MBB: Liberty League

[UCAAHoops21]

in the top tier???  (sorry, premature post)

[shooters]

I think the question is can St. Lawrence remain at the top of the league? At 3-0, granted they haven't played anyone but Union, how long will this last. To think that after today Hobart or Union will have 3 losses, 3 more than St. Lawrence is mind boggling. I think RPI is legit, they are big and physical, but my mind is on St. Lawrence guess we will have the answer to both questions when they square off.

[radiomike]

I think the question is can St. Lawrence remain at the top of the league? At 3-0, granted they haven't played anyone but Union, how long will this last. To think that after today Hobart or Union will have 3 losses, 3 more than St. Lawrence is mind boggling. I think RPI is legit, they are big and physical, but my mind is on St. Lawrence guess we will have the answer to both questions when they square off.

There is still way too much league play to happen. The Skidmore upset of Hobart, Hobart beating Hamilton, who is 4-1, and RPI and Hobart each have only two losses. Union is 3 losses behind at the moment. This week, with the North Country driving south, the St. Lawrence games at Hamilton and Hobart will be key to the rest of the season, not to mention the Union and RPI matchup on Friday. It would be nice to see both H's win this week!

[rjcarter8]

Does anyone have any idea what is going on in the LL?

St. Lawrence is 6-0 in the league (going into today's game against Hamilton), but just 8-8 overall.

Hamilton wins in spite of their coach, I guess that's what tons of talent and a law admissions office will do for you.

Union, Hobart and RPI can't decide if they're going to win or lose. This trio of teams beats a team they should lose to one night, then loses to a team they should beat the next. What gives?

Vassar is 10-6 overall, but just 2-4 in the LL, and they really won't factor into the conference tourney.

And, Skidmore and Clarkson, who really cares about these teams. They haven't made a difference in several years.

Anybody have any reasons why the LL is so weird this year?

[shooters]

The liberty league is crazy this year! I agree with all comments made, w/ the exception of the Hamilton situation. I can't believe St. Lawrence is atop the league but thats the way its goes. Right now unless something happens to St. Lawrence/Hamilton its a two horse race to the finish!!!! I find the entire league exciting and can't wait to jump on the scores every weekend to see who beat who. I wish someone would give Anderson down at Hamilton a break, now its because of the law admissions office that they are winning, I think i've heard it all. If they lose its the coaching if they win its the players. I nevered heard a coach get such negative pubicity for winning. Lat time i checked its the coaching that brings in the players hence if they have talent its to the coach's credit. Look at Downs from St. Lawrence, he's no master of the x's and o's but he's winning, all because he has some serious talent coming in. I tip my hat off to Downs and his staff for getting the players! Can't wait to hear the final on this game today!

[ready2play]

The only reason good players go to Hamilton to play is because of the reputation that Coach Murphy built for the school. Anderson may be a decent coach, but he's no expert. With one of the best overall records in NCAA history, Hamilton looks like a great place to go for good players and their parents, with its academic prowess. Anderson only got the job, however, because of BS politics at that school. There were much more qualified coaches in the running, but Hamilton chose politically instead of intelligently. Anderson needs a few years to prove he's the reason for kids coming.

[shooters]

Hamilton is a great academic school and yes the program under Murphy was solid, I just think the program will jump up into a league of its own w/ the recruiting efforts by Anderson compounded with the fact kids want to go there. Don't get me wrong after the Hobart loss I had my questions about a lot of things but seeing them bounce back and knock off St. Lawrence by 11 and shoot their record to 14-3 I rest my doubts. I understand that there are loyal Murhpy guys and I respect that but I would like people to judge all coaches on the way they perform on the court w/ their record not by some political or athletic alignment. I enjoy posting on this site about the teams and I have yet to hear one post regarding Hamilton's team w/o the mention of how awful Anderson is. I need to get up there and meet this guy for myself.

[woot]

anderson makes line changes substitutions as if the players were playing hockey instead of basketball

[ready2play]

Ngobeni, Welchons, Peck, Toste are all from Murphy. Chavleshvili, Mandella, Ray-Ray(The Lithuanian) all come from the same high school in VA that Murphy has a connection to.  Further players from that high school should always be credited to Murphy.
Agreed on the wacky substituting method...don't really understand it.

[shooters]

I know they run a press so i'm assuming that is what is with the substitutions, but again pretty much until Giorgi graduates and no players come from any school Murphy has ever visited will anyone get any credit for the program.....except Murphy. I understand it might be too early (second year) for Anderson to start getting credit for the program but after everything i've heard leading up to this about Anderson I didn't expect these kind of results, especially in year II. Lets see how the rest of the year goes with the Liberty League, can we please talk about other coaches in the league? How about Montana up at Union? Anyone!!

