Nescacman,

First of all, Congratulations to Bates. Great win for their program. As I detailed in my half time analysis, Bates had a great game plan and executed it well.

As I mentioned, the 25.5 line wasn't a line I set. It was simply the line I was on the wrong side of this weekend. So please, do not bash my friend's reputable sports book on this board. Come after me. I'm a grown man. I can take it. Leave him out of this. This was the same book who set the Trinity v Middlebury game as even money, which was wildly accurate and fair. Nescacman, if you were so confident in Bates, I gave you the option to get in at the 25.5 line. I told you to Personal Message me and I would refer you to my friend in South Florida. You never did. So you had the option to put your money where your mouth was, but you didn't. I will admit, the Golden Corral buffet didn't quite taste the same Saturday night. But, they kept the bar open late for me which was much needed. Panthers are still very much in the hunt.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Message Board,

Halftime Thoughts:

The only thing worse than annoying bureaucrats, are awful announcers. After dealing with stupid environmental people all morning, I have to go to Golden Coral and attempt to listen to this BRUTAL Bates play by play guy. I requested the staff to mute the TV, which they eagerly complied to. All due respect to this Bates guy, but he has been awful. He has been calling QB Brian Moran by the wrong name all day. The reining NESCAC Offensive Player of the Week and they guy doesn't even know his name (or just doesn't care to look at the roster right in front of him.) He has also referred to the Middlebury Head Coach multiple times as "Mickey Heinecken", the legendary former Middlebury HC who retired in 2000. Doesn't know the names of any of the Midd receivers either. He has incorrectly claimed Bates has been running RPOs all day, which is false, they run the Triple.

Besides that, I've been impressed with Bates' triple option attack. Establishing the dive guy is the most important thing for any option team to do, and they have done a good job at that. Going to need more of a rushing impact from their QB in the 2nd half. Its a "Triple Option" but really no rushing threat from the QB so far. Their passing attack has been good, besides that interception. All successful option teams are able to throw the football very well. Paul Johnson at GA Tech, despite running the flexbone, would always recruit elite receivers, and his pitch to them was "You won't lead the country in receptions, but you could in touchdowns." And they were elite at this, Demaryius Thomas for example. Continuing to complement their option with a passing attack will be important for Bates to get points on the board.

I think the Middlebury Defense will be fine coming out for the half. It takes some settling in to get used to an option team. Just like a couple years ago Alabama and The Citadel were tied at halftime, but went on to win by 40 after 2nd half adjustments. Just need to read keys and play assignment football, and they will be fine. Middlebury Offense is going to need to make the most out of each drive. Bates has dominated time of possession, a trait of many good option teams. So the Midd offense will get fewer drives than normal today.

And if anyone knows good civil defense lawyers in the Southern New Hampshire area, please let me know.

"Lets see if Middlebury QB Brian Shaw and Coach Heinecken play it safe here" - Bates Play by Play Guy, 2024

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Nescacman on October 25, 2024, 10:50:55 AM

Quote from: mhoncho123 on October 25, 2024, 01:13:20 AMNescacman,

As I mentioned, the statement wasn't written with any specific event in mind, so I wrongfully didn't consider the timing either. But, I agree the timing was equally bad and overall in very poor taste. 

I wasn't able to make it to Golden Corral tonight, but it has been a longer night so far. FYI the Early Bird Special starts in around 7 hours. But that is no excuse for my statement.

Who is this Al Davis clown? And what is a Freshman team?

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

BTW JV Legend, not sure you are really offering up MID -25.5 but we'll take the Frisky Kitties and the points if that isn't a fugazy offer...

NM

Nescacman,

Very serious. PM me and I can send you who to get in touch with.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Nescacman,

As I mentioned, the statement wasn't written with any specific event in mind, so I wrongfully didn't consider the timing either. But, I agree the timing was equally bad and overall in very poor taste. 

I wasn't able to make it to Golden Corral tonight, but it has been a longer night so far. FYI the Early Bird Special starts in around 7 hours. But that is no excuse for my statement.

Who is this Al Davis clown? And what is a Freshman team?

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Bates Fans,

I like the Panthers a lot in this one. My friend in Antigua and Barbuda has it at Middlebury -25.5, and to be honest, I really like that. Seems fair and that line should get action. If any one wants to hop in on that, PM me and I can get you in touch with the right people.

