mr b - any word on today's game against Denison?

Quote from: tjcummingsfan on January 29, 2008, 09:50:21 AM
You're right Q, all of your whining the opposite way is much more mature than all the Viking fans... com on man,.  I've been done for days, you keep egging things on.

What's amazing to me is that everyone wants this conversation to be OVER but only after they get in their opinion. 

Q, don't think that we were ecstatic with how NP played Saturday night.  I think our fans would be some of the first to admit that we'd prefer not having to be in a tight-game situation like we were in.  However, that's not how it works all the time.    Sometimes, you have to win ugly.  The fact is, without the blatantly terrible call, NP would be sitting at 3-3 right now in conference rather than 2-4.  It doesn't matter how great they played or how poor they played the other 39 minutes of the game, without the terrible call by the terrible ref, NP would have won.  That's what we're frustrated with. Sure, we'd love for our team to win every game by 20 but to actually expect every game to not even be a contest, that's just naive.  So don't pretend like it didn't come down to the last play (determined unfortunately by the terrible ref), because it did.  Ideally, it never would come down to that, but at times it does.

Quote from: aceon2 on January 28, 2008, 02:21:14 PM

Seriously, its been two and a half days... Everyone knows that their was a questionable call at the end of the North Park/IWU game!  I'm also sure that there have been questionable calls at the end of just about every basketball game ever played.  Enough about it...

But today was my first day back on the www since the debacle... 

Quote from: Titan Q on January 28, 2008, 01:08:39 PM

Quote from: Scream on January 28, 2008, 12:43:28 PM

Quote from: knarocky22 on January 28, 2008, 10:25:33 AM
Is it possible that the "sub-par" officiating is simply being noticed more this season because the CCIW is more competitive top-to-bottom this year and the majority of the games are going down to the wire?

I don't think anyone would disagree that bad officiating is more glaring when the game is close.  Isn't that just all the more reason to have better refs?  Some of you guys border on ridiculous as you try to quiet us NP fans upset over a legitimately terrible call which directly took a W away from us and gave it to IWU.  I don't care to whom your allegiance lies, you can't deny that Park had the game won (as Nick buried the clutch j) and it was taken from us.  Yes, we'll move on but allow us to do that in our own time. 

Any thoughts on the first 39 minutes and 52 seconds?  Any North Park accountability for the loss during that small stretch of the contest?

Newsflash!! 
It's the score at the end of the game that matters. 

I'm not saying the first 39 minutes don't matter (that's why we all enjoy watching games and not just highlights) but if you have put yourself in position to tie or win the game with your last possession, you've almost nullified the previous 39 minutes.  Also, why do you keep saying 39 minutes and 52 seconds?  What was the score at halftime again? Hyperbole.

Quote from: knarocky22 on January 28, 2008, 10:25:33 AM
Is it possible that the "sub-par" officiating is simply being noticed more this season because the CCIW is more competitive top-to-bottom this year and the majority of the games are going down to the wire?

I don't think anyone would disagree that bad officiating is more glaring when the game is close.  Isn't that just all the more reason to have better refs?  Some of you guys border on ridiculous as you try to quiet us NP fans upset over a legitimately terrible call which directly took a W away from us and gave it to IWU.  I don't care to whom your allegiance lies, you can't deny that Park had the game won (as Nick buried the clutch j) and it was taken from us.  Yes, we'll move on but allow us to do that in our own time. 

Quote from: tjcummingsfan on January 24, 2008, 12:02:05 AM

Quote from: Naperick on January 23, 2008, 10:58:30 PM
Elmhurst   66
North Park 39
     'Jays led 28-18 at the half

It was horrible to watch.  NP couldn't hit a shot, lay-up or jumper to save their lives, I definitely am not looking forward to seeing the fg % from this one. 

