MBB: Southern California Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Stags4Life]

Chapman defeated Nebraska-Wesleyan tonight 76-67 which, if I am not mistaken, means they make the tourney as a Pool B bid.  Any ideas on how Chapman will fare in the tournament if they have indeed made it.  Chapman has defeated CMS twice already this season.  They also defeated Redlands, Cal Lu, Caltech, lost to Whittier by 3, and lost to Oxy by 5, all early in the season

I am looking forward to tommorow night, although I do not think any other SCIAC teams will make it, and Monday morning to see who the Stags matchup against.

--Stags4Life

[David Collinge]

Chapman defeated Nebraska-Wesleyan tonight 76-67 which, if I am not mistaken, means they make the tourney as a Pool B bid. 

No, that's not correct.  At least, if you mean that they clinched some sort of automatic bid by winning that tournament of independent teams, that's not correct.  Chapman is a Pool B team; there are no automatic bids in Pool B.  (Pool B is the independents, and members of conferences that don't have automatic bids, such as the GSAC and President's AC.)  There are 4 bids available to those eligible for Pool B consideration, and those bids will be the first 4 extended on the selection conference call (after the Pool A automatic bids, of course.)

I think it is unlikely that Chapman will receive one of those Pool B bids, but I'm hardly an expert on the "Bumblin' B's."  There is a board in the multi-region room devoted to discussion of the B-teams.

[Stags4Life]

No, that's not correct.  At least, if you mean that they clinched some sort of automatic bid by winning that tournament of independent teams, that's not correct.  Chapman is a Pool B team; there are no automatic bids in Pool B.  (Pool B is the independents, and members of conferences that don't have automatic bids, such as the GSAC and President's AC.)  There are 4 bids available to those eligible for Pool B consideration, and those bids will be the first 4 extended on the selection conference call (after the Pool A automatic bids, of course.)

Ok, thanks.

--Stags4Life

[Liger Hoops]

Wonderful news for the SCIAC on the front page ... TWO SCIAC teams are in the dance!!! Oxy pulls a Pool C bid while CMS obviously got the automatic. Let's all hope that both teams do some damage and make some noise in the playoffs!!!



Maybe we get the bid to make up for the awful football pairing this past season 

[Sagecock]

Now I understand that Oxy had the overall record and the win over Amherst, but they also finished the season on a 4-game losing streak compared to the Hens 4-game win streak (of which Oxy was involved).  It's great that the SCIAC got some love with two teams, but I can't help but think that a rolling PP team should have been given some consideration over a tanking Oxy squad.  The fact that Whitworth got overlooked as well is also a shame considering their overall record is just as strong (20-7 to 19-5) and the only difference between them and Oxy/UPS is 1-point. 

[diehardfan]

I am not completely sure, but I do not think those rankings include the Pomona loss, look for that loss and a Caltech win to drop Oxy a spot or two down the rankings.

Exactly. That's why I said that the situation was worse for Oxy than would be indicated by Wednesday's ranking. It doesn't reflect either the Pomona-Pitzer loss or the upcoming Pyrrhic victory over Caltech.

Hmmm... thought I said that... guess I didn't exactly do that. I guess I was expecting reader to make the leap they were currently fourth and going to stay fourth, their chances would have been excellent for a C bid. If they hadn't lost to PP, or that game was counted in this ranking, they would have simply remained fourth in the regional rankings, and first in line for a pool C.

Their loss, and the corresponding drop in the poll is what will make them the second or third west team in line to get a pool c.
That's what I meant when I said even if "the only upset in the conference tourney is Whitewater or La Crosse upsetting stout, Oxy could still be the second or third Pool C candidate from the region."

I didn't lay my argument out clearly at all. But this is a little more detail about what I think and why I think it.

The next two teams in the rankings (who were going to pass Oxy in the next rankings anyway) are the only ones who will probably upset anyone ranked above them. That means that even with conference upset concerns, Oxy will still be looking at the 2-3 slot in line for a Pool C for the West region. This is a little better than the situation in other regions, where conference upsets will affect teams on the Pool C bubble much more... does that make sense? Oxy's chances are certainly dire, but they are perhaps better than the most dire of dire?

[OxyFan21]

Oh my...I went to church tonight and my prayers were answered!  What great news for Oxy and the SCIAC.  I hope Coach Newhall and the boys kept their jerseys!

Calling Andy Holmes, calling Andy Holmes...

Perhaps not related to the football pairing, but I sure feel better this time around.

[Tom Brady]

Congrats OXY and best of luck wherever you go.  Represent the SCIAC well.

[tigersports]

Sagecock, two key results:  Oxy beat Amherst, which rolled PP and Oxy split with CMS, which swept PP.  Plus, PP did lose to Whittier down the stretch while Oxy's last two losses were on the road to CMS and PP down the stretch.  Thus, Oxy's two bad losses in conference are offset by PP's one and the aforementioned results.  Oxy beat two tourney teams, PP one.  Last, even setting officiating aside, PP got every break imaginable in the game against Oxy on Feb. 20 (Knowles' bounce on the front rim for 3, the bounce on Porter's FT, not to mention a 2+ standard deviations from the norm 20-24 from the line).  If you're gonna take a team from the SCIAC, the choice, by a preponderance, was Oxy.

