Top 25 discussion

[The Champ]

you can only play who's on your schedule

Your conference schedule is etched in stone. 

But your non-conference games are up to the powers that be at your school.  They can schedule cupcakes, or they can schedule challenges.

Schedule tougher non-conference opponents if you want more respect.

[Pat Coleman]

Pat Coleman:

In the daily Dose, you forgot to mention Cortland State as a Debutante in the women's poll this week. They debuted at #24 after winning 21 straight after losing their opener. I hope you correct that oversight.

It's not an oversight.

First of all, David Collinge puts the News and Notes together, and he does a great job. Debutantes are schools that have never been in the Top 25. If we listed everyone coming back to the Top 25 after an absence, no matter how long, it would be a long list and a lot less interesting.

[David Collinge]

If we listed everyone coming back to the Top 25 after an absence, no matter how long, it would be a long list and a lot less interesting.

It'd be a real pain in the butt, too. 

Pat's right (maybe not about the "great job" part, but the rest); I deliberately use the term "debutante" rather than the less specific "debutant" for that reason.  As any sixteen-year-old southern girl can tell you, a debutante can only make her debut one time.  I'm a bit more liberal; I give each team three deb parties: once for the first time receiving votes, once for the first time in the top 25, and once for the first time in the top 10.  Cortland made all three of their debuts in the very first women's poll ever published on this site.

Thanks for reading, jmw73, and I'm glad you care so much that your Dragons get the proper respect! 

[David Collinge]

Top 25 At-a-Glance, Week of Feb. 12-18 (UPDATED with Wednesday scores--and postponement announcements)

#   1   Bowdoin (23-1) hosts Trinity (CT) Sat. (NESCAC Tournament)
#   2   Calvin (22-1) def. Olivet 66-62 and plays at Alma Sat.
#   3   Howard Payne (22-1) hosts Schreiner Thu. and hosts Texas Lutheran Sat.
#   4   Southern Maine (22-1) won at Mass.-Boston 92-50 and plays at Keene St. Sat.
#   5   Messiah (21-2) hosts Elizabethtown Tue.Wed. and hosts Widener Sat.
#   6   Scranton (21-2) plays at Lycoming Tue.Thu. and plays at DeSales Sat.
#   7   NYU (20-2) plays at Case Western Reserve Fri. and plays at Emory Sun.
#   8   Hope (20-3) def. Alma 63-48 and plays at St. Mary's (IN) Sat.
#   9   McMurry (20-3) hosts Mary Hardin-Baylor Thu. and hosts Concordia-Austin Sat.
#   10   Mary Washington (22-2) def. St. Mary's (MD) 72-43 and plays at Catholic Sat.
#   11   DePauw (20-3) hosts Sewanee Fri. and hosts Oglethorpe Sun.
#   12   Washington U. (17-5) plays at Carnegie Mellon Fri. and plays at #16 Rochester Sun.
#   13   Hardin-Simmons (18-4) hosts Concordia-Austin Thu. and hosts Mary Hardin-Baylor Sat.
#   14   Brandeis (17-4) plays at Emory Fri. and plays at Case Western Reserve Sun.
#   15   Emmanuel (23-1) def. Babson 77-56, def. So. Vermont 88-44, def. Pine Manor 77-47, and plays at Rivier Sat.
#   16   Rochester (18-4) hosts Chicago Fri. and hosts #12 Washington U. Sun.
#   17   Lake Forest (20-2) won at Monmouth 95-86 (OT) and hosts Knox Sat.
#   18   UW-Stout (19-5) hosts UW-La Crosse Sat.
#   19   Illinois Wesleyan (19-3) plays at Augustana Tue.Wed. and hosts North Park Sat.
#   20   Wilmington (19-4) plays at Otterbein Wed.Thu. and hosts John Carroll Sat.
#   21   McDaniel (20-2) hosts Bryn Mawr Thu., plays at Washington Coll. Sat., and hosts Franklin & Marshall Sun. (ppd. from Wed.)
#   22   Baldwin-Wallace (18-5) plays at John Carroll Wed.Thu. and hosts Marietta Sat.
#   23   Medaille (19-4) hosts La Roche Wed. and plays at Hilbert Sat.
#   24   Cortland St. (21-1) won at Potsdam St. 67-53, plays at Brockport St. Fri., and hosts Fredonia St. Sat.
#   25   Fitchburg St. (22-1) won at Framingham St. 85-46, hosts Massachusetts Coll. Thu., and plays at Bridgewater St. Sat.

