What are the benefits of playing D3 Soccer?

[tlitz101]

We have a rising high school senior getting serious interest from Centennial league coaches (F&M, Gettysburg, Dickinson). We are weighing the benefits of playing soccer for one of those schools or attending Penn State and NOT playing soccer. We get a large discount at PSU since we are staff. He is interested in a Business degree. The D3 colleges would be a significantly larger investment and all the Net Price calculators say we will be paying $35K-$60K per year, depending when a sibling is in school and some other factors. We know these are great schools academically, top 50 liberal arts schools in the country. But having him play soccer could cost us $130K-$150K more than PSU over 4 years. We are seeking as much information as possible before making a hard decision in the fall.

My question is directed at parents of D3 soccer students past or present... As we weigh these options- what are some of the benefits to playing D3 soccer at these schools or others like them that we might not be aware of? Did D3 soccer help your student excel academically by having to be more structured around soccer? Did he develop leadership or other skills that maybe he wouldn't have not playing college soccer? Was the team a positive social network? Do these types of smaller liberal arts schools do well developing athletic students into well rounded adults?

Thoughts?

Thanks!

[Another Mom]

Even if every one of the positives you list were true, are they worth $150,000?

You might also wander over to College Confidential,  first because their athletic recruiting forum is invaluable.  But also because they like to discuss the finances of college. I am pretty sure the advice you would get there would be to save your money.

Are there big career outcome differences? I am guessing probably not. It might be a different equation if you were comparing Harvard to Penn State.

Might your son qualify for merit aid? I know schools like Denison, Kenyon, Skidmore etc offer it. Actually Gettysburg probably does too. I believe about schools you can ask for a financial aid preread, which can also give you an idea of what merit you might get.

It is a little late, but did your son reach out to higher ranked academic schools? Some families use recruiting to get into very selective schools. E.g. Vassar, Williams, Bates, Colby, Hamilton,  the  among others.

One of my sons just graduated high school and will be playing in college.  An older son played soccer in college too, and he found it to be a tremendous benefit, but he's a quiet kid with ADHD so for him the structure and the instant group of friends were important.  But also for us playing/not playing cost the same so we didn't have to decide just how important these things were.

Plus, couldn't your son get many of the benefits of playing d3 soccer by playing club at Penn State?

Best of luck as you navigate the rest of the summer and the fall!

[deutschfan]

Excellent thoughts Another.  The two biggest benefits of playing d3 soccer are 1) the joy of playing the game you love on a varsity college team with the concomitant benefits of potential awards and recognition, satisfying competitive urges, seeing your name in the press releases, making life-long friends, and having a ready made core group in college; and 2) Using soccer as a lever to be admitted at a much better academic institution than a student could get into without the sport.  A lot of the benefits associated with number 1 presume that the student will have significant minutes on their d3 team.  The majority do not.  For those on the sidelines d3 soccer can be a humbling and frustrating experience.  Also, the number of d3 players who play professionally after college is extremely low.  There are 3 Centennial schools worth chasing academically if the option without soccer is PSU--Swarthmore, Hopkins and Haverford.  As Another Mom noted there are a number of other top d3 academic schools outside the Centennial Conference.  As a Big Ten University PSU offers an amazingly diverse set of experiences for an undergrad--experiences that have no rival at small liberal arts schools--and this is without any consideration given to the money you may save.

[WUPHF]

In Missouri, the System tuition benefits work at all four campuses.

If Penn State tuition benefits work throughout the system, there is good soccer being played at the regional campuses.

If someone wants the prestige and rigorous academics, do well at the regional public and then go get a Masters at even better institution.

I used to do college consulting on the side and when a parent expressed that an institution "could cost us $130K-$150K more than PSU over 4 years..." that was usually a red flag with a parent recognizing that they needed to retire eventually and could not do it.  But that may well not be you...

In the end, I recommend casting the net far and wide with applications, negotiating for scholarships and financial aid, and then making the decision.

[PaulNewman]

Oh how I miss these days.

I'm one of the more insane, college selection process obsessed parents on this site (so keep that in mind), but our situation may be a bit more similar to yours than some others.

First, the questions you raise and possible answers to them imo are obviously very individualized and personal, and then there are a host of variables that you can evaluate but not fully account for in terms of how they may play out in real life.

My son matured physically late and went into his senior year unsure if playing soccer at a decent D3 level was realistic.  Halfway through his senior year it was more clear that he could, but he had been basically unrecruited to that point.  He decided there was a good chance he might end up at a D3 school regardless of soccer and so he generated some late interest.  Many schools were already done and many especially at the higher end academically and soccer-wise would have had no interest anyway.

He started with a broad list of bigger, D1 type schools where he very clearly would not have played soccer, and D3 schools with some seeming viable for soccer and others not.  I was not a fan of trying to use soccer to get into a "better" school than was otherwise doable.  To be fair, he wasn't good enough or desired enough to even really consider that as an option, but I tend to think most (not all) kids do better in places where they aren't in the bottom 25-30% of the class.  We were so late that soccer was going to play largely no role in admissions even if a coach had lukewarmly promised a spot.  He was viable for probably half of the UAA and NESCAC schools.  In the end his choices came down to Northeastern with substantial merit aid, Bucknell, Davidson (legacy), Colby, Kenyon, and a couple of places like Rochester and Union that offered an attractive merit package.  In retrospect, The Honors College at UMass would have been a great choice, and I think his life in the big picture would likely look very, very similar. 