Reminds me of a bar fight I got into about 10 years. I was in Portland on a work call and I stumble into some bar off Congress St. As I am almost finished with the pitcher of Coors Lite I ordered, I see a man wearing a Vietnam War Veteran hat. I initially walked over to thank him for his service, because there is nothing I respect more than our troops. But, as I looked closer, I saw it. This elderly man was wearing a "Bates Bobcat" T Shirt. How Pathetic is that?? Frustrated and angered, my instincts took over. I grabbed the rest of the pitcher and gave this old man an ALS Ice Bucket Challenge with Coors Lite. I would like to reiterate, there is nothing I respect more than our Troops. But, there is no logical reason to be wearing a Bates T Shirt in public, much less in the presence of a legend like myself.

I apologize for the improper phrasing of the prior post. The wording wasn't thought through. Thank you to me fellow board members for holding me accountable. Was not my intention to allude to anything specific. I sincerely apologize for the mistake. I'll be better.

With regret,
Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Nescacman,

I believe this has been discussed on the board prior. At many schools of higher education, especially NESCAC's, it is no secret that many administration and faculty don't exactly believe football plays a role on campus. And many of these members would probably prefer to do away with a football team. While maybe jokingly, I think your point about the mascot change is very indicative. This name change was part of a bigger trend in academia of wokeness. As these feelings of animosity grew, COVID gave these schools both financial and social backing/excuses to start to trim these things they don't like. Many schools straight up cut sports. Furman University in SC terminated both their mens baseball and lacrosse teams in the Summer of 2020. The reason cited was "budget concerns." Both sports had incredible alumni backing and support. Not to mention Furman's endowment was upwards of $800 million. Furman didn't see a purpose for the sports on campus so they backdoored a way to get rid of them.

I believe many schools are incredibly fortunate to still have programs, especially Amherst. I think that speaks to Amherst's alumni support and backing. It would be very interesting to see what is going on at Amherst behind closed doors. Maybe someone can infiltrate the Amherst admin.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: MammothDad on October 23, 2024, 02:52:21 PMI'm sure Amherst is an easy team for most of you to root against.

But for the love of excitement, do any of you get tired of beating a team that can't score and barely get first downs?



Congrats to Colby, Bowdoin and Tufts for stomping us of late!

Middlebury, thank you for toying with us in the 2nd half, giving us a false hope ...

... it was fun while it lasted.


Help me out, journeymen of NESCAC FB ...

... if your OL struggles to run straight forward to allow your RBs to bruise, as Amherst did more years removed than they want to acknowledge, would not 5 step drops ALSO be dangerous???

Would not an OC help a struggling OL out by mixing in QB draws, screens, play action pass, run pass options, the option, a reverse a dang flea flicker, hook and lateral, etc...

SOMETHING???

Or does blocking improve after the 7th series ending in a punt, allowing the offense to suddenly run at will and pass out of a 5 step drop?!?

okay, rant over but its getting old and I see nothing changing?!?

Thanks again for those of you who share stats and answer questions!  You guys really help a guy new to the league.

MammothDad,

As other members have touched on, the issues with the Amherst FB program run much deeper than simply schematic or preparation. But, yes, I agree. There do appear to be some poor game planning going on coaching wise. However, I think putting the QB in a 5 step would just create more issues, but agreed there should be some adjustments going on. The coaching staff could be doing stuff behind the scenes that just isn't visible from the stands though. Not sure. Could always pull a Bates and turn to the option. Just ask NESCACMAN.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Mr GroundandPounder,

Thank you for mentioning these points. Illegal surveillance, two way communication systems, referee interference was all the evidence I cited in my appeal. I hadn't previously considered the uniform scheme. That could explain the breach in my weather forecast modeling algorithm as well.  If I were a betting man, which I am, I would bet the under of the 57 degrees for Saturday. My modeling set the high for Saturday in Lewiston at 48 degrees, so I believe the under is a safe bet. Thank you for your support for the truth, and I hope Secretary Copeland will hear our pleas for the truth.

