Quote from: DFWCrufan on April 19, 2018, 03:52:05 PM
There is a kind of disadvantage to this whole thing in discussing much, I asked my kids (who attend) and word around campus is quiet as well but to say they had let the students know before there was any other release.

So troll away, (snore) Not like the kids involved had any questionable legal problems...

not sure what "legal problems" have to do with this UMHB situation, oh wait you are "trolling" about the Mount Union thing....I get it...

Quote from: Pat Coleman on April 19, 2018, 03:21:40 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 19, 2018, 03:10:00 PM

Quote from: yessir on April 19, 2018, 02:49:56 PM
I've seen Merle's antics...C- trolling at best.  Without previous knowledge of an infraction of some sorts...I'm not sure how someone in good conscience can assume that UMHB cheats...unless they are jealous or a hater. 

I'll try harder.

Coach Pete has been the only coach in UMHB's history, 20 years of success!  That's a lot of experience in the NCAA and dealing with their compliance rules.  I have seen numerous people alluding to the fact that Fredenburg was just trying to help out multiple student-athletes in need.  While that is admirable, with 20 years experience Fredenburg should have known better than to provide extra benefits.  He was either ignorant of the NCAA rules, or he knowingly broke them and was hoping to not get caught, or he is the greatest human in the world and sacrificed his reputation and the reputation of the program, three months salary ($50k+?) and three games in order to just help a couple of players.  Two out of those three arent good.  That's just the football coach.  Did the athletic department know what was going on?  Did they turn a blind eye to everything going on?  There were other violations outside of the football program?  yikes

UMHB is just trying to keep the big, bad NCAA from snooping around Belton too much.

We get it. Trolls gotta troll. But we don't have to let you keep trolling on D3boards.com, for sure.

questioning a highly successful D3 HC "unintentionally" providing extra benefits is trolling?  That's quite a "captain-of-the-ship" punishment for a mistake.  Does PF not know the rules?  Does PF not care about the rules? or is PF trying to skirt the rules?

Quote from: yessir on April 19, 2018, 02:49:56 PM
I've seen Merle's antics...C- trolling at best.  Without previous knowledge of an infraction of some sorts...I'm not sure how someone in good conscience can assume that UMHB cheats...unless they are jealous or a hater. 

I'll try harder.

Coach Pete has been the only coach in UMHB's history, 20 years of success!  That's a lot of experience in the NCAA and dealing with their compliance rules.  I have seen numerous people alluding to the fact that Fredenburg was just trying to help out multiple student-athletes in need.  While that is admirable, with 20 years experience Fredenburg should have known better than to provide extra benefits.  He was either ignorant of the NCAA rules, or he knowingly broke them and was hoping to not get caught, or he is the greatest human in the world and sacrificed his reputation and the reputation of the program, three months salary ($50k+?) and three games in order to just help a couple of players.  Two out of those three arent good.  That's just the football coach.  Did the athletic department know what was going on?  Did they turn a blind eye to everything going on?  There were other violations outside of the football program?  yikes

UMHB is just trying to keep the big, bad NCAA from snooping around Belton too much. 

Quote from: rscl70 on April 19, 2018, 07:48:01 AM

Quote from: edward de vere on April 19, 2018, 12:08:49 AM
And now for something completely different:

Can anybody explain to me where the hell the athletic field is?  My best guess is that it is out-of-view to the right of the small trees but . . . geezus.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Massillon-Oh-Stadium-old-buses-old-cars-crowd-in-the-stands-vintage-postcard/292524402137?hash=item441bd025d9:g:BlcAAOSwNxda0sEo

The playing field is directly in front of the grandstand.  If you look at the left hand 1/3 of the photograph you can see the scoreboard and endzone bleachers.

The stadium is still pretty much the same to this day.  If you stand in the parking lot on the visitor side, you can probably recreate that picture 

Quote from: yessir on April 18, 2018, 02:56:36 PM
Just out of curiosity...what happened in the past that would lead someone to assume that UMHB cheated? I'm just curious why people are assuming the worst in this situation? Every article that I've read clearly states that the infraction resulted in no competitive advantage.  Am I missing something...or is your assumptions based on hatred and jealousy?

dagnabbit!  I say, I say extra benefits would generally lead to a competitive advantage in most cases

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on April 18, 2018, 01:39:46 PM

Quote from: Ralph Turner on April 17, 2018, 09:34:00 PM

Quote from: D3viewer on April 17, 2018, 06:07:11 PM
"There was no effort to hide or deny the conduct which resulted in extra benefits to student-athletes, and the benefits were not provided with an intention to obtain either a recruiting advantage or competitive advantage," the school said.

Then why don't they say specifically what the violation is/was ? What's the big secret ?

If one has ever been in a situation where an infraction, misdemeanor, felony, civil suit, or legal proceeding is occurring, it is customary to withhold the details of the case until the case is heard.  This applies to anyone who has had experience as the one who is being investigated, the one who is "prosecuting" the case, the one who is defending the case or the one who is in charge of holding the evidence, depositions or other aspects of the case, at any level.

I do not expect to hear the details until the appropriate people have handled the case..

Too this point... the NCAA Bylaws (especially in DIII) do not allow an ongoing case to be discussed. Some schools take that to the extreme, but really depending on how the case was started. In this case since they self-reported, I am sure they are being ultra quiet until the case is finished. In others where someone else reported a school (i.e. UWSP MBB), some of that information could already become public without the entire case being discussed.

good ol' Coach Pete done just helped out a couple of players.  Whats the big deal? 

Quote from: D O.C. on April 17, 2018, 08:19:04 PM

QuoteAren't there any fans of real championship contenders that want to be on my side?

