MBB: Liberty League

[magicman]

Hobart tops visiting Clarkson 69-66. Statesmen come from 15 down in the 2nd half to deal the Golden Knights a serious blow to their playoff hopes.  Hobart's Tim Llewellyn sets a school record with 11 steals. Interesting, Hobart news release says Llewellyn broke Mike Deane's record of 8 steals set against Alfred on Feb.11th 1970. Only Mike Deane I know of that played ball in NY in 1970 played for Potsdam State, not Hobart. But maybe there were 2 Mike Deanes.   

One and the same.  Deane played for Hobart '69-70, started every game as a freshman point guard.  Averaged 10 assists/game as a freshman.  Deane transferred after his freshman year to Potsdam, sat out '70-71, and then played 71-74 at Potsdam.

Thanks for the history lesson Bear, I never knew Mike went to Hobart before playing at Potsdam.

[magicman]

Big upset in Canton tonight as Vassar College drops St Lawrence 76-65. Saints blow chance to clinch regular season title and fall into a tie with Hamilton who beat Skidmore tonight 64-62. Both teams are 11-2 with SLU holding the head to head tiebreaker over the Continentals. Saints host RPI and Hamilton at Union for regular season finale.

[magicman]

Union moves into 4th place as they defeat visiting Hobart 84-73.

Clarkson beats visiting RPI 69-57.

Looks like Union claims the 4th seed with a win against Hamilton. If Union loses and Hobart wins against Skidmore that would create a 3 way tie between Union, Hobart and the winner of the Clarkson-Vassar game.  That would activate the league's multiple step tiebreaker to determine the 4th seed.

[organizingmom]

Where can I find out how the 3-way tiebreaker works?

[magicman]

Where can I find out how the 3-way tiebreaker works?

Good question. I tried to find that out myself last night and not a single school website or the LL website had that info. Yet Clarkson, Hobart, Vassar and Union all claimed to be still alive for the 4th seed.

[magicman]

St Lawrence 82   RPI 75    Saints clinch Regular season title and host playoffs next Friday and Saturday.

Hamilton 56  Union 47     Hamilton #2 seed plays RPI next Friday. Union eliminated.

Skidmore 72  Hobart 59   Hobart eliminated

Clarkson 63   Vassar 59   Golden Knights arise from the dead and claim the final playoff spot and a chance to defend their Tournament title. They take on SLU on Friday.  Clarkson wins 4th seed on 4th overall tiebreaker

Here's a partial write-up from Vassar News release:

POTSDAM, NY — Both the Vassar College and Clarkson University men's basketball teams needed a couple things to go their way in order for either team to clinch a Liberty League playoff spot. But regardless of other results in the league, what remained clear was that Saturday's matchup in the final regular season game of the year was a must-win for both teams. It was Clarkson who picked up the playoff-spot clinching victory, edging Vassar 63-59 at Alumni Gymnasium.

Although Vassar got what it needed in other results – a Hamilton College win over Union College – the Brewers' loss dropped them out of the playoff race with a 5-9 league record, finishing the season 10-15 overall. The Golden Knights moved to 15-10 overall and 6-8 in the Liberty League. Clarkson will face top-seeded St. Lawrence for the second year in a row in the conference tournament's opener at 8:00 pm next Friday in Canton, NY. Despite a tie for fourth place, the Knights got the nod thanks to a sweep of third-seeded Rensselaer, the fourth overall tie-breaker.

[magicman]

with age,

Congrats to Clarkson for hanging in there. Don't know if you remember but this is what I said to you back on Feb 1st on the SUNYAC board in response to your post to me:

"I didn't think your Knights would be 2-5 after the 1st half of the league schedule. But as bad as that is you're still only a game out of the 4th and final playoff spot. Needless to say must win situations when you play Union and Hobart again.  With 5 of your final 7 games at home you need to go 4-1 at Alumni Gym and 1-1 on the road. Hobart has 5 road games left  and Union 4 so they both have a real possibility of going 3-4 in the 2nd round robin and both ending up at 6-8 or worse. I think 7-7 will cop the 4th playoff spot. I'll be rooting for you."

So, Union goes 3-4 and Hobart goes 2-5. Clarkson does go 4-1 at home losing only to SLU and the only reason you didn't go 5-2 in the second half of the schedule was that gift the Knights gave Hobart last week. If you win that game you would have grabbed the 3rd seed away from RPI. Would rather have seen the Knights face Hamilton in the semis than SLU. But you're alive and that's all that matters.

Also thebear's Bears ended up as good as I thought they could with a 6 seed.

Alas only the Cardinals end their season but it took a good Brockport 4 game win streak to do us in. Next year we've got all 5 starters back so we'll be looking for some revenge. Young team, hung with everybody, just had trouble finishing games.

[buck1053]

I'm thinking St. Lawrence has to be the frontrunner (I know they are the top seed, so they should be by default, I suppose) to win the LL tourney. I don't think the winner will come out of ther RPI-Hamilton game, and I think St. Lawrence will be able to get by Clarkson.

Other thoughts?

[Ethelred the Unready]

I'm thinking St. Lawrence has to be the frontrunner (I know they are the top seed, so they should be by default, I suppose) to win the LL tourney. I don't think the winner will come out of ther RPI-Hamilton game, and I think St. Lawrence will be able to get by Clarkson.

Other thoughts?

Didn't Clarkson win the tournament last year with a sub-500 record?  Did anyone else make the NCAA's?  I certainly think SLU wins but,hey...you never know.

[UCAAHoops21]

I wouldn't rule out RPI or Hamilton...

