Following up on Kuiper above the answer seems to be "it depends." I can concede that conference titles are important to coaches, players, and to some extent fans and family depending on where the program is at with such things. I certainly would prefer Kenyon winning the regular season and conference tourney but at this juncture I'm far more interested in whether that will translate to hosting and possibly hosting the second weekend.

Wow! What a last 5 years for top academic NESCACs. Athletes at Williams and Amherst really do it all, juggling such a hard class load with top-flight soccer. Listen to this stat: Williams or Amherst has been in the national final EACH of the last 5 years!!! Unbelievable

Do athletes at non-NESCAC schools that make tournament runs not juggle rigorous academics?

Nope not a one

What's even more impressive is the athletes at Williams and Amherst are doing it all without any sort of support or safety net.  We know they're disadvantaged youth who have overcome insurmountable odds to attend these prestigious institutions. 

Quote from: paclassic89 on December 06, 2024, 03:08:06 PMWhat's even more impressive is the athletes at Williams and Amherst are doing it all without any sort of support or safety net.  We know they're disadvantaged youth who have overcome insurmountable odds to attend these prestigious institutions. 

Chuckle out loud.

Quote from: paclassic89 on December 06, 2024, 03:08:06 PMWhat's even more impressive is the athletes at Williams and Amherst are doing it all without any sort of support or safety net.  We know they're disadvantaged youth who have overcome insurmountable odds to attend these prestigious institutions. 

They are disadvantaged because extreme privilege is an awesome and often incalculably unfair burden...and frankly, if you don't understand, you're just not privileged enough to understand. The pressures to excel at the highest levels and to further advance the family legacy are immense.

Quote from: Kuiper on December 06, 2024, 01:31:26 PM

Quote from: Hopkins92 on December 06, 2024, 12:53:47 PMDitto, especially the part about conference titles. Most teams post their goals on a white board or team notebook or whatever and winning the conference title is absolutely a huge deal to them.

You can see it the celebrations after they win. They go nuts.

To some of us old heads who have seen those banners hung a number of times, we might be less impacted. That's just a natural reaction. But there are folks in the Centennial who see this post as fairly annoying. Not my intent, but I would understand someone taking issue with the perceived arrogance.

Quote from: Another Mom on December 06, 2024, 12:42:21 PMCompletely agree with everything you wrote @jknezek.

I think most of the discussion on this topic is really about the psychological proposition that happiness is all relative or relative to expectations, which in the context of a team or program might be relative to what you and your cohort have done and what your school's teams have done in past years.  If Cal Tech Coach Duncan Gillis had written on the whiteboard the first practice that first season that the goal was a national championship or even a conference championship (or even making the conference tournament), it might have been so unfathomable that it would have failed to motivate the players.  I'm sure he set goals that would not have satisfied most teams.  For many, many teams, the season is absolutely a success if the team just makes the conference tournament or beats its biggest rival.  The burden for a successful program is the goals get bigger and the chances that you will reach them get smaller.  It is far more likely that every season the coach will have to console the team and convince them that they had a great season even though they failed to achieve their goals.

Honestly, every coach has to be jealous of Wisconsin-Superior. This is the most successful season ever for them and they improved from last season in a very measurable way. They beat defending national champion St. Olaf and qualified for the Sweet Sixteen for the first time in program history.  Last season, they lost in the first round of the NCAA tournament to St Olaf by a 7-1 score.  That is a massive turnaround.  They might have a few regrets if Amherst wins, knowing that they scored two goals on them and took them to the last minute or two of double OT before losing, but the glow of getting farther than you have before and improving over last season is a far different feeling than the relief of doing what you were expected to do.

I think the Jumbos are going to have a similar feeling, knowing that the national champ is either a team they gave the only loss to(Amherst), or haven't lost to in 3 years(Conn College), having gone out in both the NCAAs and NESCAC tourney on pens.

Quote from: paclassic89 on December 06, 2024, 03:08:06 PMWhat's even more impressive is the athletes at Williams and Amherst are doing it all without any sort of support or safety net.  We know they're disadvantaged youth who have overcome insurmountable odds to attend these prestigious institutions.

You've clearly never been to Enmore, practically third world there, not an easy place to escape from.

