2007, 12:42:52 AMIf you have another point to make, then by all means come out and make it. There's a difference between subtlety and obscurity, you know.

Refer to above. Apparently obscurity comes from the inability to fully read and understand.

Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 20, 2007, 12:42:52 AM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 19, 2007, 08:27:51 PMApparently still too subtle for some. Dr. while you addresd one of my points there is stil one left.

I have no idea what you are talking about. I addressed the only point that I see in your posts, which was that I was somehow interfering with this room's freedom of speech.

If you have another point to make, then by all means come out and make it. There's a difference between subtlety and obscurity, you know.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 19, 2007, 12:18:40 AMNo matter, if you read what I have posted I am all for a civil and respectful room.

Good. Nobody's said otherwise.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 19, 2007, 12:18:40 AMwhat kind of doctor are you? medical, PHD?

I'm not a doctor of anything. Pat was kidding around.

as for the terse nature in your last post, I can only speculate where that comes from. This is a forum right? You stated your opinion on how to handle TAA post. I stated a different opinion on TAA and why 2007 could not get an answer to his question. As i have previously stated you appear to be long time contributor to these boards. I would have expected a different  approach and attitude from and "elder statesman"of this and many other boards contained here.

apparently you missed my attempt to diffuse the situation in the above post. sorry, I gues the smiley faces were too subtle again.

(This post was edited by GS for formatting purposes)

Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 19, 2007, 06:20:32 PM

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on August 18, 2007, 11:26:41 PM
Apparently the point Greg was making was too subtle for some.  When a poster posts only to get a rise out of people (pretty clearly the intent of TAA), the most effective response is to not give them the satisfaction.  Ignoring a troll is hardly the same as 'censorship'!

BTW, as a Hall of Famer, Greg had the power to simply delete the post, which he did not do.  THAT would border on censorship (though it is not really the same thing), but he simply suggested the reasonable course for discouraging those who get their jollies by 'drive-by provocations'.

Exactly. Thanks, Chuck.

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 19, 2007, 12:18:40 AMIf you read my original post, it said to squelch a response to augies post sounded like censorship, i guess i was too subtle also I also did not know HOF had the ability to delete posts. I will admit I did miss the subtlness in augie's post.

Nobody ever said anything about squelching responses except for you, Titanwatcher. I didn't use my HOF editing power and I left TAA's post intact because I don't believe in suppressing other people's voices, obnoxious though they may be. Nor did I "squelch a response" by editing NCC_alum62's and football2007's replies to TAA, either. What I asked people to do was to ignore a poster whose intentions were clearly malicious. There's a difference between suppressing legitimate debate and ignoring a mean-spirited provocateur whose intentions in posting are to destroy a room's civility and goad other people into losing their temper.

You seem to be assuming that there was some sort of an attempt made by TAA to make a statement worth either supporting or refuting. But he made no such attempt at all. He was simply trying, as Chuck said, to get a rise out of people by insulting various coaches and programs. And that's not worthy of a response by anyone. If you respond to a troll, you only encourage him to hang around and spew forth more nastiness and ruin the tone of your message board. As footballfan413's mom said, it's no fun to throw a fit if nobody is watching or listening. If you ignore him, he'll tire of the game and take his drive-by provocations with him and scuttle back into his hole.

Apparently still too subtle for some. Dr. while you addresd one of my points there is stil one left. No matter, if you read what I have posted I am all for a civil and respectful room. what kind of doctor are you? medical, PHD?

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on August 18, 2007, 11:26:41 PM
Apparently the point Greg was making was too subtle for some.  When a poster posts only to get a rise out of people (pretty clearly the intent of TAA), the most effective response is to not give them the satisfaction.  Ignoring a troll is hardly the same as 'censorship'!

BTW, as a Hall of Famer, Greg had the power to simply delete the post, which he did not do.  THAT would border on censorship (though it is not really the same thing), but he simply suggested the reasonable course for discouraging those who get their jollies by 'drive-by provocations'.

If you read my original post, it said to squelch a response to augies post sounded like censorship, i guess i was too subtle also I also did not know HOF had the ability to delete posts. I will admit I did miss the subtlness in augie's post.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on August 18, 2007, 07:54:11 PM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 18, 2007, 05:35:20 PM
Let the forum decide if it a reponsible statement.

I think Dr. Sager was offering his advice, that's all. Hard to argue with it, though.

As was I. Dr. Sager has been on this board for quite sometime judging from his post totals. I think if this is a false statement , it should be adressed, not ignored.I know of at least 3 Carthage people who post here that are more than qualified to respond to this. I am merely stating that to leave what Dr. Sager perceives as a false statement, that is what i took from it, would be a huge error. "a half truth is like a half brick, it goes twice as far and does the same amount of damage."