Unfortunately, I won't be in Lewiston this weekend. I have some government person come to my estate in the morning to attempt to adjudicate a dispute with my neighbor. Hopefully, this will be done by kickoff, so I can catch the game. I already have my reservation at Golden Corral for Kickoff (Joking, I don't have to make reservations. They keep a booth permanently reserved for me).

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Nescacman on October 22, 2024, 10:35:55 PM

Quote from: Scoops on October 22, 2024, 09:04:46 PMSo let me get this straight... 4-1 Middlebury beats an undefeated Trinity and yet you, assumingly with a straight face, are able to convince yourself that Wesleyan is the current top team in the league? The same Wesleyan that lost to a winless Bates (your #8 team), had to come back against a one win at the time Colby (#6) and gave up a staggering EIGHT sacks and had to come back to win against 2-3 Bowdoin (#7)? I get being a homer, but your own rankings don't agree with themselves.

Quote from: Nescacman on October 22, 2024, 02:49:29 PM

2024 NESCACMAN Week 6 Power Rankings

1). Wesleyan Cardinals (Record: 5-1; Last Week Rank: 2; 7 first place votes): Wesleyan moves into our #1 spot based on Middlebury's upset of Hartford State, Wesleyan's 5th win of the year against the Polars on the road, and Wesleyan's large win over Middlebury in Vermont in Week #1. Wesleyan always seems to have a tough time playing at Bowdoin and this year was no exception. The Wesleyan defense is very good and leads the NESCAC in many categories including scoring defense and yards allowed. The offense has been inconsistent. At times they have looked spectacular and at other times, they have struggled. Overall, it was a gutsy come from behind win in Brunswick. Wes travels to Amherst to face the Lord Mammoths in the first Little 3 contest of 2024.

Thank you Maple for being the voice of reason here....the last 3 games will decide things so we'll see. With that being said...

1. The NESCACMAN consortium is comprised of 10 Voters, 1 vote representing each team in the league (no vote for the Fighting Camels...sorry); the vote this week: 7 votes for Wesleyan, 3 votes for Middlebury. Very objective and fair. Sorry Scoops and Mr. JV Legend, only starters get a vote.

2. You seem to forget that Middlebury actually played Wesleyan at home in Vermont. Wesleyan won 43-7 and it was not even that close. Go back and watch the game. We did. Score could have easily been 60-0. Doesn't matter when they played, they played and Wesleyan won by a ton. Case closed. If it was a closer game, maybe we would give Middlebury some wiggle room but it wasn't.

3. Middlebury didn't exactly set the world on fire against arguably the worst team in the league, Amherst. They allowed 21 points to one of the worst offenses in the country and if it wasn't for 4 INTs by the Lord Mammoths, MID probably would have lost.

4. So let us understand this. Last year, MID beats Hartford State, they finish with the same record, and  MID claims the league title as a result of the head-to-head win. This year, through 6 games, Wes and Mid are tied, yet despite the head-to-head win by Wes, Mid claims to be ahead of them in the standings because they are "playing better". Seems a bit hypocritical to us.

Not that we have to explain ourselves, but we stand by our rankings through 6 games...

Nescacman,

To address each of your uninformed points.

1. No one knows more about the league than myself. So any "NESCAC Consortium" that doesn't include myself is immediately fraudulent.

2. I think we both know the result of that game were tainted due to officiating and other circumstances. My pending appeal to Sarah Copeland, the Vermont Secretary of State, has gone unnoticed for some reason. But I hope our legal system can overturn the results of that game and rightfully award the Panthers a victory.

3. This might be the dumbest thing I've read in a while. I think we can dispel the myths that the Middlebury defense is bad. Just go ask that sorry Trinity offense. You bash the Middlebury defense for giving up 21 points, and then claim the only reason they won is because they picked off 4 passes. That's the defensive equivalent of saying "The Middlebury offense didn't exactly set the world on fire vs Trinity. And if Moran doesn't throw those 3 TDs, they probably lose." Just all around stupid take.

Let's not forget that Wesleyan lost by double digits at Home to Bates. And the Wesleyan offense only accounted for one touchdown the entire game. 