Quote from: rdanie03 on December 06, 2024, 03:39:08 PM

Quote from: Kuiper on December 06, 2024, 01:31:26 PM

Quote from: Hopkins92 on December 06, 2024, 12:53:47 PMDitto, especially the part about conference titles. Most teams post their goals on a white board or team notebook or whatever and winning the conference title is absolutely a huge deal to them.

You can see it the celebrations after they win. They go nuts.

To some of us old heads who have seen those banners hung a number of times, we might be less impacted. That's just a natural reaction. But there are folks in the Centennial who see this post as fairly annoying. Not my intent, but I would understand someone taking issue with the perceived arrogance.

Quote from: Another Mom on December 06, 2024, 12:42:21 PMCompletely agree with everything you wrote @jknezek.

I think most of the discussion on this topic is really about the psychological proposition that happiness is all relative or relative to expectations, which in the context of a team or program might be relative to what you and your cohort have done and what your school's teams have done in past years.  If Cal Tech Coach Duncan Gillis had written on the whiteboard the first practice that first season that the goal was a national championship or even a conference championship (or even making the conference tournament), it might have been so unfathomable that it would have failed to motivate the players.  I'm sure he set goals that would not have satisfied most teams.  For many, many teams, the season is absolutely a success if the team just makes the conference tournament or beats its biggest rival.  The burden for a successful program is the goals get bigger and the chances that you will reach them get smaller.  It is far more likely that every season the coach will have to console the team and convince them that they had a great season even though they failed to achieve their goals.

Honestly, every coach has to be jealous of Wisconsin-Superior. This is the most successful season ever for them and they improved from last season in a very measurable way. They beat defending national champion St. Olaf and qualified for the Sweet Sixteen for the first time in program history.  Last season, they lost in the first round of the NCAA tournament to St Olaf by a 7-1 score.  That is a massive turnaround.  They might have a few regrets if Amherst wins, knowing that they scored two goals on them and took them to the last minute or two of double OT before losing, but the glow of getting farther than you have before and improving over last season is a far different feeling than the relief of doing what you were expected to do.

I think the Jumbos are going to have a similar feeling, knowing that the national champ is either a team they gave the only loss to(Amherst), or haven't lost to in 3 years(Conn College), having gone out in both the NCAAs and NESCAC tourney on pens.

haven't beaten Conn in 3 years either....last result was Conn win in 2021 NCAA's I believe.....

Quote from: SKUD on December 06, 2024, 11:44:34 AMPN delay (vs continuation) was curious on that one. I felt the 2nd game crew was solid overall .

Head ref in Midd-Amherst game was weak from the start.  Let the Amherst boys have their way with physical play and Midd followed suit.  #32 kicks Mid goalie in the head when it was clearly possessed by keeper.  An automatic red but somehow he gives a yellow.  Fine, he does not want to make such a big decision with so much on the line.  Then he awards them a very weak pk.  I have watched the reply endless times.  there was no way there was sufficient conclusive evidence to award PK.  Such a shame it had to end that way and not in the run of play.  Honestly, he was very weak all around and should not be handling a semifinal game in national championships.  I dont think he will be handling key matches anytime soon.  at least I hope not.  Other than that it was a hard fought game by both side, just unfortunate it ended the way it did.

Oh, and did I mention there was no camera behind Amherst net for good replay video, yet there was one behind Midd net.  Even the NCAA official on hand agreed if they are going to do VAR it needs to be equitable.  Alright, enough of the venting.  Be well, and go Conn.

And you are an unbiased soccer fan right?

Women's D1 F4 features FOUR ACC squads.  Stanford (new ACC member) didn't even make the ACC tournament (and the announcers noted that winning the ACC tourney might be tougher than winning national title).  Stanford joined by Wake Forest (leading the Cardinals 1-0 under four min left), UNC, and Duke.  Three of the four obviously very local in Cary, NC where it is a "feels colder" 35 degrees.

Wake just made first national final in their history.  Picked preseason to finish 9th in the ACC.

Wake Forest star after match says "it took us four years to prove we're good."

Duke vs UNC next.  Playing in their backyard.  Doesn't get much better.