Thanks to Royal Gator and Allen for updates on postponments and un-postponments.

[RoyalGator]

The Scranton - Lycoming game has rescheduled for Thursday.

[deiscanton]

Correction as to the Emmanuel/S. Vermont game-

The women's game between Emmanuel and S. Vermont was played today, according to the official d3sports.com scoreboard.

Emmanuel def. S. Vermont by a score of 88 to 44.

As to the weather forecast, Boston is under a winter storm warning for the impending snowstorm.  The storm is scheduled to start right about now in the Boston, MA area, but the snow won't become heavy until the morning commute Wednesday.  Snow is scheduled to accumulate over 6 inches in Boston before a changeover Wednesday afternoon to a mix of sleet and rain.  However, the storm is scheduled to last through Wednesday evening in Boston.

At the Emmanuel vs. Babson game on Monday, I talked to coach Andy Yosinoff about the storm's impact on Wednesday night's Emmanuel vs. Pine Manor GNAC game.  As of Monday, since Pine Manor is only located about 2 miles from Emmanuel, the two schools were trying to make every effort to see if the game can be played Wednesday night, but depending on the weather on Wednesday, if the refs can't travel to the game, it could be postponed until Thursday, but every effort will be made to get the game in on Wednesday if possible.

Nevertheless, I won't be travelling to Boston on Wednesday no matter what happens.

[Pat Coleman]

Correction as to the Emmanuel/S. Vermont game-

The women's game between Emmanuel and S. Vermont was played today, according to the official d3sports.com scoreboard.

Emmanuel def. S. Vermont by a score of 88 to 44.

Which is an improvement, considering they posted first that it was postponed.

[Dark Knight]

There is much variability between the strength of the best and the worst of D-III women's basketball teams and much variability from region to region. I thought it would be interesting to see how the top teams have done against other teams that are in the top 50 according to Massey's power rating, and against non-DIII teams of equal strength. These results do not account for this week's games. Here's what I came up with:

		Vs. Top 50	Average MoV
1	Bowdoin	1-0	10
2	Calvin	6-1	8.4
3	Howard Payne	8-1	17
4	S. Maine	0-1	-15
5	Messiah	1-0	9
6	Scranton	0-2	-19
7	NYU	6-2	7.1
8	Hope	5-3	4.8
9	McMurry	5-3	-1.3
10	Mary Washington	0-1	-9
11	DePauw	6-2	9.8

[feces monkey]

I assume by this chart that Bowdoin is not considered a Top 50 team according to Massey. Is this correct?

[Dark Knight]

I assume by this chart that Bowdoin is not considered a Top 50 team according to Massey. Is this correct?

Bowdoin is #11 according to Massey, and I neglected to count it in S Maine's results because of a software bug. I've corrected the table, and it doesn't appear that any other games were omitted for that reason.

[Dark Knight]

		Vs. Top 50	Average MoV
1	Bowdoin	1-0	10
2	Calvin	6-1	8.4
3	Howard Payne	8-1	17
4	S. Maine	0-1	-15
5	Messiah	1-0	9
6	Scranton	0-2	-19
7	NYU	6-2	7.1
8	Hope	5-3	4.8
9	McMurry	5-3	-1.3
10	Mary Washington	0-1	-9
11	DePauw	6-2	9.8

So, no comments on this?

How does Scranton deserve to be in the top 25, with no wins against top-50 teams and two blow-out losses?

How does Howard Payne not deserve to be #1?

[David Collinge]

Top 25 At-a-Glance, Week of Feb. 12-18 (UPDATED with Friday scores)

