MBB: Southern California Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

CMSfan · November 11, 2010, 04:24:20 PM

1. I think student-athletes at Chapman have far more to gain from Chapman's addition to SCIAC than student-athletes at the other SCIAC schools. While I think a more competitive SCIAC is good for all SCIAC student-athletes, Chapman's inclusion in SCIAC would likely mean fewer SCIAC championships and fewer NCAA bids for other SCIAC schools. So, I think the benefits of more competition in conference are somewhat mitigated by the probable loss of NCAA tournament opportunities, especially since SCIAC schools already get to play Chapman throughout the season. I feel bad for the situation Chapman is stuck in, but as long as Chapman is not in SCIAC, Chapman's problem is not SCIAC's problem. SCIAC should add Chapman if it is in the best interest of SCIAC's schools. I happen to think it probably is, but I'm not fully convinced.

2. I think Chapman's vision/mission for the future (especially in terms of size) is relevant, at least to some extent. I don't think I know what that vision is, and I would be interested to see evidence of what that vision is, if anyone has links they could share. (My 30-second search of Chapman's website for a master plan didn't turn anything up.)

3. I don't think the addition of Chapman would have much, if any, effect on the ability of SCIAC schools to stand out on the national scene, at least not in most sports. I think higher-caliber athletes are needed for that, and I don't think think the addition of Chapman to SCIAC will lead many, if any, higher-caliber athletes to choose CMS, P-P, Redlands, etc.

4. I don't think this is true:

Quote from: DIIIghetto on November 11, 2010, 01:39:28 PM
Success athletically for every SCIAC school is defined by their performance within the conference and against their historic rivals.

Well, at least I know it's not true for CMS in many (though not all) sports.

Sabretooth Tiger · November 11, 2010, 06:19:44 PM

Quote from: DIIIghetto on November 11, 2010, 01:39:28 PMWould Claremont or Pomona accept it if their government/politics/econ departments were ranked in the bottom tier of liberal arts colleges? How about the arts? So why should our institutions accept less with respect to sports?

Really? You don't see a difference in resource prioritization? Don't see a difference in comparing academic programs to athletic programs? What does "top ranked" mean to you?

Being the member of a "top ten" NCAA DIII football, basketball, volleyball, soccer, etc program compared to a "bottom tiered" program (whatever that is) makes not a whit of difference in the avenues opened to students in their quest for graduate education or a career path. (Do you think that a Rowan football player has a better shot earning a Fulbright than a Whitman graduate?) The key in Div III is (at least in theory) participation, not winning or being "top tier." The goal is to "play the game" win, lose or draw.

stag44 · November 12, 2010, 08:18:21 AM

Moving away from this SCIAC Chapman issue which has been beaten to a pulp...

Congrats to Chris Blees and his mention on on the 4th-team Pre-Season All American list. It's a well deserved mention, and puts an even larger target on his back for this year. I'm sure he's up for the challenge!

The Stags are under a week away from their first game!

DIIIghetto · November 12, 2010, 12:51:31 PM

Quote from: Sabretooth Tiger on November 11, 2010, 06:19:44 PM
Quote from: DIIIghetto on November 11, 2010, 01:39:28 PMWould Claremont or Pomona accept it if their government/politics/econ departments were ranked in the bottom tier of liberal arts colleges? How about the arts? So why should our institutions accept less with respect to sports?

Really? You don't see a difference in resource prioritization? Don't see a difference in comparing academic programs to athletic programs? What does "top ranked" mean to you?

Being the member of a "top ten" NCAA DIII football, basketball, volleyball, soccer, etc program compared to a "bottom tiered" program (whatever that is) makes not a whit of difference in the avenues opened to students in their quest for graduate education or a career path. (Do you think that a Rowan football player has a better shot earning a Fulbright than a Whitman graduate?) The key in Div III is (at least in theory) participation, not winning or being "top tier." The goal is to "play the game" win, lose or draw.

Academics and athletics are apples and oranges. My point was to highlight that other elite liberal arts institutions have found paths to national success on the hardwood. Many of these schools are in the academic competitive set for our best SCIAC schools. I am one person who does not donate to my college because I support athletic "participation". My donations to the YMCA and Boys & Girls Clubs are for that purpose. To your point about resource prioritization, we can save money and meet a goal of encouraging athletic participation at the Club level. Let's allow our schools to redirect funds to other areas if our primary athletic goal is participation.