4. Yes, you are correct. Not hypocritical at all. Just context matters.


- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Scoops on October 22, 2024, 09:04:46 PMSo let me get this straight... 4-1 Middlebury beats an undefeated Trinity and yet you, assumingly with a straight face, are able to convince yourself that Wesleyan is the current top team in the league? The same Wesleyan that lost to a winless Bates (your #8 team), had to come back against a one win at the time Colby (#6) and gave up a staggering EIGHT sacks and had to come back to win against 2-3 Bowdoin (#7)? I get being a homer, but your own rankings don't agree with themselves.

Quote from: Nescacman on October 22, 2024, 02:49:29 PM

2024 NESCACMAN Week 6 Power Rankings

1). Wesleyan Cardinals (Record: 5-1; Last Week Rank: 2; 7 first place votes): Wesleyan moves into our #1 spot based on Middlebury's upset of Hartford State, Wesleyan's 5th win of the year against the Polars on the road, and Wesleyan's large win over Middlebury in Vermont in Week #1. Wesleyan always seems to have a tough time playing at Bowdoin and this year was no exception. The Wesleyan defense is very good and leads the NESCAC in many categories including scoring defense and yards allowed. The offense has been inconsistent. At times they have looked spectacular and at other times, they have struggled. Overall, it was a gutsy come from behind win in Brunswick. Wes travels to Amherst to face the Lord Mammoths in the first Little 3 contest of 2024.

Scoops,

Agreed. Middlebury has gotten better. Wesleyan has gotten worse. If the two were to play today, my preliminary modeling suggests it would be Panthers -16.5, and that seems generous for the Cardinals. Middlebury is by far playing the best football, and is clearly the top team in the league. Hard to justify a team that lost to Bates being in the 1 spot.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Trin9-0 on October 22, 2024, 05:06:24 PM

Quote from: GroundandPound on October 22, 2024, 02:16:22 PMWow!!! Yardage is not even close.  There may be others for #2 behind Girard.

Well, I went down a rabbit hole and ended up tracking down every NESCAC receiver to amass over 2,000 career receiving yards since the league formed in 1970. I've bolded the yardage leader from each school. The list includes 9 players from Trinity, 4 from Middlebury, 3 from Wesleyan, 2 from Tufts and one apiece from Amherst, Colby, and Williams (no one from Bowdoin or Hamilton has reached the milestone).

Player    Rec    Yards    TDs    Jon Girard (Trinity 2017-'21) 163 3,035 29 Matt Perceval (Wesleyan 1996-'99) 166 2,879 36 Jon Troy (Tufts 1996-'99) 184 2,511 12 Danny Noyes (Colby 1998-'01) 164 2,466 ? Tom McDavitt (Trinity 1991-'94) 150 2,364 21 Freddie Scott (Amherst 1971-'73) 143 2,336 27 Tim McNamara (Trinity 1981-'84) 146 2,313 19 Ron Duckett (Trinity 1970-'73) 154 2,289 19 Pat McNamara (Trinity 1976-'79) 141 2,280 20 Phil Lutz (Tufts 2021-'22) 154 2,273 18 Zach Driscoll (Middlebury 2009-'12) 172 2,257 29 Donovan Wood (Middlebury 2020-'23) 131 2,246 19 Sean Clapp (Trinity 2021-Present) 151* 2,220* 21* Koby Schofer (Trinity 2016-'19) 134 2,159 23 Conrado Banky (Middlebury 2015-'18) 133 2,156 23 Larry DiGiammarino (Bates 1978-'81) 151 2,123 17 Frank Stola (Williams 2017-'21) 142 2,123 29 Matt Minno (Middlebury 2012-'15) 136 2,093 30 Terry McNamara (Trinity 1986-'89) 157 2,091 16 Mike Breuler (Wesleyan 2014-'17) 165 2,049 18 Pat Moffett (Wesleyan 2000-'03) 106 2,036 13 DeVante Reid (Trinity 2018-'22) 127 2,026 21 Given his absurd TD numbers and the fact that he played in 3 fewer games than Girard I'm giving the nod to Perceval as the All-Time NESCAC Wide Receiver G.O.A.T. Shoutout to the Jumbos' Jon Troy for that reception total but how did he only score 12 TDs?! If anyone from Colby knows how many career receiving TDs Danny Noyes had please feel free to update. *Notes active player.

