Quote from: Bob.Gregg on November 21, 2024, 01:06:59 PM

Quote from: Machiavelli on November 21, 2024, 12:18:41 PMCome out to an RPI/Union game. Campuses are only 20-25 minutes apart. Attendance is usually 2500-5000. Come on out and tell me there isn't a home field advantage. Do it.

In the last 25 matchups:

RPI @ Home: 10-3
RPI @ Union: 4-8

Same time frame:

RPI Conference Championships: 9
Union Conference Championships: 5
RPI Playoff Appearances: 7
Union Playoff Appearances: 6
RPI Playoff Record: 7-7
Union Playoff Record: 4-6

It's somewhat amazing how teams this evenly matched can not have an exact .500 record Home and Away without a 'Home Field Advantage'. Make it make sense!?!? (You don't need a plane trip or a long ride or 50K fans for there to be a home field advantage. End of conversation.)

So, based on your post, the ONLY factor is deciding winner/loser to be considered is HOME FIELD? There's NOTHING else to consider in RPI's 14-11 mark over the last 25 meetings?  Seriously?

And "End of conversation."  How simply Machiavellian of you...

What are you even talking about? It feels like you can't get out of your own way on arguing over a topic that is proven and part of all sports. I'm making the point that there IS such a thing as home field advantage at ANY level, with ANY travel, and with ANY sized-crowd. Will it always affect the outcome? Hell no, of course not.

But to say there is no advantage because of crowd size or distance, etc etc. ignores reality and lends itself to never having slept an extra hour on game day, or go through your 'home game' pre-game routine, or have your own stuff in your own locker, and get taped in your own training room, and not get yelled at or spit on by opposing crowds.

Hell, some people even like away games and away facilities better! That's not what this conversation is about. Winning on an away field should always carry the slightest bit more of weight. Not a ton, but a slight bit more. So just stop arguing the alternative, because it's just not factual.

Quote from: Bob.Gregg on November 21, 2024, 01:06:59 PM

Quote from: Machiavelli on November 21, 2024, 12:18:41 PMCome out to an RPI/Union game. Campuses are only 20-25 minutes apart. Attendance is usually 2500-5000. Come on out and tell me there isn't a home field advantage. Do it.

In the last 25 matchups:

RPI @ Home: 10-3
RPI @ Union: 4-8

Same time frame:

RPI Conference Championships: 9
Union Conference Championships: 5
RPI Playoff Appearances: 7
Union Playoff Appearances: 6
RPI Playoff Record: 7-7
Union Playoff Record: 4-6

It's somewhat amazing how teams this evenly matched can not have an exact .500 record Home and Away without a 'Home Field Advantage'. Make it make sense!?!? (You don't need a plane trip or a long ride or 50K fans for there to be a home field advantage. End of conversation.)

So, based on your post, the ONLY factor is deciding winner/loser to be considered is HOME FIELD? There's NOTHING else to consider in RPI's 14-11 mark over the last 25 meetings?  Seriously?

And "End of conversation."  How simply Machiavellian of you...

This is maybe the "douchiest" post I've seen in awhile. Just saying...

Quote from: mikefln on November 21, 2024, 09:35:37 AM

Quote from: DevilsAdvocate on November 20, 2024, 08:25:06 AMLong time listener, first time caller.... if they want to bracket us (PAC) this way, love to see a all PAC Semi-Final!  Let's show them what we bring!  They are all highly skilled team in their own ways.  They can all go toe to toe with the best.  Anything can happen on a Saturday!  Just need them all to stay healthy for 5 weeks!

I love the thought process and I do believe that each team is capable,  but that Mount Union draw is a tough one to overcome for sure.  But first thing first, they all have tough round of 32 games they need to win.

Yeah, for now let's get three into the round of 16 if we can. That would be very heady stuff - in fact, I suspect it's almost never happened because before this year the number of at larges severely limited the capability of any conference to get three teams in. Maybe I'll ask Pat or Logan on Twitter if it's happened in the d3football.com era...I'm guessing that maybe once or twice the WIAC or MIAC did it? But it can't have happened more than a very few times.

Quote from: ExTartanPlayer on November 21, 2024, 06:40:29 PM

Quote from: mikefln on November 21, 2024, 09:35:37 AM

Quote from: DevilsAdvocate on November 20, 2024, 08:25:06 AMLong time listener, first time caller.... if they want to bracket us (PAC) this way, love to see a all PAC Semi-Final!  Let's show them what we bring!  They are all highly skilled team in their own ways.  They can all go toe to toe with the best.  Anything can happen on a Saturday!  Just need them all to stay healthy for 5 weeks!

I love the thought process and I do believe that each team is capable,  but that Mount Union draw is a tough one to overcome for sure.  But first thing first, they all have tough round of 32 games they need to win.

Yeah, for now let's get three into the round of 16 if we can. That would be very heady stuff - in fact, I suspect it's almost never happened because before this year the number of at larges severely limited the capability of any conference to get three teams in. Maybe I'll ask Pat or Logan on Twitter if it's happened in the d3football.com era...I'm guessing that maybe once or twice the WIAC or MIAC did it? But it can't have happened more than a very few times.

Just twice before in the AQ-era has a single conference placed three teams in the tournament, but never three teams to the Sensational Sixteen. 
 