OxyBob · November 12, 2010, 01:16:27 PM

Quote from: stag44 on November 12, 2010, 08:18:21 AM
Moving away from this SCIAC Chapman issue which has been beaten to a pulp

Indeed.

Oxy has a tough exhibition opener @ D-I San Diego of the West Coast Conference tonight at 7:00 p.m.

Good luck to Claremont this season. See you in the Temple of Doom.

OxyBob

DIIIghetto · November 12, 2010, 02:39:17 PM

Quote from: stag44 on November 12, 2010, 08:18:21 AM
Moving away from this SCIAC Chapman issue which has been beaten to a pulp...

Congrats to Chris Blees and his mention on on the 4th-team Pre-Season All American list. It's a well deserved mention, and puts an even larger target on his back for this year. I'm sure he's up for the challenge!

The Stags are under a week away from their first game!

Blees is good enough to be higher and is being penalized by being in the best team in a poorly marketed, poorly perceived conference. But having said that, it is great to get someone on the list so congrats to him.

DIIIghetto · November 12, 2010, 05:44:02 PM

Saw that Redlands has a 1st teamer in the women's division, that is amazing! Congrats!

OxyBob · November 13, 2010, 12:47:44 AM

U San Diego 83 Oxy 66 Final

Oxy led 24-21 at 10:06, but USD outscored the Tigers 18-2 over the next 5 minutes, and the Toreros led 50-32 at the half. Oxy won the second half 34-33.

For Oxy, Deshun McCoy scored 12, Jack Hanley had 13, and freshman Kris Montoya scored 21 plus 6 rebounds.

OxyBob

cmsme · November 16, 2010, 10:32:27 PM

is anyone listening to the claremont--azusa pacific game? there is a button that says LISTEN, but i can't get it to work. The score is posted. They seemed to start off slow. it was 9 to zero within minutes, but score is now 17 to 14. it seems like a good team. wish i could listen.

cmsme · November 16, 2010, 10:37:36 PM

never mind. i got it.

cmsme · November 16, 2010, 11:42:35 PM

claremont is behind by 3 points with less than 6 minutes to go! maybe they'll win.

cmsme · November 16, 2010, 11:50:54 PM

it is a two point game and the sound goes off. why does this always happen??? claremont could beat the #1 ranked naia team, and that would be cool--but i can't hear what is going on. if any basketball expert listened to the game, did claremont play well, or azusa pacific play not so well?

CMSfan · November 17, 2010, 12:13:00 AM

Look like the Stags pulled out the win at APU, 81-79. If anyone has an eyewitness report, I'd love to hear more about the game.

cmsme · November 17, 2010, 12:28:29 AM

when the sound came by on, the game was tied with 10 seconds left to play. Chris Blees got fouled and made both shots, which is impressive as there seemed to be a big crowd, based on the noise. After Chis' basket, Azusa pacific had another chance, but the basket didn't go in.
Claremont was behind most of the game, and just squeaked in. Based on the names mentioned by the AP announcers, a lot of the team contributed to the win.

stag44 · November 17, 2010, 12:38:45 AM

CMS BEATS APU!!!!!!!!!!

Down 10 at the half, they battle back, taking their first lead with under 3 minutes to go, and from there go back and forth. Blees gets fouled with under 4 seconds to go to give them a 2 point lead, and the hold on!!!!!!

Absolutely huge win for the Stags, the SCIAC, and D3!!!

Along with Blees (25pts), Lacey, Anderson, Davis, Pinson, Gaffeney, and Heidrich all played admirably. Big props to Lacey for battling with a D1 kick back all game long and coming through in the end with big buckets. He's really developed the last 2 years to a big time SCIAC 5. Couldn't be happier.

Would love to see some ink on the D3 home page with this win as well!!!

The road doesn't get any easier for the Stags this week. On Saturday they travel to Irvine to play Concordia (NAIA #5). As wonderful of a win this was, they need to get back into Ducey tomorrow morning ready to practice and get better. CUI throws a nasty man-to-man press out there that has caused upward of 30 turnovers from the stags in the past. Its paramount that the guards (Davis, Pinson, Mivshek, Heidrich) break the press with the pass not the dribble. Even if Concordia gets a couple breakaways and easyones, its vitally important the Stags remain poised. After this win, Concordia will be ready for the Stags and bring all their guns including Taylor King, Justin Johnson and Cameron Glidden ready to play. A game in the 60s favors the Stags!!!

CONGRATS TO THEM AGAIN FOR A HUGEEEEEE WIN!