Bumblin' B's

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Can you impeach the Anti-Christ?   

That would sure make the apocalypse a lot easier to handle.

Of course, if Neb. Wesleyan doesn't make it, then all of this teeth gnashing and garment rendering will be for naught. Or just good practice, I suppose.

I guess this all depends on the answer to the first question.

[d3hoops8585]

If I understand the way the NCAA picks its pools A,B and C teams, it is through 5 different criteria.  Why is everyone just stuck on teams S.O.S.I.?  There are four other criteria that people should talk about.
This is the reason that Villa Julie should be a front-runner for one of the four pool B spots.  VJC has a respectable SOSI and an unbelievable winning percentage at 16-4. 

Equally important was that during the ranking period VJC had a win versus previously ranked Johns Hopkins University (#5 mid -atlantic), and a nail-biting loss versus ranked Catholic University (#6
Mid-Atlantic) that could have gone either way.

Let's all be honest and throw the ELEPHANT out on the table....VJC's Conference is a new conference which was created by a majority of previously independent schools, and Villa Julie's Q.O.W.I. is taking a
beating because of it.

Keep in mind that Scranton (regionally ranked this week) also lost to Chestnut Hill (NEAC opponent), and if all catagories were created equal, there is no question that VJC should be in the mix.

Villa Julie did a great job of scheduling the toughest schedule they could outside of their conference.  They started out in the Pride of Maryland Tournament where they opened up with a Goucher team that had been 18-9 the year before and had lost to York College in their conference Semi's.  Then they faced Washington College ( a playoff team...4th place in the Centennial Conference), they then defeated Johns Hopkins University.

They then lost a close game to a young St. Mary's team that started the year off 5-2, including a win over Averett (number one seed in there conference), who beat Maryville of Tenn this year.  St. Mary's went down the tubes later, but they were playing good ball at the time.

They also hosted a tournament and invited a tough group of teams.....Regionally ranked Trinity of Connecticut......Elizabethtown (a top four team in the MAC playoffs), and Kean of New Jersey (NJAC at
.500).  Its hard to schedule a tougher tourny.  They lost to E-town and beat Kean.

Another non-conference game was versus Hood College who they beat by 13.  That same Hood College lost to York College(#4 nationally) by 10.  That same Hood team beat New Jersey City (16-7 with a 9.7 SOSI).

VJC has beaten Baptist Bible who this board had annointed one of the top five before they found out they were ineligible.  They have also beaten a Keuka team that has to be talked about in the North-East.

They have put together a great year, and part was done with their point guard injured for seven games....  In which they lost 4 games.  Since he has returned they are 8-1.

The Elephant is out there....

Is the GSAC, Presidents, or the NAIA DII Conf.  Better than the NEAC...........?

Does the South Region deserve two teams?

Taking the ODAC out of the discussion, what has the South region done on a national stage???  Nothing to the final 4.....

The Mid-Atlantic on the other hand has a wonderful history making the final four......

CAC

York (2005 final 4)
Catholic (2001 CHAMPS)


MAC

Wilkes (98' Final 4)
E-Town (2002 runner up)
Scranton (1988 runner up)
Leb Valley (1994 champs)


CC

F&M (1996 final 4, 1991 runner up and 2000 final 4)
Washington College (1990 final four third place)


Penn. A.C.

Alvernia (1997 final 4)


And I only went back to 1988....


That is five different conferences getting some national recognition in the same region.  I just do not think that the south is more deserving than the Mid-Atlantic to get two teams....Obviously with Lincoln as a shoo-in.

Sorry about the length, but I needed to show why Villa Julie should be in the tournament.

[smedindy]

But the numbers add up to the south being about Villa Julie, and the committee likes the numbers. It makes their job easier.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

You can throw that Elephant out there all you want, but they don't look at a weak conference as reason to get in.  Regional Ranking and QOWI is the primary criteria.  If they can pull a regional ranking, then they have a shot.  Although they will have to compete with Bethany, who also has a weak conference, good non-con competition and a better record.

Also, the NCAA doesn't count it as a good win unless the other team is regionally ranked at the end of the year.  There just isn't much case there for them, although I'm sure they are at least as good as Bethany.

