Quote from: spikegrouchy on November 12, 2008, 09:20:01 AM

Westminster's(PA) most common opponent is Geneva as the two teams meet Saturday for the 111th time...

The Westminster-Geneva rivalry began in 1891 when Geneva beat WC, 42-0.  Although Westminster leads the series, Geneva has won four out of the last five contests.  This year's game should be an exciting conclusion to the season.

Final score:  Geneva 29, Westminster(PA) 26.  A good game for Golden Tornado fans.  WC gave up too many big plays, but they had their chances...just couldn't keep their drives going in the second half.  Oh well, there is always next year!

Westminster's(PA) most common opponent is Geneva as the two teams meet Saturday for the 111th time. Westminster leads the series 61-41-8. The two teams were archrivals back when they were NAIA teams but Westminster left for the NCAA in 1998 and Geneva followed last year. This rivalry game will be the final game of both teams' regular seasons for future games, as designed by the PAC's new rivarly game schedule.

The Presidents' Athletic Conference (PAC) has announced the debut of "PAC Football Rivalry Week," beginning in the 2008 regular season. The conference rivalry games have been moved to the final weekend of the regular season (Saturday, November 15 in 2008), where they will remain for the foreseeable future.

"One of the great features about PAC football is the number of long-standing traditions and rivalries
between our member institutions, with several dating back over 100 years," said PAC Executive Director
Joe Onderko. "Highlighting these games with a permanent spot on the final weekend will help build even
greater excitement on each PAC campus as the football season progresses."

The Westminster-Geneva rivalry began in 1891 when Geneva beat WC, 42-0.  Although Westminster leads the series, Geneva has won four out of the last five contests.  This year's game should be an exciting conclusion to the season.

Quote from: the_burghboy on November 01, 2008, 04:18:05 PM
Congrats to Thomas More, who clearly outplayed and out coached W&J this afternoon.

Ditto...

I'm just wondering what you Mount Union guys do at the football games since the game is over by the first quarter?  Do you bring some good reading material or what?

Forgive me, but don't you guys get bored?

I was at the Westminster-Bethany game today.  Westminster did not call a "fourth" time out after the pass to Gubish for 19 yards.  WC had already used all their TO's by then.  Bethany called the time out.

That pass play resulted in a first down so the clock was stopped.  As the referee was setting the ball in play, a Westminster player was trying to get off the field before the clock was started (with 6 seconds left on the clock).  He didn't make it, so a five-yard penalty was called for illegal substitution.    Franz spiked the ball with 1.9 seconds to play.  Bethany then called their last time out.   Freshman Trevor Young kicked his first career field goal of 44 yards to win the game as time ran out.

Quote from: the_burghboy on October 13, 2008, 11:33:12 PM

Well, I would say you type pretty well for a two year old.  W&J made it past the first round in 2006, and past the second round in 2004.

Thanks the_burghboy, I really appreciate your "positive" comment. 

But you are right about W & J making it past the second round in 2004 (and lost at home by 38 points!).  But let's go back to 2000 and list the PAC champions and how they fared...

2000  W & J lost in the first round to Bridgewater 59-42
2001  W & J lost in the second round to Widener 46-30
2002  W & J lost in the second round to Trinity 45-10
2003  Waynesburg lost in the first round to Bridgewater 28-24
2004  W & J lost in the third round to MHB 52-14.
2005  Thiel lost in the second round to Bridgewater 24-13
2006  W & J lost in the second round to MHB 30-27
2007  W & J lost in the first round to NC-Wesleyan 35-34

Also other PAC playoff teams over the past few years...

2005 W & J lost in the first round to Bridgewater 30-21
2007 Waynesburg lost to Dickinson in the ECAC SE Bowl 16-10
2007 Geneva lost to Malone College in the NCCAA Victory Bowl 45-17

That's eleven teams from the PAC over the past eight years.  Six lost their first playoff game.  Again, all I was trying to say is that I would like to see a PAC team make it to the semifinals or beyond.

Quote from: South Willy on October 13, 2008, 10:49:29 AM

Spikegrouchy...I wouldn't worry much about next week. Bison "D" couldn't stop a good high school offense. I will say if both teams play as they have, I'd take the "over" even if it's a 100.

Well the way Westminster turns the ball over, even a high school team could beat them!  They had a bunch of turnovers last year in a loss to the Bison.

I am hoping that in the future the PAC will become more competitive with other conferences.  I don't know what the problem is.  I always thought that western PA was a "hotbed" for football talent.  Surely not everyone is going to Division 1 or 2 (or even worse...Mt. Union), are they?  I would like to see a PAC team make it past the first or second round of the playoffs in my lifetime!

Well my alma mater, Westminster, gave up 63 points to Waynesburg on Saturday.  That is the fourth worst loss in school history.  The previous fourth worst loss was earlier this year at Heidelberg (62-27).  The last time they gave up more points was to Pitt in 1926 (88-0).  That's two games giving up over 60 points and they haven't even played W & J yet!  I dread the score of that game.