RPI played Hamilton tough in two games, and beat SLU once and played them pretty tough from the looks of it this weekend.  Simmons may be the the POY and RPI plays solid defense

Hamilton nearly took the LL regular season title.

I think the winner of that game has a really good chance to win the title

Exciting ending to the regular season with everybody but Skidmore having a chance to get into the championships.

THoughts for awards...
Player of the Year-    Simmons-RPI-they are not a play-off team without him
Rookie of the Year-    tough call, Sharlow from SLU or Sullivan from Hamilton
Coach of the Year-     also tough, could make case for Downs, Tobin or Griffin from RPI

[magicman]

I'm thinking St. Lawrence has to be the frontrunner (I know they are the top seed, so they should be by default, I suppose) to win the LL tourney. I don't think the winner will come out of ther RPI-Hamilton game, and I think St. Lawrence will be able to get by Clarkson.

Other thoughts?

Didn't Clarkson win the tournament last year with a sub-500 record?  Did anyone else make the NCAA's?  I certainly think SLU wins but,hey...you never know.

Ethelred,

Yes, Clarkson won the tournament last year, beating SLU, then Hamilton at SLU's gym. They entered the NCAA tournament with an 11-16 record and lost to Kings College in a 1st round game at Kings. No one else from the LL got in. Only Naz got in from the E8 and only Plattsburgh St. got in from the SUNYAC. Rochester got an at large bid as well, leaving only 4 teams from the East region in the NCAA tourney. Stevens finished the regular season at 20-6 but lost in the E8 semifinals and was relegated to the ECAC's. Hamilton and SLU both ended up 17-9 and stayed home. Brockport St. was in good shape to get an at large bid going into the SUNYAC tournament  but lost badly to Oswego in the semis and also ended up in the ECAC's. Had Stevens or Port made it to the conference final, one or both of them would have probably gotten a bid. They both ended up winning the ECAC's.

We may get more than 4 teams in to the NCAA's this year but could end up with only 3. See my post on the East Region Fan Poll concerning the possibilities.

buck,
Hard to pick against SLU. They have the deepest bench and lots of options. Not many teams have 6 guys in double figures as the Saints do(and a 7th guy averaging 9.3 ppg) and they also have the league's biggest rebounding margin. Playing on their home court and the memory of last year's loss to Clarkson in the semifinals should be all the motivation they need to get it done this year. But as we've seen, anything can happen and they will have to beat both Clarkson and probably Hamilton for a 3rd time to come away with the automatic bid. Not always easy to do that to decent teams. If their shots aren't falling like the Vassar game on Friday night, where they shot 35% and only 5 of 30 from 3 point range,(yikes!) and they don't do a better job defensively, they could wind up on the short end.   

[with age came?]

Hey Magic,  You are quite the prognosticator!!   I truly thought that the Knights were dead after the loss to Hobart but the moon aligned with Mars and Saturn crossed paths with Uranus and they snuck in.  The Knights did play defense like old times this weekend and it showed in their wins. Lower scores and wins.  Held Vassar to 20 in the first half and they (Vassar) came out of the gate on fire.  Also did a good first half job on Simmons from RPI and really pretty much had game in control. This in part was because of foul trouble on Simmon's. Vassar was much better than I expected considering how much they lost to graduation. SLU loss to them proved how quirky the college game is. Josh Sharlow and Woepper really had substandard games and they lose at home.  That being said I believe SLU is definitely the favorite.  RPI is the Simmon's show from what I saw.  Clarkson can be dangerous if play scrappy d and take care of the ball.  Hamilton is talented and have some good wins over Williams for instance. All in all an entertaining weekend when you have 4 teams vying for one spot on the last day of league play!!!!

[magicman]

I see you're burning the midnight oil as well. I'm working on my East region poll and my Top 25 poll before I hit the sack. Your Knights are going to really have to buckle down on the defensive end next Friday. Bet Coach Stockwell is looking at the game tape of last Friday's Vassar-SLU game pretty intently.

[with age came?]

Magic U burned later than me ...   SLU losing to Vasar was an oddity but that happens when J Sharlow, Woepper, & Parham shoot 2 for 22 from 3 point land and Vassar shoots 57% from beyond the arc.  Sure coach Stockwell will be burning the midnight oil too to see if there is a way to see if the Knights can slow down the Saints.

[FLYZ5]

Beyond question, I have to agree with UCAAHOOPS' post regarding SLU's Coach Downs as LL Coach of the Year.  Regardless of this weekend's results, Coach Downs & his staff definitely deserve COY honors. Their team centric philosophy has led to a very impressive 6 players averaging in double digits with #7 barely off that mark.  The #1 Saints have had LL Players of the Week 17 times (more than any other team).  They played a tougher pre-league schedule than most LL teams.  They average 16 assists per game, lead the league in offensive & defensive rebounding and seem to be guided by the adage that no one person is bigger than the program-not a player or coach.  Admirable.

POY honors go to SLU's student-athlete Tom Wopperer-6 times LL Guard of the Week & 2nd in League scoring with 16.5.  Plays under control with limited fouls.  Certainly a consummate team player who has been significant in leading his team to a 19-5 record, 1st place and home court advantage for the upcoming playoffs. Also, a member of the 2008-09 LL All-Academic Team.

Have to concur with UCAA again, ROY honors to Hamilton's Patrick Sullivan.  Major contributor as a freshman.  Averages 12 pts/26min.  LL Rookie of the Week 5 times.

Like a phoenix rising maybe with age's Knights will persevere again this year.  Should be interesting!!