[D3_FAN_03]

Okay, I would first like to say that I usually just read all of these posts by such notables as Pat Coleman, Ralph Turner and Hoops Fan, but after seeing all of this I decided it was time for me to get in the act and talk about one of the schools in the heat of Pool B. 

I follow DIII hoops religiously and have been an active reader of the site for a few years now.  Pool B is always one of the most intriguing threads on the whole site, and I just wanted to give some credit to one of the schools that is being somewhat overlooked in their accomplishments.

Let me first say that I agree Lincoln should be a lock for a Pool B bid because of all they have done this year, they have proven worthy of a spot.  I also think that the winner of the GSAC conference whether it be Maryville 19-6 (14-6) or Fisk 15-10 (10-4) deserve one of the bids.  However, lets not over look that Fisk is only 15-10 overall and I know their 9.769 QOWI 44th overall, but still 10 overall losses and a .714 win % in region isn't earth shattering numbers.  I think that Huntington QOWI is too weak to gain them a berth, outside chance if they win the GSAC. 

With all of that being said I think the team that should have the best chance of locking up on of the two remaining Pool B slots is Bethany College (Bethany, WV).  They are currently 21-4 (19-4) in region, just went undefeated in the PrAC conference at 12-0 (which is the first time that has been done since 1993-1994 season when Washington & Jefferson went to the Elite 8), and they are currently riding a 16 game win streak.  Their QOWI is 9.3.64 (68th overall) and their in region win percentage is 19-4 (.826) which is probably the highest in the Pool B contenders.  They also have some quality wins outside of their conference.  Bethany blew out Keystone (20-6) and Pitt-Greensburg (16-9).  Also had key wins against Muskingum who is 17-8 in the OAC at Muskingum.  However, their best win of the season gets the least credit by the committee when they beat DII power Wheeling Jesuit 71-70 at a nuetral site.  Wheeling Jesuit is currently ranked #5 in the East Region in DII and wins 20+ games yearly at that level.  Now if you take a look at their losses they all took place early in the year and to quality teams including Carnegie Mellon 87-85 at the buzzer and to Lake Erie who is the frontrunner in the AMCC.  Their only other losses came to Case-Western at their place the second game of the season followed up by a loss to Marietta in which their stud, Matt Drahos had 21 and 8 at halftime but mysteriously didn't play in the 2nd half, as a result they lost.  Anyways, I just wanted to speak my peace on a team that I feel isn't getting some of the credit they deserve!

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

You can make the case on those facts all you want, but Fisk's 10 losses came to a lot of non-d3 schools, including one in D1, those games will not factor in.

Bethany can count them "good wins" but the NCAA doesn't unless they finished ranked.  Keystone is provisional anyway.

I think Bethany will get in because of some of the numbers you've put up there, but they haven't proven to me they are better than Fisk or Maryville.  That will have to come in the tournament.

[jack johnson]

i would first like to say Lincoln is a lock for the first pool B bid; however, i feel like the other three bids could be between Maryville, Fisk, Bethany, and Villa Julie.  i think the winner of the Fisk, Maryville tourney game will get a bid and Bethany should get a bid over VJC if they give both Maryville and Fisk a bid.  they have one common opponent, Keystone. Bethany handled Keystone fairly easily 103-89.  VJC lost to Keystone 82-56.  just by looking att his game it seems Bethany shoud get the nod over VJC along with their in-region winning percentages and the way Bethany is playing down the stretch with a chance to run the table in the conference and the conference tourney.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

You forgot Nebraska Wesleyan; they are the wild card.  Maybe the NCAA will count them out for not playing enough d3 games, like they did Rust all those years.  Maybe they get ushered into the tournament.  It's just impossible to know.

[jack johnson]

i think that if they give a bid to Nebraska Wesleyan it will take away a bid from either Maryville or Fisk.  i think those three teams are fighting for two spots and Bethany and Villa Julie are battling for one.

[crusaders]

Is everyone counting Clarke out now?  Or do they still have a chance?  And has anyone looked at just how good Lincoln is???  What a team they have, and tell me the last time a guy has lead the nation in scoring and is 2nd in assists.  That is impressive!

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

i think that if they give a bid to Nebraska Wesleyan it will take away a bid from either Maryville or Fisk.  i think those three teams are fighting for two spots and Bethany and Villa Julie are battling for one.

If they give a bid to NebWes it takes a bid away from everybody.