[tigersports]

Don't be surprised if Oxy plays at CMS on Thursday, with the winner going to Tacoma(?) on Sat.

[David Collinge]

Don't be surprised if Oxy plays at CMS on Thursday, with the winner going to Tacoma(?) on Sat.

That's my prediction, FWIW.  Then again, I don't think I would have projected a bid for Oxy if I had looked closely at the west.  I'm glad, though.  Congratulations to Oxy!

[Sagecock]

Sagecock, two key results:  Oxy beat Amherst, which rolled PP and Oxy split with CMS, which swept PP.  Plus, PP did lose to Whittier down the stretch while Oxy's last two losses were on the road to CMS and PP down the stretch.  Thus, Oxy's two bad losses in conference are offset by PP's one and the aforementioned results.  Oxy beat two tourney teams, PP one.

I was referring more to momentum then anything else.  I still beleive a surging PP team is just as qualified as a slumping Oxy squad.  You say that the two bad losses are comparable to PP's singular loss, however, that ignores the fact that they both came at the end of the season when they would have counted the most.  I realize the same argument can be made about the Hen's loss to Whittier, but instead of bouncing back from the loss to Laverne the Tigers dropped 3 straight after beating Cal-Lu.  I don't think you can equate the two at all.

Last, even setting officiating aside, PP got every break imaginable in the game against Oxy on Feb. 20 (Knowles' bounce on the front rim for 3, the bounce on Porter's FT, not to mention a 2+ standard deviations from the norm 20-24 from the line).  If you're gonna take a team from the SCIAC, the choice, by a preponderance, was Oxy.

That's why they play the game.  Same could be said for the first game when Oxy beat PP.  Oxy may have been the clear pick at the begining ofthe season but with their current level of play I don't think it should be so obvious.

[Gregory Sager]

Sagecock, two key results:  Oxy beat Amherst, which rolled PP and Oxy split with CMS, which swept PP.  Plus, PP did lose to Whittier down the stretch while Oxy's last two losses were on the road to CMS and PP down the stretch.  Thus, Oxy's two bad losses in conference are offset by PP's one and the aforementioned results.  Oxy beat two tourney teams, PP one.

I was referring more to momentum then anything else.  I still beleive a surging PP team is just as qualified as a slumping Oxy squad.  You say that the two bad losses are comparable to PP's singular loss, however, that ignores the fact that they both came at the end of the season when they would have counted the most.  I realize the same argument can be made about the Hen's loss to Whittier, but instead of bouncing back from the loss to Laverne the Tigers dropped 3 straight after beating Cal-Lu.  I don't think you can equate the two at all.

No, they don't "count the most" at the end of the season. End-of-season performance is not a criterion looked at by the national committee. Neither is overall record, which you cited in your previous post as a reason why Pomona-Pitzer should've gotten in instead of Oxy.

That's why they play the game. Same could be said for the first game when Oxy beat PP. Oxy may have been the clear pick at the begining ofthe season but with their current level of play I don't think it should be so obvious.

Actually, it was pretty obvious that Oxy was a better Pool C candidate than Pomona-Pitzer, based upon the relevant factors, i.e., the five primary criteria.

Pomona-Pitzer's in-region winning percentage was slightly higher (13-4, .765, compared to Oxy's 12-4, .750). But that was more than offset by a large difference in the Quality of Wins Index in Oxy's favor (9.750, good for 42nd place in the country, as compared to 9.353 and 62nd place for the Sagehens). CMS was probably ranked in that final unseen regional ranking that the West Region committee put together on Sunday, which would've given Oxy yet another leg up on the Sagehens (Oxy went 1-1 against CMS, while the Stags swept their cross-campus rivals). If it ever got to secondary criteria, then the Amherst results would've come into play. But I doubt it ever got that far, because Pomona-Pitzer did not appear to be a serious candidate for a Pool C bid. Several other teams that were left on the outside looking in appear to have been better alternatives than the Sagehens: Bates, Washington (MO), Lakeland, Keene State, Trinity (CT), and Whitworth all appear to have been more qualified Pool C candidates than the Sagehens, and perhaps MIT and Mary Hardin-Baylor as well.

Anyway, congrats to Oxy ... the team that completely gobsmacked all the expert bracketologists. The Tigers appear to have been the 59th and final team picked for the big dance, but that won't matter a bit next weekend. Every scoreboard in the tournament will start out 0-0, and that's the beauty of March.

SCIAC fans, get ready to see your two teams square off on Thursday night in the opening round. I fully expect you to scream bloody murder should that likely eventuality come to pass, but look at the reality of the situation: You're geographical orphans, with no other tournament teams within a thousand miles, and the D3 tournament runs a tight budget as far as plane fares are concerned.

[Loggerville]

Mr. Sager shows yet again why he has so many starts under his name - good call on the pairings, though I am sure we all saw that one coming!  See the SCIAC "champion" in Tacoma.

[dj_hyphen]

I'm glad the SCIAC got 2 teams in, although too bad my PP boys dropped a few too many to get that bid.  But congrats to CMS and Oxy...although like Sager mentioned, the likely match up between the two should be pretty damn annoying for all of us.  I understand all the reasons though, so it makes sense...but our first year with 2 teams will really feel like 1 after that game