I'll be your friend.
Can you send me one of those friendship rings now?

I'm taking orders.  I'm thinking about putting a big #2 on the top, to signify the two people.  I was thinking purple stones too. nothing like this has ever been made before!

Quote from: txtiger1 on April 17, 2018, 06:45:22 PM
I APPLAUD UMHB and the coach for having the GUTS to commit this infraction, AND tell people they made it! No doubt it was a MORAL infraction of the highest regard, and should be praised for its nuance and contribution to the greater good! Although we do not have any information whatsoever regarding the nature of this infraction, we can only assume that it was something along the lines of feeding a starving student-athlete.

preach!

as the newly elected voice for Mount Union fans, nobody wants the '16 trophy.  I was simply trying to inject some levity into a turbulent time in D3 football.  We will miss Thomas More and we hope that they earn a shiny 2nd place ring in 2018

Quote from: MUC57 on April 17, 2018, 03:06:41 PM

merlecanlas

Come on, Merle. Read my earlier post. We don't know the circumstances surrounding this situation. Let's get more info before we rush to judgement. I came to praise UMHB, not bury them. Go Cru!

praise them for cheating?  admittedly

how much salary is Coach Pete forfeiting because "he is such a good guy"?

Quote from: Frank Rossi on April 17, 2018, 02:46:51 PM
Merle - NAIAFootball.com is still available.  Just sayin'...

oh frank....another swing and a miss.  there has been much discussion about TMC joining the OAC when it was announced TMC was leaving their conference.

The OAC board is Merle country.  I won't take over the East boards until the playoffs.

Quote from: Bartman on April 17, 2018, 02:18:01 PM
Speaking from experience(Ten years ago, Hobart football self reported an alums financial assistance for 2 unrecruited football team members, which the coaching staff had no knowledge of and were very angry at the alum for doing so), despite the self reporting and lack of the Hobart coaches knowledge, the 2 years where the athletes participated in the program were wiped from the records and there was a fine. Self reporting  and imposition of institutional punishment does not absolve MHB and their coaching staff from the NCAA's long reach, although self reporting should soften the blow , especially with a 3 month suspension without pay . Depending on the facts, an NCAA playoff ban is still possible, as innocent as the motivation may have been.

so 3 months without salary = keeping the '16 title?

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 02:04:36 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 02:01:05 PM

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 01:48:11 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 01:44:48 PM

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 01:35:50 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 01:25:22 PM
http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2018/04/thomas-more-leaving-ncaa

So much for Thomas More replacing Wilmington in the OAC.  Wild last couple of days in D3

I saw this one coming.  They have 7 road games in 2018 and travel to MN twice, NY, AL and in between. 

The other option bandied about was moving up to Division 2.

Looks like OAC is now my home on the message boards.

can't we send Wilma to NAIA and take Thomas More in?  D3 Independent is no way to be.  Is NAIA just a stepping stone to NCAA D2?

I think there was a question for D2 about enrollment minimums and funding scholarships.  They aren't quite there yet.  Many of those current schools in the MidSouth are in Kentucky.  The conference footprint is Kentucky south through GA.  It will enable the school to continue to increase enrollment. 

Selfishly, I'd have liked them to stay in D3 but they had nowhere to go.

holy cow the Mid South is a huge football conference.  20 teams!

Do the current players at TMC start getting scholarship money?  Sorry for all of the questions, I have no idea how this transition happens

Some of those teams are only associate members.  I'm not exactly how the transition will work.  But I don't think they can give out scholarship money until 2019. 

The recruiting will be the same kinds of kids - Thomas More was running into Georgetown, Lindsey Wilson and others on the recruiting trail.  So I'm sure there will be kids currently on the roster who receive some money. 

This conference really should help them make great progress in Florida.

I generally don't like NAIA programs, but I'll be rooting for Thomas More.  Put a NAIA wall around Cincy and dominate. 

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 01:48:11 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 01:44:48 PM

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 01:35:50 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 01:25:22 PM
http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2018/04/thomas-more-leaving-ncaa

So much for Thomas More replacing Wilmington in the OAC.  Wild last couple of days in D3

I saw this one coming.  They have 7 road games in 2018 and travel to MN twice, NY, AL and in between. 

The other option bandied about was moving up to Division 2.

Looks like OAC is now my home on the message boards.

can't we send Wilma to NAIA and take Thomas More in?  D3 Independent is no way to be.  Is NAIA just a stepping stone to NCAA D2?

I think there was a question for D2 about enrollment minimums and funding scholarships.  They aren't quite there yet.  Many of those current schools in the MidSouth are in Kentucky.  The conference footprint is Kentucky south through GA.  It will enable the school to continue to increase enrollment. 

Selfishly, I'd have liked them to stay in D3 but they had nowhere to go.

holy cow the Mid South is a huge football conference.  20 teams!

Do the current players at TMC start getting scholarship money?  Sorry for all of the questions, I have no idea how this transition happens

Quote from: SaintsFAN on April 17, 2018, 01:35:50 PM

Quote from: merlecanlas on April 17, 2018, 01:25:22 PM
http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2018/04/thomas-more-leaving-ncaa

So much for Thomas More replacing Wilmington in the OAC.  Wild last couple of days in D3

I saw this one coming.  They have 7 road games in 2018 and travel to MN twice, NY, AL and in between. 

The other option bandied about was moving up to Division 2.

Looks like OAC is now my home on the message boards.

can't we send Wilma to NAIA and take Thomas More in?  D3 Independent is no way to be.  Is NAIA just a stepping stone to NCAA D2?