[joe smith]

Jack Johnson, that's an incredible stat in your previous post betwen Bethany and VJC.  Keystone being the only common opponent betwen these two, if they are in fact competing for the final pool B spot, really jumps out at me.  Given, every team can have a bad night but Bethany beat Keystone by 14 while VJC lost by 26.  That's a 40 point difference.  Wonderful stat Jack!!!

[hugenerd]

Bethany could have two academic all-americans this year (both Drahos brothers were first team all district).  The Academic All-America team is announced March 1.  This has nothing to do with NCAA selections but I thought I would throw it in there.  They also have like a 3rd team academic all district player as well.

[Ralph Turner]

Copied from the GSAC board.  #5 seed LaGrange hit a buzzer beater vs #4 Piedmont in the GSAC play-in game.  I have copied my post from the GSAC board.



LaGrange (in-region 6-14, .300) contributes a weaker QOWI value than a victorious Piedmont (at in-region 9-8, .529) would have to everyone that played them, and they have knocked the QOWI value that everyone received from Piedmont by 2 points per game.

Piedmont's in-region record drops from 8-8 (.500) or a 12-13/4-5 QOWI value to 8-9 (.471) or a 10-11/2-3 QOWI value.

IMHO, this hurts the chances of the GSAC from getting at least a 2nd Pool B bid, especially with the uncertainty of the Neb Wes situation.

What we have here now is a "real toy-nah-mint" in the GSAC!!!

In the old Southwest Conference, the 1961 Texas Longhorns were #1 in nation going into the TCU game.  TCU upset the Longhorns, destroying the Longhorns hopes for a National Championship.

In the post-game interview, Texas Head Coach Darrell Royal compared the physically out-manned TCU Horned Frogs to "cockroaches". 

"They're like a bunch of cockroaches. It's not what they eat and tote off, it's what they fall into and mess up that hurts.

Congratulations to Coach Haynes and his "Cockroaches".  Have a fun time messing things up! 

Travel safely all!

[Ralph Turner]

d3hoops8585, I can use the NCAA's criteria and show you why VJC may or may not meet the criteria of a worthy Pool B candidate.

The Keystone, PSU-Berks and PSU-Berks losses have no impact this year.  The 16-4 (.800) in-region record is very good and is one of the primary criteria.  A win over Keuka pushes that to 17-4 (.810).  A plus.

The QOWI is 8.895.  If they defeat Keuka (a 15 QOWI point win) in the NEAC finals, I calculate that their QOWI rises 9.235.  That is a plus.

However, VJC does not have a win over a ranked in-region team; only a loss to Catholic.  That is a minus.

Common Regional opponents vs Lincoln--Baptist Bible 1-0 vs 1-0, a wash.  You would be 2-0 vs. Keuka.

Head-to-head--n/a.

The loss that hurts VJC most is the home loss to St Mary's MD ( 4-10  conference, 6-14 conf, 9-16).  That was a 0-QOWI point (72-70) loss.  Winning that game boosts the QOWI by 0.381 to a potential 9.616.

Actually it looks like the NEAC tourney is good for VJC.  They got a "NESCAC effect" from the "weak" teams in the NEAC, but I don't think that they would have found an in-region schedule as favorable as the NEAC.

Thanks for calling attention to VJC and the NEAC.  A bid will be very good for the conference.  VJC and Keuka are still on my Pool B list.

One shout out to the NEAC Commisioner and the Presidents from the NEAC-3 (Cazenovia, Keuka and D'Youville) who saw the migration of Medaille and Hillard to the AMCC and cobbled together a conference that should grow and evolve.

I don't know what ripples out from the Interstate 8 and its effects, VJC to the Capital AC to wit.  But, you have a conference.  VJC is the southernmost and least geographically compatible.  I think that the conference will thrive with its access to Pool A.  The next few years will be challenging, but you will have the Pool A,  and that is a valuable commodity!

The membership is gaining provisionals Keystone and PSU-Berks and SUNY-Purchase.  Some exploratory schools who may seek membership include Briarcliffe NY, Lancaster Bible College PA, PSU-Harrisburg and possibly SUNY-Cobleskill.  I think that SUNY-Morrisville may favor a football conference.  Nevertheless, you appear to have set a bold example for the workings of a new conference.