The final choice came down to Kenyon and Colby.  The Kenyon coach offered him a spot and the Colby coach would not commit as he said he had already filled his spots.  I actually think he would have played at Colby but by then he had decided he really wanted to play, and even though he was going to be very far away from his girlfriend, the soccer (and some merit aid) made Kenyon the choice.  Of course we had no idea that Kenyon was bringing in 20-21 frosh for the team, almost all of whom were higher profile, more targeted recruits.  I had a feeling about Kenyon being the best place for him all along even though we both loved Colby, and, certainly partly via luck, Kenyon ended up being phenomenal for him in virtually every way.  He could compete academically and he was fortunate that there was a cohort of very academically focused kids who came in with him, including several with a goal of med school.  He worked hard to earn his place on the team, going from not having a jersey number at the start of the season to being a starter within a handful a games.  He was a frequent starter his first 2 years and then mostly in a 1st or 2nd guy off the bench role his last 2 years when Kenyon (and all those freshmen) blossomed into a national contender.  He absolutely loved his experience, he has some friends for life, and the whole thing meant and means a ton to him.  The experience became a huge thing for the whole extended family, including grandparents watching live streams, seeing him beat Denison at the death on a miracle goal, score in a Sweet 16 night game at Messiah, and notch a PK in a NCAA game shootout. (Of course you come to realize later that absolutely no one cares about any of that outside of that limited circle of family members, and some of them don't care!)  All that said, he benefitted from having no particular expectations about how it would work out.  Some of his friends rarely or never played, dropped off within a year or two, or left.  Some who dropped off or left were among the "highly desired" crew, and of course you can never predict things like ACL injuries and the like.  I am very much a believer in the adage "go where you're going to be very happy if you lose the soccer."

The idea of paying to play soccer sure doesn't sound great.  I wouldn't endorse that unless a kid already was headed to the same or similar school without soccer in the picture.  I also wouldn't go to PSU-Abington instead of PSU just so I could play soccer in a very weak D3 conference.  Part of going to PSU in my mind would be to take in the whole State College experience.

[Falconer]

My question is directed at parents of D3 soccer students past or present... As we weigh these options- what are some of the benefits to playing D3 soccer at these schools or others like them that we might not be aware of? Did D3 soccer help your student excel academically by having to be more structured around soccer? Did he develop leadership or other skills that maybe he wouldn't have not playing college soccer? Was the team a positive social network? Do these types of smaller liberal arts schools do well developing athletic students into well rounded adults?

I have no sons, but as a long-time Falcon fan I know dozens of current and former players and (in several cases) their parents as well. I cannot speak to the D3 experience in general; my own collegiate athletic experiences were at a higher level, even though I didn't have an athletic scholarship myself. I can speak only about what happens to the Falcon men over four (or five) years. Each of the questions you asked would be answered, Yes, in the overwhelming majority of instances. Above all, character and leadership development are simply spectacular, and probably would not have happened to the same degree had those students not played soccer (or one of several other sports at Messiah). Whether this would also be true at another college or university, I certainly cannot say, but it's certainly not true at some D1 institutions where I have either personal experience or significant interaction with those who do. I suspect that getting a Yes answer to all of your questions is more likely to happen at the D3 level than at D1. (I realize your son is not likely to play at a D1 school.)

[OldJeff]

A lot of good points so far on this stream, but let me offer another option for your son.

If varsity soccer for your child at a D3 school is best for him that's awesome for all the reasons noted. But given all the positives of a major state university and a meaningfully lower all-in cost (in your case), I'd suggest that while D3 or D1 varsity soccer is great in many ways, it's not your child's only option.

I don't know specifically about PSU, but most major universities have very/highly competitive club soccer programs (that can also compete for national championships) partly or fully funded by the school. The "cool factor" and swag are (much) less but so is the time commitment and the pressure.

My son (a recruited high D3/low D1 player) decided school over soccer and now leads his club soccer team - at a top 10 D1 soccer program - and loves it more than when he played serious club (not academy) or HS varsity. In HS we always discussed the fun and risks of varsity college soccer, including injuries, coach issues, etc. We focused on picking the right school, not the right soccer program. While he has soccer friends (both club and varsity) but also a broad range of friends from other interests - just like real life.

It's no cakewalk for many large schools like PSU: I heard my son's freshman year, about 110 boys tried out and the club took 6 between the A & B teams. The teams play ~15 games a Fall (& another 7-10 in the Spring), play in a league, and can by winning the league can compete in regional and national club soccer championships. While it lacks some of the structure (and swag) of the varsity programs, it also lacks the stress, time commitment, travel, and other things. He's now the team Treasurer and on the small committee at his school that oversees/funds all 20+ club sports, so a chance at leadership that he's really enjoyed.

Just a thought... and you'd save a lot of money that could likely be better targeted elsewhere!