Trin 9-0, Great list. Thanks for sharing. Would be interesting to see how many games each receiver played in as well. I know Lutz put those numbers up in only 18 games and Wood in 27 games. Driscoll only played in 28 games during his Panthers career which makes his stats remarkable as well. Jamin from Middlebury is about 200 yards away from the 2,000 mark and Wilson from Wesleyan is about 300 too. Not sure if any other active receivers are closing in. - Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Nescacman on October 22, 2024, 02:43:29 PM

Quote from: mhoncho123 on October 22, 2024, 10:31:30 AM

Quote from: Nescacman on October 21, 2024, 10:56:03 PM

Quote from: VoodooDoc on October 21, 2024, 10:19:58 PMThe quality of the officials in the NESCAC is somewhat better this year. The glaring exceptions were the blatant missed calls in the Wesleyan Bowdoin game.  The video shows that Poy's return of the fumble was called a incomplete pass when the throw in question was clearly a lateral.  The SEC has the best refs in the country and the number 1 squad missed the interference call in the Texas Georgia game. Thank goodness the call was reversed.  Unfortunately, the NFL refs who had the experience to make calls have retired and the idiots in strips are so reliant on replays and calls from NFL headquarters, they can't make a call 5 feet in front of their faces.  The NESCAC refs on Saturday don't have replay or common sense, and the blew the fumble call by a mile.  These refs need to be better trained.  All the players in the NESCAC deserve to have their games called fairly and professionally.  That clearly did not happen on Saturday.

We were at the game in Brunswick on Saturday. Voodoo, you mentioned "missed calls" in your Post using the plural form of the word "call", yet you only mentioned one "call" that you thought the officials missed. What were the other "calls"?

As far as the "call" in question, we were standing right on the line where the play happened and it looked like a forward pass to us. Yes, we root for the Cards, but we call it like it is. Similar play when Wes played at Hamilton this year. The refs called that a backward pass (plus the Wes defender was down by contact) and that ended up being the deciding TD for the Cards. Now that was a bad call.

We give the Polars credit for playing hard. Their defense gave the Wes offense all they could handle including 8 sacks. But blaming the loss on the officials is just plain wrong. The officiating on Saturday in Brunswick was actually pretty good considering it's Maine which is renowned for home cooking. We have definitely seen worse this year. Sounds a bit like sour grapes to us. Maybe if the Polars were better on 3rd down (3 for 12) or 4th down (0 for 2) and could pass the ball better (9 for 25 with a pick), we wouldn't be having this conversation. 

Nesecacman,

I wasn't able to catch the Wesleyan/Bowdoin game in real time, but right after I woke up on Monday, I went to Golden Corral at around 2:00pm to conduct my film study. For my film study the Wesleyan/Bowdoin game was 2nd in the queue, only after the 2010 Boise St/Nevada game. Unfortunately, I agree with your take. Officiating was fair by my standards, and blaming the officials on a lost is never a good look, but hard to expect much more from a Bowdoin football fan. From my experience, Wesleyan is typically successful at infiltrating and coercing referees, so it was pleasant to not see that take place on Saturday. I commend the strength of the Maine referees.

Still finishing up my film review from some other teams in the league. I expect to finish up my review of every game this past weekend soon. I don't plan on reviewing the Amherst/Colby game, however. I would rather be sentenced to 20 years of hard labor in the gulag than have to watch that pitiful Amherst offense anymore.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Mr. JV Legend,

Nice to see we concur on the officiating discussion.

Frankly, given that you earn "nearly six figures", we were a bit surprised and disappointed by your restaurant choice, Golden Corral. We would have had you pegged for something much more upscale like Olive Garden or Red Lobster. Is Golden Corral the "official" restaurant of the JV Legend weekly film study session?

NM

Nescacman,

You are correct. I do have a comfortable salary nearing 6 figures along with benefits. One of these benefits is 12 paid vacation days per year. I used one of these days on Monday in order to give my body some rest from the weekend.

I don't exactly see your issue with Golden Corral. Just because I am a member of the ultra wealthy doesn't mean Golden Corral is beneath me. You obviously have never seen their lunch buffet before. I used to frequent PF Changs more than anywhere. But they took Coors Lite of tap, and I had a slight disagreement with management, so I no longer breakdown film there. I also don't have "weekly" film sessions. Between 9am-5pm Monday-Friday, my film sessions are more hourly than anything.