I didn't see today's debacle, but I did see the Heidelberg loss.  Even more disheartening is the fact that Heidelberg has lost their last four games.  They lost today to previously winless Ohio Northern 41-0!

I am picking against WC for this Saturday's homecoming game (See my picks on the Pick-ems board.)  I hope that I am wrong and the Titans turn it around.  I will be at that game.  Good luck Titans....

Yeah, your Saints really took it to my alma mater yesterday.  I was able to listen to the second half over the internet.  Westminster doesn't have the speed to play with good teams.  If their offense can't score, the Titans will lose, as they did yesterday.

I think Thomas More has the best chance of unseating W & J, if not this year, maybe next.  Unfortunately for Westminster, I don't see them close to competing for a PAC championship for a long time.  Their progam is going downhill right now. 

By the way, there is a Pick'ems board set up for the PAC now.  It seems that I am the only one posting on it.  I wish that others would post and pick games so I don't feel as though I am talking to myself....

Quote from: Bob.Gregg on September 09, 2008, 09:08:32 AM

Quote from: spikegrouchy on September 07, 2008, 05:57:58 PMHey, am I the only one with picks on this board?

You might be since Pick 'ems are supposed to be on another board...


On another front, the PAC, while competitve inside, appears to be woeful this year, perhaps the worst I've seen in 25 years covering.

Might have to rename to the Pathetic Athletic Conference.

I keep checking for the PAC Pick'ems board and it doesn't seem to be set up yet.  If you know where it is, let me know.


You are right about the "new name" for the PAC.  Last year when W & J was beaten in the playoffs by an unranked team everyone thought it was a fluke.  I didn't.  The PAC schools are no where near being at the top of D3 football.  We can all "think" we are, but in reality that is just not the case.

I emailed the Geneva AD a couple of years ago after they had decided to get out of the NAIA and join NCAA D3.  I said that I hope they made the right decision.  After they lost to NAIA member Malone College by a big margin last year in the NCCAA Victory Bowl game, I wonder if they think that they should have stayed in a scholarship division.

Just as Westminster College has found out, just because you have had success in a scholarship division does not necessarily mean you are going to have success in D3.  

Let's see what happens when the PAC plays the MAC in 2010 & 2011.  Let's see how the PAC stacks up.

Here are my picks for week 2:

September 13

Kentucky Christian over Bethany (First year Knights still beat BC)
Saint Vincent over Gallaudet  (First win for SVC)
Albion over Thiel (TC loses another close game)
Waynesburg over Hanover (Yellow Jackets rebound this week)
Allegheny over Westminster (Titans start 0-2)
Carnegie Mellon over Grove City (Grovers lose big)
Geneva over Salisbury (Geneva's defense pulls this one out)
Washington & Jefferson over Frostburg State (W & J wins big)

Hey, am I the only one with picks on this board?

Oh, I forgot to post the scores...

McDaniel 38, Saint Vincent 7
Dickinson 34, Grove City 7
Wash. & Jeff. 49, Oberlin 35
Marietta 21, Thiel 18
Otterbein 40, Bethany 7
John Carroll 41, Thomas More 14
Heidelberg 62, Westminster 27
Wooster 27, Waynesburg 6
Seton Hill 27, Geneva 18

Quote from: spikegrouchy on August 31, 2008, 08:47:26 AM
O.K. PAC fans out there, here are my picks for the first week of D3 action.

Saturday, September 6

McDaniel over Saint Vincent
Washington & Jefferson over Oberlin
Otterbein over Bethany
Dickinson over Grove City
John Carroll over Thomas More
Marietta over Thiel
Heidelberg over Westminster
Wooster over Waynesburg
Seton Hill over Geneva

Looks like it is going to be a long weekend for PAC teams. 

Of course, I never said I was an expert!

What are your picks...?

Well folks, maybe I AM an expert.  I picked every game!  Wow!

Yeah, it looks like the PAC cannot compete with other conferences at this time.  Even W & J had trouble today.

I saw the Westminster-Heidelberg game in person today.  Heidelberg has a great offense.  They scored on just about every possession in the first half.  Westminster was very slow reacting to the ball.  Their safeties were beaten numerous times for big plays.  And WC had many returning letterman on their defense this year.  Watch out OAC teams for the Student Princes!

Quote from: Ralph Turner on August 31, 2008, 02:05:21 PM
Pat Coleman will set up a separate Pick'ems board for you to keep them separate from other discussions.

That's great!  I see that a lot of other conferences have a Pick'em boards.

O.K. PAC fans out there, here are my picks for the first week of D3 action.

Saturday, September 6

McDaniel over Saint Vincent
Washington & Jefferson over Oberlin
Otterbein over Bethany
Dickinson over Grove City
John Carroll over Thomas More
Marietta over Thiel
Heidelberg over Westminster
Wooster over Waynesburg
Seton Hill over Geneva

Looks like it is going to be a long weekend for PAC teams. 

Of course, I never said I was an expert!

What are your picks...?