#   1   Bowdoin (23-1) hosts Trinity (CT) Sat. (NESCAC Tournament)
#   2   Calvin (22-1) def. Olivet 66-62 and plays at Alma Sat.
#   3   Howard Payne (23-1) def. Schreiner 90-29 and hosts Texas Lutheran Sat.
#   4   Southern Maine (22-1) won at Mass.-Boston 92-50 and plays at Keene St. Sat.
#   5   Messiah (22-2) def. Elizabethtown 76-53 and hosts Widener Sat.
#   6   Scranton (22-2) won at Lycoming 65-39 and plays at DeSales Sat.
#   7   NYU (21-2) won at Case Western Reserve 68-65 and plays at Emory Sun.
#   8   Hope (20-3) def. Alma 63-48 and plays at St. Mary's (IN) Sat.
#   9   McMurry (21-3) def. Mary Hardin-Baylor 68-60 (OT) and hosts Concordia-Austin Sat.
#   10   Mary Washington (22-2) def. St. Mary's (MD) 72-43 and plays at Catholic Sat.
#   11   DePauw (21-3) def. Sewanee 80-47 and hosts Oglethorpe Sun.
#   12   Washington U. (18-5) won at Carnegie Mellon 72-55 and plays at #16 Rochester Sun.
#   13   Hardin-Simmons (19-4) def. Concordia-Austin 91-51 and hosts Mary Hardin-Baylor Sat.
#   14   Brandeis (18-4) won at Emory 58-51 and plays at Case Western Reserve Sun.
#   15   Emmanuel (23-1) def. Babson 77-56, def. So. Vermont 88-44, def. Pine Manor 77-47, and plays at Rivier Sat.
#   16   Rochester (19-4) def. Chicago 64-59 and hosts #12 Washington U. Sun.
#   17   Lake Forest (20-2) won at Monmouth 95-86 (OT) and hosts Knox Sat.
#   18   UW-Stout (19-5) hosts UW-La Crosse Sat.
#   19   Illinois Wesleyan (20-3) won at Augustana 84-68 and hosts North Park Sat.
#   20   Wilmington (20-4) won at Otterbein 103-100 (OT) and hosts John Carroll Sat.
#   21   McDaniel (21-2) def. Bryn Mawr 60-42, plays at Washington Coll. Sat., and hosts Franklin & Marshall Sun. (ppd. from Wed.)
#   22   Baldwin-Wallace (18-6) lost at John Carroll 61-58 and hosts Marietta Sat.
#   23   Medaille (20-4) def. La Roche 72-47 and plays at Hilbert Sat.
#   24   Cortland St. (21-2) won at Potsdam St. 67-53, lost at Brockport St. 55-52, and hosts Fredonia St. Sat.
#   25   Fitchburg St. (23-1) won at Framingham St. 85-46, def. Massachusetts Coll. 86-40, and plays at Bridgewater St. Sat.

[Ralph Turner]

		Vs. Top 50	Average MoV
1	Bowdoin	1-0	10
2	Calvin	6-1	8.4
3	Howard Payne	8-1	17
4	S. Maine	0-1	-15
5	Messiah	1-0	9
6	Scranton	0-2	-19
7	NYU	6-2	7.1
8	Hope	5-3	4.8
9	McMurry	5-3	-1.3
10	Mary Washington	0-1	-9
11	DePauw	6-2	9.8

So, no comments on this?

How does Scranton deserve to be in the top 25, with no wins against top-50 teams and two blow-out losses?

How does Howard Payne not deserve to be #1?

Let us in the ASC win a National Championship and then I can comment on whether HPU deserves to be #1.

McMurry looks perfectly positioned at #9.

[HPU75]

Dark Knight:

As an HPU fan who has seen our team numerous times in person this year(6 or 7)  and listened to many others on the internet and read everything I can, I think I can answer your question.

1.  We are very very good and I believe are capable of beating anyone.

2. I am not sure Massey automatically equates to the "best " team.

3. The national rep of the ASC still has a ways to go, but the Final Four by Hardin-Simmons last year surely helps. Our HPU team last year was very comparable to that Final Four team of HSU and we are significantly better this year(all 5 starters back, point guard back who was hurt in conf. tourney and did not play in last loss to HSU in 2nd round, 1-2 against HSU last year--all close games).

4.  We have better shooting, better balance, better rebounding, better depth this year, but I think the national reputation takes years to develop and we are still getting there.

5. Believe me, every HPU fan is pretty excited about #3 and we are  looking forward to the playoffs to see what we can do. Of course, we most likely will  have to play our top 25 conference opponents HSU or McMurry to get past the second round.  It would be nice to start off without facing a top 10 or 15 opponent but I doubt if the NCAA wiil cooperate with our outpost in Texas  getting to see anyone else!!

6.  The conference tourney and ncaa tourney should be fun to watch!!

[feces monkey]

It would be interesting to see how the QoWI compares with the power ranking.