As I've said before, please don't refer to me as "JV Legend" anymore. This extremely disrespectful, and I request you refer to me with the respect I deserve.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Nescacman on October 21, 2024, 10:56:03 PM

Quote from: VoodooDoc on October 21, 2024, 10:19:58 PMThe quality of the officials in the NESCAC is somewhat better this year. The glaring exceptions were the blatant missed calls in the Wesleyan Bowdoin game.  The video shows that Poy's return of the fumble was called a incomplete pass when the throw in question was clearly a lateral.  The SEC has the best refs in the country and the number 1 squad missed the interference call in the Texas Georgia game. Thank goodness the call was reversed.  Unfortunately, the NFL refs who had the experience to make calls have retired and the idiots in strips are so reliant on replays and calls from NFL headquarters, they can't make a call 5 feet in front of their faces.  The NESCAC refs on Saturday don't have replay or common sense, and the blew the fumble call by a mile.  These refs need to be better trained.  All the players in the NESCAC deserve to have their games called fairly and professionally.  That clearly did not happen on Saturday.

We were at the game in Brunswick on Saturday. Voodoo, you mentioned "missed calls" in your Post using the plural form of the word "call", yet you only mentioned one "call" that you thought the officials missed. What were the other "calls"?

As far as the "call" in question, we were standing right on the line where the play happened and it looked like a forward pass to us. Yes, we root for the Cards, but we call it like it is. Similar play when Wes played at Hamilton this year. The refs called that a backward pass (plus the Wes defender was down by contact) and that ended up being the deciding TD for the Cards. Now that was a bad call.

We give the Polars credit for playing hard. Their defense gave the Wes offense all they could handle including 8 sacks. But blaming the loss on the officials is just plain wrong. The officiating on Saturday in Brunswick was actually pretty good considering it's Maine which is renowned for home cooking. We have definitely seen worse this year. Sounds a bit like sour grapes to us. Maybe if the Polars were better on 3rd down (3 for 12) or 4th down (0 for 2) and could pass the ball better (9 for 25 with a pick), we wouldn't be having this conversation. 

Nesecacman,

I wasn't able to catch the Wesleyan/Bowdoin game in real time, but right after I woke up on Monday, I went to Golden Corral at around 2:00pm to conduct my film study. For my film study the Wesleyan/Bowdoin game was 2nd in the queue, only after the 2010 Boise St/Nevada game. Unfortunately, I agree with your take. Officiating was fair by my standards, and blaming the officials on a lost is never a good look, but hard to expect much more from a Bowdoin football fan. From my experience, Wesleyan is typically successful at infiltrating and coercing referees, so it was pleasant to not see that take place on Saturday. I commend the strength of the Maine referees.

Still finishing up my film review from some other teams in the league. I expect to finish up my review of every game this past weekend soon. I don't plan on reviewing the Amherst/Colby game, however. I would rather be sentenced to 20 years of hard labor in the gulag than have to watch that pitiful Amherst offense anymore.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

The Message Board,

As I expressed concern about in the previous week, in what has become a trend this year, #82 for Trinity put together another disappointing performance (5 rec, 46 yards). #82's 2023 season was one of the better in recent 'CAC history. But in no way do I believe his name deserves to in the conversation of greatest 'CAC receivers of all time like Driscoll, Lutz, Breulur, Jamin, etc. #82 now sits at 341 yards and 3 TDs through 6 games. Hard to imagine members of this board heralded him as "the greatest NESCAC receiver of all time". Honestly, a pretty bizarre claim. At best I give #82 a Ladd McConkey comparison and a Christian Dremel on the low end. Very obvious one season wonder.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend

Quote from: Charlie on October 21, 2024, 01:08:10 PMI don't agree with your stance that Trinity did not throw deep they did and not effectively at all. They drove down to Middlebury's 30 yard line mixing run and quick short pass to negate Middlebury's pass rush.

Quote from: Charlie link=msg=
quote author=Charlie link=msg=2117335 date=1729530490]

Charles,

Please re read my statement. No where did I claim Trinity didn't take downfield shots in the Middlebury game. Please do your due diligence before slandering me on this board.

- Honcho, NESCAC Legend