Quote from: A Buc Forever on January 06, 2016, 01:29:08 PM

On a different note, I wish there were some Pacific and PLU posters here. Pac might be a bit of a let-down game for both Whits, and they've looked pretty good this year. It wouldn't totally surprise me if PAC knocks off one of the Whits this weekend. PLU is also bringing some heat early this season--what's up with them?

Been watching and reading for some time, but not much to report on from my OR teams.  With all the talk dominating on the Whits, it is pretty boring for an OR fan. 

LF, GF and Will, well, they are pretty boring too, going a combined 11-21 and 0-6 in league.  Enough said.

LC is definitely down, but I am not ready to count them out yet.  They have struggled getting to figure their team out after the loss of key players, but are ready to make some noise.  I see them as a possible challenger for the 4th spot if they can get going soon.

Pac is probably the most improved team in the league this year.  I have only seen them once live and once on the net, but they now have an inside presence (lacking for the last...ever), actually looking to get the ball inside.  Their guards are much more athletic and they are fun to watch. 

LC is down, Pac is unproven, kind of hard to get on here and spar with you guys!

A.    WW - WM tie breaker:  They split, they both swept LC, and they both swept Will.  WW will have lost to UPS  and WM swept, so WM would be 1st, WW 2nd, LC 3rd, and WIL (if they win) 4th because they beat UPS twice.

B.   If UPS wins and Pac wins, UPS gets the 4th spot because they beat WW and Pac did not. 

So,if WM wins and:
UPS wins, Will wins, Will is in (4th).
UPS wins, Pac wins, UPS is in (4th).
UPS loses, Pac vs Will for 4th spot.

My guess is Pac.

The 4th spot in not very attractive, but one of these years, .....

Buc, What?  Pac beat GF last night.  So, the scenario is this.  UPS needs to win 1 of this weekend's games against the Whits.  Win either and they are the 4th seed.  If not, and if Will beats Linf, the game against Pac U and Will on Saturday in Salem is for the 4th seed.  It would be nice for one of these 2 teams to make the playoffs.  Long drought for both of them.  But both need some help from the Whits.

What again?  I am trying to figure out if you are throwing salt in Playball's wounds or just a thousand paper cuts!  Nothing like a fan of a perennial winner "kidding" a struggling program.  Very funny, not! 

Buc, not sure you have that right.  If UPS is swept, Wil splits and PacU sweeps, UPS will be 7-9, Wil 8-8 and PacU 8-8.  I think it will be PacU based on their Whitman victory.  Am I missing something?  Should make for a good Wil-PacU game in Salem.

You are both wrong!

Rat:

It may be dumb, but I think you both have it wrong, and I am further from Sager's side, but I get what he is saying.  You are right they are not the same, but recruiting is more important that coaching.  If Coach K (Duke) is at Linfield (not attacking Linfield, just picking the team in last place) right now, he would not win any more games than Rosenberg.  But give him a couple of years of recruiting, and they might be very good and win league.  That is the value of recruiting.  Get the best players, you win more games.  Period.  A bad coach can hurt a team, but a great can't make all-stars out of below average players.  Ask any coach, would he want the best players or be the best coach, I know what he says.  You should have said "because lets be honest, they have the best players, the best players, the best players, etc. year in and year out".

Greg:

I may be nitpicking, but ...  Coaching and recruiting are separate but both the head coach's job and responsibility, and on his job description.  That doesn't make them the same thing, and the coach wears the different hats at different times.  A coach does not recruit during games or practices, and he does not coach when recruiting young men.

A coach does have several individual jobs as part of his job as "Coach", as you mention, and coaching and recruiting are just two of them.  I believe they are distinctly separate, and recruiting is more important, certainly more than checking a box.

Finally, Coach Ione has done a "COTY" job this year (finally), but it is political and will go to the league champion.

Great points, Greg!

I think you touched on it, but I would also add that, for some schools, 5 or 10 more students would be nice additions to the student body and financial numbers.  It never hurts to have more reason(s) for students to enroll in your school.

Quote from: playball on January 13, 2015, 07:43:41 PM
13 of 18 are listed as underclassmen?  That may play into it but I see 18 guys on a roster as an issue! 

Pacific and Willamette now have JV teams.  I couldn't find any mention of LF having one.  Didn't they used to have one?  Are they ramping up for another one?  Just a thought.  It would be nice to have a JV league in the NWC again.

And when you are struggling, sometimes you go looking for a diamond in the rough.  But I agree.  How do you get enough reps in practice when there are 18 kids going through them?  Have a seat while you are waiting your turn during layups?