Quote from: TrueAugieAlum on August 18, 2007, 11:19:19 AM
Been watching the Augustana practices.  With new coaches was hoping to see something different, but appears to be same old, same old.  HEY CCIW - Augie is going to be running options!!
Hopefully, Augie will sqeek in under the new TRI-CHAMPION standings that was instituted last year.  Apparently, CCIW has created a "feel good" atmoshere so that no coaches have a hissy fit.  Would not want Coach Barnes to actually have to recruit using his REAL record.
Oh well, look for Augie to run, NC to pass, Carthage to play dirty, Milliken to get beat up, Wheaton to act like the CUBS, Elmhurst to be a no show, Ill Wesleyan to be the patsy team.  Isn't there one more that seems to elude me.

augie, how do you have more negative karma points then posts? also as far as " not feeding the troll" to squelch a reponse to augies post sounds like censorship to me. there is a question on the board, why not answer it. Are  we not unable to discern the difference between fact and opinion and decide for ourselves? Could this statement be based on augie's experience with carthage? i don't know but I would rather hear a response and decide for myself, then start squelching thoughts based on wether they hurt some one's feelings or they make us uncomfortable. Freedom of speech is a responsibility before it is a right. Let the forum decide if it a reponsible statement.

Quote from: Mugsy on August 13, 2007, 09:34:05 PM

Quote from: CardinalAlum on August 13, 2007, 08:59:11 PM

Quote from: Mugsy on August 13, 2007, 07:50:48 PM

Let's see... to make 6'4 that would taken standing on about 3-4 phone books, beyond the typical inflation of 1 inch to actual player heights.

To make 220 lbs, it would have taken around 5 of the 5lb ankle weights (attached via velcro) that were popular with the "power walkers" back in the late 70's or early 80's.

Please tell me you aren't going to "power walk" the marathon in your Richard Simmons suit and headband!

LOL.  What a scary image!

I don't plan on it... though the furthest I've run in my training to this point is 17 miles and I was significantly wiped-out.  I may need to revisit my goals and switch from finishing in 3 hours and 45 minutes to making sure I don't lose control of my bowels (like some in the Iron Man triathlons and like many, many stories I've heard about 1st trip marathoners).   

I wish you all the luck in the world Mugsy, but the last two posts were way to graphic for me

Quote from: midwestfb on August 11, 2007, 11:41:38 AM

Quote from: washdupcard on August 10, 2007, 01:07:11 PM
USee remember the days when we used to disagree?  Ahhhh...memories.

Was that yesterday?


JustWatch33 may set a record for the quickest to three digit negative karma ...

Careful, you could be  giving him another reason to brag

Quote from: Mugsy on August 08, 2007, 06:27:36 PM

Quote from: JUSTWATCH33 on August 08, 2007, 03:32:18 AM
NPU will be turning a lot of heads this year. They have a bunch of quilty players coming in to camp this year. I know a few of the guys and they are some pretty good players. In fact i could be suiting up in those new Viking uni's this fall . Middle Linebacker from College of Dupage Ramon Lacey 8). Just Watch #33 its looking like a good fit.

Are we sure this isn't someone from the IBC board? 

could'nt be, this guy has too much humility and there is no dig at McMurray in his post 

Quote from: Mugsy on August 02, 2007, 11:18:33 AM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 02, 2007, 10:39:26 AM
rooney played at fenwick,  Chicago Catholic league,like his father. Was an all state selection and has been starting QB for three years there. Go to the IWU record website, his father holds many of the school records for passing. I think Mugsy played against the father.

Rooney finished one year before I arrived at Wheaton.  I played primarily against Doug Moews and Brad Forsyth when we played IWU, though we faced 3 different QB's my senior year as Brad Forsyth and the 2nd string QB blew their knees out on consecutive series. 

If I recall correctly Forsyth's knee injury was particularly gruesome.  Chad Thorson and Thane Ritchie arrived at the QB at the same time.  Chad had him wrap up high and Thane was down around the knees due to being partially blocked by the RB.  They twisted in opposite directions and I'm sure the pop could be heard at least to both sidelines, if not into the stands.  The trainers were on the field immediately.  I believe it was a dislocated patella (knee cap) along with several torn ligaments.

That is a major reason why you will not find 1988 in the IWU record books for passing yards in a season by a QB.