[ready2play]

Montana is a great guy and a great coach (coached under Murphy...sorry, last one). For some reason his teams can never take that last step and take over an entire season. Runs a great program, though. I'd love to see them do well this year.

[shooters]

I've heard Montana is good, I wonder where Roche will end up from Hobart? Here is an interesting question, take the records out and rate the coaches from the LL, does anyone know the guy who took over at Clarkson, they seem to be having some rough times? Clearly I know the only way Anderson will be at the top w/ this group is if it was alphabetical, so we'll just put him at the bottom and save the argument. I'm assuming Montana would be at the top followed by..................

[bed]

Shooters:

I know you like defend Anderson or at least give him the benefit of the doubt, but the guy is a snake.  He isn't respected by other coaches in the league and he's not respected by his players.

His wife is very nice though.  And don't get me wrong when you meet the guy he's very articulate and he knows basketball or he wouldnt have gotten to the point he's at now.

He coached down at 5-Star camp so he meets lots of players and has connections.

No one wanted to hire this guy at Hamilton except the Hamilton Athletic Director who is a bigger snake than Anderson.  The Hamilton players and basketball alumni wanted Bill Geitner from Eastern Connecticut, Montana of Union, or Scott Hicks (formerly of Loyola, MD).

The bball alums and Hamilton players told the AD this and they also told the AD they didnt want Anderson, but the AD hired Anderson anyway.

Anderson's substitutions patterns make no sense.  He doesnt play the best guys on the team.  He favors his players (Nick Jones and Phil Valenti) who both played for him at Clarkson OVER Hamilton players that Murphy recruited and who are better players than Jones and Valenti.

TK and Giorgi are dominant players who should play considerable minutes, but often play less than 20 a game.  Anderson needs to stick to TK, Giorgi, Peck, Welcons, and Jones, without going to deep beyond those 5.   He also hamstrings TK and Giorgi's play and benches them when they actually try to excel and play how they are capable of playing b/c Anderson doesnt like that they arent his guys and doing what he wants.

He also would rather win with his guys (Jones and Valenti) being big contributors than Murphy's guys.

[shooters]

actually i wanted to talk about other coaches in the league, and yes you're right i do try to give the benefit of the doubt to Anderson, only because it seems no one else does. i'm a Liberty League guy and after seeing him do what he did at Clarkson why wouldn't he get a job offer at Hamilton? Makes perfect sense to me. Clearly you know more about the situation than i do so I will leave it at that. I know the team is 14-3, and if you are a true Hamilton fan i would think that is what is important, i guess in time he will have all "his" guys so we won't have to worry about that. I truly don't think at 14-3 i need to defend this coach, and I'll tell you what after seeing what St. Lawrence is doing i want to know more about the other coaches in the league, i mean Downs must be doing something right up there. Back to Hamilton for a minute, they were what 15-12 last year and have everyone back this year but some scrub named Evans or something and look at them now, i find the entire thing interesting almost perplexing. Does anyone want to talk about the other coaches in the league or are we going to debate this further?

[bed]

Yes, Hamilton is 14-3........and yes........you play the schedule that you have and you beat up those teams that you are scheduled to play..........BUT.......

Hamilton hasn't beaten anybody this year.  There record is inflated.  Anderson has beaten most of the teams he's SUPPOSED to beat!!  Big deal.  He beat 2 of the worst teams in the NESCAC (Middlebury and Wesleyan), beat a bunch of nobodys in non-conference action (most of whom have losing records.....or winning records in sub-par conferences).  Hamilton beat SUNY Brockport, who is decent (basically a .500 team), but not a top team by any stretch.

Who did Hamilton lose to???    All the GOOD TEAMS it played!!
They lost on the road to Utica College.
They lost at home to Hobart.
They lost at home to Williams.

Is Anderson a good coach?  In my opinion, not yet.  He hasn't proven he can be a big time coach yet.  He hasnt beaten any good teams this year at Hamilton.  At Clarkson, his teams were mediocre.  His substitution patterns don't make any sense (an earlier post mentioned they were like hockey line changes).

In terms of coaches in the UCAA, Bob Montana is the class of the league.  He is the best coach there, but Downs is solid at St. Lawrence, Griffin is a sold veteran at RPI, as is Quattrocchi at Skidmore.

As for Tobin Anderson, he's got a ways to go to be considered in a class with those coaches.