2016 - WIAC.  UW-Whitewater and UW-Oshkosh made it to the round of 16.  UW-Platteville lost to SJU in the first round. 
2007 - E8.  Ithaca and Hartwick(!!) both lost in the first round  SJF made it to the QF. 

I can't believe I forgot about the Hartwick year for the Empire 8. Team Boltus. Shame on me.

Congratulations to Westminster for their win in the bowl game. 

Way to represent the PAC.

Quote from: mikefln on November 24, 2024, 02:52:54 AMCongratulations to Westminster for their win in the bowl game. 

Way to represent the PAC.

Seconded! Congrats Westminster!

Good luck tomorrow/today everyone. Let's make the PAC proud.

Well, it didn't go how I'd liked it to have gone, but the PAC has nothing to be ashamed of. 

CMU- Handled business with a win.  Good luck to them the rest of the way.  I'll be rooting for you eventhough you'll be leaving the PAC

GCC- Had too slow of a start.   Can't win against good teams, especially away, when you surrender the 1st half.  They still had their chance, and was a missed FG away from taking the game into OT. 

W&J- I tried to watch it, but that was a horrible video production, so I didn't watch this one.  Judging by the score box, they started strong, faded away, then tried to make a late rally but ran out of time. 

Looking to next year, it sucks to loose a great team like CMU and it is worse that they are being replaced by a winless team.  That leaves 2 top dogs in GCC and W&J, 2 teams trying to reach top tier in CWRU and Westminster. 

Then there is the albatross of the PAC, which is the bottom group.  I will say there are 2 groups in the bottom group.  Programs with a pulse, and teams without a pulse.  I guess it's nice every team got a win this year, but these teams need to step up their game.  To make it worse, the PAC is bringing a winless team into the fold.  I know there is more to conference affiliation than just football, but damn does this hurt.  How does the NCAC get John Carroll and we get Hiram?

Agree that the PAC has nothing to be ashamed of. Three worthy playoff entrants played three worthy playoff opponents. CMU won one of those rope-a-dope kind of games where they got out to an early lead, then gave up lots of passing yards in the box score but only "broke" a few times defensively. No doubt it got very tense in the fourth quarter but they battled to a win, obviously benefiting from the tests in the regular season they got from Grove City, W&J, and Case.

I have to admit I'm disappointed that both Grove City and W&J lost. I'm not a total homer and I know there are good teams all across the division but I thought we had a real shot at two or three teams in the final 16, especially given that Grove City took Cortland right down to the wire last year. Congrats again to both teams on excellent seasons.

As for the Tartans...oh no big deal, just an away game at the division's most storied program!  This may not be the Machine of old, but it's still Mount Union. The formula for victory is something like this: play defense out of their minds, get a turnover or swing play on special teams to get out to a lead, and hang on for dear life.

Offensively, despite Mills' poor numbers on Saturday, I thought he played quite well - it was just so damn cold and windy that nobody could catch the ball - lotta drops that hit guys in the hands. If that's the case again, they'll need more from the run game than they got against Centre.

Defensively, I do think CMU has the guys to hang - but the offense has to do them some favors and move the ball a little more consistently than they did on Saturday.

Special teams has been a key advantage for the Tartans all year and it would be great if that keeps up.

Tall order. Let's see if the Tartans can get it done and be the PAC's first quarterfinalist since...I'm gonna have to look that one up and get back to you guys.

Gagliardi Trophy Finalists Show going live at the top of the hour:
https://www.d3football.com/notables/2024/12/gagliardi-finalists-show

Really surprised that nobody has posted this yet.

In light of CMU's departure, the PAC will abandon its plans for a two division format with a title game.......and instead play an eight game conference football schedule with two teams cycling off schedule each year.  The football playing members will each play two non-conference games; CWRU has good non-conference matchups with Wabash and Centre lined up for 2025!

The bad news is that for the first time since I started following CWRU football as a freshman in 1990, the annual "Academic Bowl" rivalry game between CWRU and CMU will not be played.

What a bummer!  That was one of the most interesting rivalries in D3!

I hope that it can be added to future schedules, perhaps as a season opener!

For me, the "ultimate" future CWRU schedule would be to open the season with CWRU and Wooster (putting both the Academic Bowl trophy and Baird Brothers Trophy on the line), and then go into the conference schedule.

Read on.

https://www.observer-reporter.com/sports/college_sports/2025/jan/13/pac-football-opts-for-8-game-conference-schedule/

I had already been thinking about the upcoming season today. I was aware last fall that there would only be 8 conference games scheduled. I also was aware that CWRU was scheduled to play at Wabash on September 13 this season and again in 2026.

I found a few PAC teams with 2025 schedules posted. They show that CWRU plays home games with Westminster on September 20, Allegheny on October 11, and Geneva on November 15. They also play at W&J on November 1.

Centre's site has only 9 games on its 2025 schedule, with openings on Sept 20 and 27. Presumably the CWRU game would be September 27.

If that article is correct that JCU has games with Waynesburg in 2025 and 26, It would be great if CWRU could schedule them and CMU for 2027 and 28.

JCU is a nice cross-town rivalry. 

But the Baird Brothers Trophy is intriguing enough to get both SI and ESPN mentions.

I had Robert Baird as a Microeconomics professor back in 1991.

Would love to see that rivalry and the Academic Bowl come back!

CWRU apparently just got its first commitment!

https://x.com/JackBellinotti/status/1886533003590901925