Caltech is obviously not the same team they were earlier in the season.  They peaked early and just don't seem to have enough chemistry right now.  They do have some young talent in Bryan Joel and Andrew Houge, and if they can get a little depth with next year's recruiting class, they could surprise.

Rat,
We'll agree to disagree about Caltech.  They may not win a conference game, but I still don't think they are a "bad" team taking into account all DIII teams.  I can't argue your point about not winning a conference game though...

Right now they're definitely in a funk.  Hopefully they can right the ship (and soon).

They have a rough stretch with three road games in a row.  Maybe they'll rise up, maybe they won't, but we'll see...

If you read my post again, I said middle of the pack of 400 or so + DIII teams.  I didn't mention in any conference.  I won't get into where they'd finish if they were in other conferences because some they'd fare better in (Skyline, North Atlantic) and some they'd clearly be outmatched (UAA, NEWMAC, WIAC).

Again, the topic of my post was that Caltech wasn't bad.  Check the Massey ratings (which I just checked after my original post) and Caltech is 206.  There are 412 teams total.

If Caltech (and Oxy as you say) are bad, and they're in the middle, the other 206 teams must be terrible, right?

Quote from: (509)Rat on January 08, 2012, 03:33:19 PM

Quote from: OxyBob on January 08, 2012, 11:49:05 AM
Claremont 77, Caltech 42: No contest.

Kinda what I figured.

Why does everyone but OxyBob keep insisting on pretending that Caltech is a good team??? They needed a perfect storm to beat a bad Oxy team last year in their ONE conference win. The team's they have beaten this year have combined for somewhere around 15 wins...the only reason I can't put an exact number on it is because they've played teams who barely have athletic websites let alone an updated men's basketball results page...Caltech is bad. They might always be bad. But they can hold their heads high knowing that they will most likely change the world, whereas Redlands grads struggle with changing their own underwear.

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I don't know what your definition of "bad" is, but Caltech isn't even close.  Lets look at a couple of their games. 

They beat Pacifica 11/22 (without Todd Cramer BTW).  Pacifica then turns around and beats Occidental the next night.  Caltech also won handly @ West Coast Baptist 12/1 (after West Coast Baptist beat Oxy 11/29 @ Oxy).  Both Caltech and Oxy beat University of Dallas and lost to Stevens and Chapman.  Caltech also beat Babson, a very respectable team out of the NEWMAC who is 8-6 on the year.

I didn't meant to make this into a comparison of Caltech and Oxy's schedules, my point is, if you're saying Caltech is "bad", Oxy must be too.  My opinion is both are probably middle of the pack teams taking all 400+ DIII teams into account.

Oxy will be an extremely tough matchup for Caltech this Wednesday with Montoya back, revenge aside.

(modified by GS for formatting)

Oxy vs Caltech Tues 2/22- It'll be interesting to see how both teams come out. 

Oxy has been eliminated from the SCIAC playoffs.   After expending so much energy the past couple weeks getting back in contention, how much will they have left in the tank?   On the other hand, this is Caltech's last chance this year to get that elusive conference win. 

Should be a great game to watch other than Whittier and Cal Lu's winner take all for the last playoff spot.

Quote from: WoostAr on February 08, 2011, 12:34:52 PM
I find myself on the same page as OxyBob here, Caltech should win this and the streak should end....CMS wins easy (of course I've been wrong on them the last couple weeks), Oxy and LaVerne will be tight (coin flip), I think Whittier takes down Redlands (haven't been too impressed with Redlands this year)

I've thought all along that a single win for Caltech would turn into several wins (much like it did in their non-conference season)....it will be interesting to see what happens to the team's demeanor when the win finally happens...they're confident and chippy to begin with...I imagine a win will only increase their confidence/swagger.

Should Caltech win Wednesday, their Alumni Event on Saturday against Whittier will be electric.  It's going to be a great event nonetheless, but the energy from everyone coming back along with the streak being over (and the possibility of a 2 game winning streak in conference) would be a wonderful thing to see.

How bad do the Caltech guys want it?  I know their coaches do.

Quote from: OxyBob on January 20, 2011, 01:30:03 PM

Quote from: stag44 on January 20, 2011, 11:55:57 AM
OxyBob, can you pinpoint any one thing thats causing the Oxy 0-4 start.

There must be more than one.

Quote from: stag44 on January 20, 2011, 11:55:57 AM
I can't think of the last 0-4 start they had.

I'm sure that Oxy's not started the conference season 0-4 since Brian Newhall's been the coach. Might have to go back into the early 1980s when Oxy wasn't very good to find an 0-4 start.

Next challenge for Oxy: Coach Kat and Pomona on Saturday.

OxyBob

Should Caltech and Oxy lose their next games, it'll provide quite the matchup for two 0-5 teams.  If that happens, betcha no one would have predicted that.

Only thing worse than 0-6 for Oxy would be 0-6 with a loss to Caltech. 

Keep in mind Cal Lu struggled the first round through conference and still made the SCIAC Tournament. 

Quote from: etule on January 17, 2011, 05:24:34 PM
Maybe Cal Tech's first SCIAC victory will come at OXY! YIKES

If Caltech plays like they did against Redlands (or the last half of their game against LaVerne), the streak is over Wednesday night. 