Bright spots... defense for the most part, intensity on that end of the floor for probably 35 minutes of the game was really great... watching Burks miss 2 freethrows, I can't imagine anyone'll see that again anytime soon... the look in Jay Alexander's eyes, especially in the 2nd half, he was never ready to give this game up, and I loved that, he had some great blocks, and almost dunked over one of the reserve guards, but he decided to lay it in instead... defense on Ruch, I think he ended up with only 15 (definitely under 20)... any more Greg, Scream, Rob, Mr B?

Dim spots... shooting, it was abysmal... offense against the zone, we may as well have not had guys on the court at some points... Elmhurst's shooting, again, don't want to see the percentages... rebounding, on both ends of the floor (with the possible exception of Jay Alexander), we were 1 and done (to quote Rob Berki) all night on the offensive end, and got smoked even on the defensive end far too often...

we'll have to play a heck of alot better to beat an undoubtedly fired up IWU team who just knocked off Wheaton

How does the team respond?  There are a whole lot of possibilities; giving up, forgetting about the bad night, studying the game film of the bad night and dissecting the mistakes, justifying that their three conference losses are all to nationally ranked teams, etc. 

Something tells me these guys (all of them included) won't allow another debacle like this.  When a team beats you by almost 30 points and they put in their entire jv squad with 4 minutes left, there's not many excuses you can make, especially (as Greg said) considering Elmhurst didn't play their best game.

Quote from: 79jaybird on January 23, 2008, 11:38:59 AM
Greg, I am worried about tonight's game (from an Elmhurst view). We both know North Park had us dead to rights last year on their home floor beating EC for most of the game with hustle, penetration, and a greater "hunger" to win.
I think the real key is going to be the first 5-10 minutes of the game.  Will Elmhurst be able to match the hustle and intensity of North Park? 
I think Elmhurst will get their points inside with Ruch and Hintzsche,  but the real key is going to be the perimeter and if Elmhurst can keep up with NPU's speedsters. 

I'm excited to see how it unfolds. 

Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 21, 2008, 11:15:43 PM

Quote from: usee on January 21, 2008, 10:57:46 AM

Quote from: Scream on January 21, 2008, 09:17:12 AM

Quote from: usee on January 20, 2008, 11:41:20 PM

Quote from: Titan Q on January 20, 2008, 10:17:44 PM

Quote from: Scream on January 20, 2008, 09:01:40 PM
Was I the only one in King Arena that heard the wheatie coach rip #21 a new butt hole? The biggest beef I had (sitting front row, I heard it loud and clear) with his screaming, shrieking approach was that he never actually told the poor kid what he did wrong. He just repeated at least a half dozen times how stupid the kid was.  That's pretty classless.

This is the first time I've ever heard Bill Harris called "classless."

If Bill Harris is classless then guys like Bosko and Giavonni must be Satan. That's one of the more ridiculous things I've seen on here.

Its also the first time I have heard a coach labeled as "classless" for coaching his players.

Here's the deal: yelling at a player without telling them why you're yelling is not coaching.  For the record, I don't know enough about Harris to call him classless, I just think that particular situation was pretty sad and definitely lacking class.

Well, you did call him classless so I guess we accept your apology.

Also, I think you should know enough about coaching to know that during the battle (read: game) is not always the time to stop and correct a player. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. typically a coach chooses when to teach his players and just like a professor won't stop you in the middle of a midterm exam and explain why you missed a question, a coach may not stop in the middle of a game to explain what you did wrong. Be assured, however, that player was instructed at some point what he did wrong. You can't take one incident out of context and label a coach "classless". that's pretty weak.

What typically happens in this situation is that a head coach might yell at a player as he comes off of the floor but then, as usee said, he'll turn back quickly to the business at hand of running his team; meanwhile, an assistant coach will then take the offending player aside and go over in detail what he did wrong. I didn't see the play that you described, Scream, but my guess is that after Bill Harris finished yelling at Jeremy Berntsen and turned his attention back to the game, either Nate Frank or Owen Handy took Berntsen aside and explained to him what he had done wrong.