Playball:

The Portland Bible loss can't look so bad now that they have also taken down UPS and GF at GF!

Playball:

What are you saying?  It sounds like you are not impressed with the new coach.  Have you seen any of Linfield games? Is Batiuk healthy?  From the stats (I have not seen any of their games, so I may be off base), it looks like they are bringing him back slowly.  His stats are not impressive.  What else is going on?

Wow Buc, what a compliment!  Sounds a lot like "..but she's got a great personality", "...but he sure could recruit".  His last 3 years, they finished 7th, then 8th, then 9th, and you want him back?  Doesn't sound like even average recruiting to me.  Be careful what you wish for!

I would suggest you give this coach a chance for a couple of years until he has all of his own recruits.  He was not left with much returning talent and is in only his 2nd year!

BTW, it is nice to see you back, Playball!

Black...

Well said!  I especially like the part about resting on laurels, except...that sounds like they are doing it on purpose.  It takes a tremendous effort to get any talented kids into a NWC school.  And a lotta luck!  You can do it all right and come up with average and do little right and come up with aces. 

Gaillard had the benefit of a massive recruiting effort that few other coaches performed, at the time.  Bridgeland learned that at his time at LC and probably outworked Gaillard, no small feat.  Hayford raised it to a new level and had some locational and financial advantages.  They were able to pool the talent.  It seemed like a lot of coaches and programs were happy to make the league playoff, and contending for the title was not in their sights. 

Then the rest of the league started catching up.  Now we have a pretty talented group of coaches!  Logie and Bridgeland are proven, Lunt is getting there, Cleary is moving to the top, I like what Hamilton is doing at Fox (too early to tell for sure), and I think Rosenberg will establish himself at Linfield. 

The options for the players are now wider (all schools are good academically, now good coaches, programs, etc), the above average to great kids are more dispersed, and average players that have been enrolled too many times to fill in the numbers, will no longer be needed.  And maybe, just maybe, the NWC teams are looking more attractive to the recruits. 

I now see coaches/programs who no longer appear satisfied to finish in the top half of the league or just to make the league playoff.  They are coming after the title!  This is good news for the league's reputation!

And the roster for PacU is out and Brakebush is on it.  Nice to have both of these great players back!

Let's get this party rolling!!!

What's new for your teams?

No big news for the OR teams that I can get. 

George Fox lost a lot, but still have a lot coming back. 
Linfield hasn't posted anything except hiring a former LC player as an assistant coach.  Is Batuik coming back this year?  That would sure help. 
Willamette has a big coming in and 6 others, but will still face a big challenge moving out of the lower tier of the league. But I like the looks of several of the new kids.
I heard LC lost 3 seniors and 4 others, but pulled in 5 new including 3 juniors (JC's?).  Looks like a rebuilding year to me.
Heard PacU had a good recruiting year and may be ready for a playoff spot.  Is Brakebush back this year?

Still feels like the power teams are up North(east)!  What do you guys have on the WA schools? 

I think (with some inside info) that you might find it was the other way around.  Linfield said no to Bridgeland.

I agree with everything Playball said.  Bridgeland gets buckets of money to turn the program around.  It will be interesting to see how much support Rosenberg gets from the school.  I still think Doty was pushed out because they didn't want him there, so they just stopped supporting him and the program.

Well said, Blackhawk!  Totally agree.  It is just for stats and PR ("We made the playoffs last year", etc) for the other 3 teams.  fortunately, the only time in the last several years when the league champion did not win it, they also got an at-large bid (WW and UPS).  But it is a waste of time, opens the lone playoff team to injuries, and has the potential of keeping the best team out of the national playoff.

BH4:

I watched the GF/Whitman game and the announcers did do a good job.  They also mentioned several times how much the injuries were affecting GF.  It appears Atkins got hurt in the Whitworth game.

It was an early game, so the late games were available to check out.  LC vs Will, pleeeease!  Whitworth vs Linfield, knew the outcome of that one!  So I made the trip to Forest Grove, and got a good game vs PLU.

Former:

PLU has a young big, 6-6 Bryce Miller.  Very active inside for a big and had some nice moves.  But on the other hand, PU has no big to bang with him.  Probably made him look better than against other teams.  He is only averaging 10 a game.  But only a soph, so....

Whitman looks like a good game with Whitworth, but LC hasn't won in Spokane since ?  2014 would be a great time to start, but tough trip (Whitman used to be an easy game, but not anymore), tougher place to play, and still a tough team.  Hard to like LC for that one.   I still see (hoping) for a split this weekend for them.