If Paluchniak and Edwards can contiue their hot shooting from downtown (16-31 combined 3's last 2 games) it may give Elmquist the room he needs inside to carry his team to victory.  His scoring average has dipped from 18.3 (through 11 non-conference games) to 11.6 (3 conference games only).  Oh how they could use those extra 7 points... I think Cal Lu will have to pick their poision matching up. 

I say Caltech wins 51-50 and the next Nobel Prize nominee out of the school is Oliver Eslinger,

Quote from: cmsstag on January 05, 2011, 05:26:57 PM

Quote from: OxyBob on January 05, 2011, 05:08:44 PM

Quote from: stag44 on January 05, 2011, 01:52:47 PM
Kats will have his guys ready to compete and Caltech wont creep up on any SCIAC team this year.

I think it's hilarious that we have someone in here talking smack about Caltech.

OxyBob

Let's wait to talk about how good Caltech is going to do in the SCIAC until they finally win a game in the conference. Until then, we shouldn't really have any smack talk going on. Plus the humiliation of being on that nights sportscenter will probably be enough. You know it will hit the news when and if they finally do win a game in conference...god helps the team that allows that to happen

Completely agree, BUT...Caltech has guys who CAN play. 

IF they beat a SCIAC team it will be news, but only because of the streak.  Again, if they win it will be because they were the better team that night (or in general if they can actually sweep both league games).

I'm sure no one wants to lose to Caltech or anyone else for that matter.

Elmquist, not Edwards.

Now that you bring it up though, Edwards will probably drop 20, too.

What's your opinion of them and what would you think of they added one or two more impact players in the next year or two?

Kat will not be able to pull this one out.  As many times as he scouted Caltech this year, it doesn't change the fact he doesn't have the horses to match up.  Caltech has more depth, especially at guard.  Elmquist will dominate Wright if he guards him if Okpalugo is not in the game.  Expect a ton of energy from a Saturday night home game, opening game of conference. 

Caltech has 4 of their first 5 at home, so don't be suprised if they're no worse than 3-2 after 5 games.

With all freshman and sophomores (with Elmquist the only SR) they will add depth with the next recruiting classes and probably win the SCIAC in the near future.

Quote from: breakfromcoaching on November 16, 2010, 01:47:05 AM
caltech will not go winless this year now with a couple years under the belt with their system, true basketball players with significant basketball playing experience who perfectly fit the academic model and a schedule that has winable games on it.  could be wins against carengie melon at MSOE (if they meet), against southwestern (AZ) or west coast baptist in the redlands tourney or ENU, Pac Luth or Wisc Luth at home.  maybe even a win against santa cruz.  conf wise, other than oxy who looks like they have lots of good, young talent, cms who just keeps on winning and redlands who's primed for a breakout year, everyone else in their conf is beatable.  i say that lightly based on history but look at what cal lu, pomona and whittier lost and if they're going to be beat, this is the year to do it.  no vested interest other than knowing how hard the players and staff have worked in the past and how much it would mean to everyone involved with the program after enduring so many lopsided losses.  i say at least 5 wins overall (including at least 1 that breaks the conf losing streak) is a real possibility.

trying not to look ahead, but other than losing one senior, they bring back the entire core of the 2010-2011 team, and with decent 2011 class they be a team that'll be fun to follow.

Hope International 86 Caltech 53. 

Hope jumped on them early shooting 61% from the field including 7/10 from 3 pt range and Caltech couldn't recover.  There's a lid on the rim as Caltech is shooting 29% from the field through 3 games this year not to mention last years's leading scorer Mike Edwards at 18%.  Ryan Elmquist is carrying the team so far at 19.7 pts per game and top frosh Cramer and Paluchniak are averaging 12 and 8 pts respectively.

It's only a matter of time before Edwards breaks out of the rut he's in and on any night is capable of going for 30.  If the team can continue getting this production from Elmquist, and can get a little more from Cramer and Paluchniak, all they'll need are spot contributions from the bench and they'll be in every game.

With youth and injuries the league is wide open.  Anyone can be beat on a given night.

caltech will not go winless this year now with a couple years under the belt with their system, true basketball players with significant basketball playing experience who perfectly fit the academic model and a schedule that has winable games on it.  could be wins against carengie melon at MSOE (if they meet), against southwestern (AZ) or west coast baptist in the redlands tourney or ENU, Pac Luth or Wisc Luth at home.  maybe even a win against santa cruz.  conf wise, other than oxy who looks like they have lots of good, young talent, cms who just keeps on winning and redlands who's primed for a breakout year, everyone else in their conf is beatable.  i say that lightly based on history but look at what cal lu, pomona and whittier lost and if they're going to be beat, this is the year to do it.  no vested interest other than knowing how hard the players and staff have worked in the past and how much it would mean to everyone involved with the program after enduring so many lopsided losses.  i say at least 5 wins overall (including at least 1 that breaks the conf losing streak) is a real possibility.

trying not to look ahead, but other than losing one senior, they bring back the entire core of the 2010-2011 team, and with decent 2011 class they be a team that'll be fun to follow.