That's not a classless act; it's simply the way that most coaching staffs handle instructing their players in the heat of the moment when the players return to the bench.

Greg, I don't have a problem with what you described but that wasn't what happened.  #21 didn't come out of the game, he was at the other end of the floor and after a foul was called on Wheaton leading to foul shots for Park, Harris yelled at him to come over and proceeded to hurl yelling insults.  There was no coaching or correcting done by him or an asst coach.

It just rubbed me the wrong way as a fan of collegiate sports, a former athlete, and as someone who has coached.  I never imagined that my "rant" would go on for half a dozen pages, I just wanted to discuss it and voice my discomfort with the situation. 

Let's get back to "basketball."

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 21, 2008, 04:49:41 PM
The reactions would suggest otherwise.

This is true.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 21, 2008, 04:41:50 PM
Well, guess that's a good example of why it's important to be precise with your use of the language. You used the word classless in your post and if you meant for it to be termed as "a classless act" then you should have specified that originally.

When I said, "That's pretty classless" at the end of my remark, what do you think the word, "that" is referring to?  If I meant to call Coach Harris classless, I probably would have used another word, like... I dunno... maybe... "He" as in, "He's pretty classless."

Seems pretty clear.

Quote from: Scream on January 20, 2008, 09:01:40 PM
Was I the only one in King Arena that heard the wheatie coach rip #21 a new butt hole? The biggest beef I had (sitting front row, I heard it loud and clear) with his screaming, shrieking approach was that he never actually told the poor kid what he did wrong. He just repeated at least a half dozen times how stupid the kid was.  That's pretty classless.

Just for the sake of clarity and my withering internet reputation, I wanted to quote myself and prove that nowhere did I say Coach Harris is classless.  I'm the first to admit that I may be the least informed poster on this site so I won't go around calling proven coaches names.  I do however completely disagree with his method of coaching in that particular situation.  I find it pretty repulsive.  I was probably sitting within 8-10 feet of the interaction and I'm confident in what I heard.  He very well may be a fantastic coach with an impeccable reputation (and who am I to tarnish that?) but I simply wanted to point out that I wasn't cool with that situation.  That's all.  Go ahead and continue smiting me for providing an opinion on a message board. 

Quote from: usee on January 20, 2008, 11:41:20 PM

Quote from: Titan Q on January 20, 2008, 10:17:44 PM

Quote from: Scream on January 20, 2008, 09:01:40 PM
Was I the only one in King Arena that heard the wheatie coach rip #21 a new butt hole? The biggest beef I had (sitting front row, I heard it loud and clear) with his screaming, shrieking approach was that he never actually told the poor kid what he did wrong. He just repeated at least a half dozen times how stupid the kid was.  That's pretty classless.

This is the first time I've ever heard Bill Harris called "classless."

If Bill Harris is classless then guys like Bosko and Giavonni must be Satan. That's one of the more ridiculous things I've seen on here.

Its also the first time I have heard a coach labeled as "classless" for coaching his players.

Here's the deal: yelling at a player without telling them why you're yelling is not coaching.  For the record, I don't know enough about Harris to call him classless, I just think that particular situation was pretty sad and definitely lacking class.

Was I the only one in King Arena that heard the wheatie coach rip #21 a new butt hole? The biggest beef I had (sitting front row, I heard it loud and clear) with his screaming, shrieking approach was that he never actually told the poor kid what he did wrong. He just repeated at least a half dozen times how stupid the kid was.  That's pretty classless.

Honest question, are there any Wheaties on the board that would care to share their thoughts on the situation regarding our Crazies?  I'm certainly not saying that the ejection of NP fans affected the outcome of the contest, but it really was pretty disgusting to kick college student out into the cold for not really doing anything wrong.  The only thing I could think was that the Host team was just embarrassed about being out-fanned in their home arena.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 10, 2008, 12:32:01 PM
I think the gym was kind of dark and the gold didn't pop as much as it should have.

My guess too.