I sit corrected

Quote from: FormerCard on August 02, 2007, 10:02:37 AM

Quote from: Titanwatcher on August 01, 2007, 12:00:16 PM

Quote from: FormerCard on August 01, 2007, 11:43:46 AM
Allright,

Lets talk some football ladies and gentlemen   

Who are the new freshman to look at coming in??   Anyone that is going to make an immediate impact?

Will Augie begin passing more so they can score with NC or just get shutout in the biggest game of the year again?

Why does it seem Elmhurst can never make it over the hump?  is it the coaching or the lack of effort from players when it counts?

Is Studebaker going to break 17 1/2 sacks this year?

How many picks will ittersagen have?

Is Sulo going to rush for 1500 yards?

What the heck was the running back from St. Johns thinking?  Who cares how cute she is?  She just became a teenager a few months ago!

It will be interesting to see if the Rooney kid can break the line up in Bloomington. If he is anything like his Dad he could  have a significant impact. I understand that he is very fast also, in the 4.5 range. From a personal  view, carthage got a kid named rowland from Willowbrook. I loved watching this kid play. All heart, just don't know where he will fit in up there. I saw him will his team to victory with a big play on defense followed up with a hard run for the winning touchdown. Fun kid to watch.
can't comment on Elmhurst, have not seen enough, but unless evvery team uses Orlando Pace at LT, 20 looks like a good number for Studebaker. If Kniss2 is as good as his brother i cant see Sulo going that high, but close. Asfor the kid from St John's .........

Where is the rooney kid from and what was his old mans history like?  If this was already posted, i apologize. 

If teams are smart, they will bring a back out of the backfield to assist in blocking Studebaker, maybe even a wing/tight end in motion to delay for a second (block) and then be a safety valve.

rooney played at fenwick,  Chicago Catholic league,like his father. Was an all state selection and has been starting QB for three years there. Go to the IWU record website, his father holds many of the school records for passing. I think Mugsy played against the father.

Quote from: FormerCard on August 01, 2007, 11:43:46 AM
Allright,

Lets talk some football ladies and gentlemen   

Who are the new freshman to look at coming in??   Anyone that is going to make an immediate impact?

Will Augie begin passing more so they can score with NC or just get shutout in the biggest game of the year again?

Why does it seem Elmhurst can never make it over the hump?  is it the coaching or the lack of effort from players when it counts?

Is Studebaker going to break 17 1/2 sacks this year?

How many picks will ittersagen have?

Is Sulo going to rush for 1500 yards?

What the heck was the running back from St. Johns thinking?  Who cares how cute she is?  She just became a teenager a few months ago!

It will be interesting to see if the Rooney kid can break the line up in Bloomington. If he is anything like his Dad he could  have a significant impact. I understand that he is very fast also, in the 4.5 range. From a personal  view, carthage got a kid named rowland from Willowbrook. I loved watching this kid play. All heart, just don't know where he will fit in up there. I saw him will his team to victory with a big play on defense followed up with a hard run for the winning touchdown. Fun kid to watch.
can't comment on Elmhurst, have not seen enough, but unless evvery team uses Orlando Pace at LT, 20 looks like a good number for Studebaker. If Kniss2 is as good as his brother i cant see Sulo going that high, but close. Asfor the kid from St John's .........

Quote from: football2007 on July 30, 2007, 01:59:53 PM

Quote from: thunderdog on July 30, 2007, 11:22:11 AM
New Tradition or whoever would like to contribute:

How does the NAIA compare to D3?  I've always been under the assumption that the top d3 teams a far ahead of the top NAIA teams... would you, or would most people agree with that?

I was unaware that Olivet is a NAIA powerhouse.  If so, how long have they been so?  And who are other NAIA powerhouses?

NAIA schools that my son was recruited by thought they were more comparable to D2.  Really have no experience myself

there were stats on here last fall showing how D3 did against NAIA the final numbers. I think 2 schools from the WIAC traveled West and did very well, but I do not recall the final tally of D3 against NAIA, but I do seem to recall a D3 school beating a D1-AA

Quote from: thunderdog on July 30, 2007, 11:22:11 AM
New Tradition or whoever would like to contribute:

How does the NAIA compare to D3?  I've always been under the assumption that the top d3 teams a far ahead of the top NAIA teams... would you, or would most people agree with that?

I was unaware that Olivet is a NAIA powerhouse.  If so, how long have they been so?  And who are other NAIA powerhouses?

St Francis of Indiana, Carroll from Montana I believe, St Xavier on the south side of Chicago, just to name a few.

Quote from: neweraibfc on July 28, 2007, 08:56:24 PM
now that you guys are done making out...can we get back to football?

This is why this is one of the funniest boards on here