Pool C

[Ralph Turner]

South Region

McMurry (ASC-W) 17 1 .944  19 1 .950 
Randolph-Macon (ODAC) 16 1 .941  18 2 .900 
Hardin-Simmons (ASC-W) 16 2 .889  17 2 .895 
Mississippi College (ASC-E) 16 2 .889  16 2 .889 
*Oglethorpe (SCAC) 15 2 .882  17 3 .850 
Greensboro (USAC) 10 2 .833  13 6 .684 
Howard Payne (ASC-W) 14 3 .824  16 3 .842   4 teams>.799

Bridgewater (Va.) (ODAC) 15 4 .789  15 4 .789 
Maryville (Tenn.) (GSAC) 13 4 .765  14 5 .737  Pool B Candidate
*Trinity (Texas) (SCAC) 9 3 .750  14 5 .737 
Agnes Scott (GSAC) 9 3 .750  11 9 .550    Pool B Candidate
Virginia Wesleyan (ODAC) 11 4 .733  13 6 .684  7 non-Pool B teams>.699

The ASC determines its Pool A bid by an 8-team post-season tourney which will be held on the "East" this year.

*DePauw has the best record in the SCAC.

[Ralph Turner]

Great Lakes Region

Baldwin-Wallace (OAC) 16 0 1.000  18 2 .900  
*DePauw (SCAC) 14 0 1.000  20 1 .952 
Finlandia (IND) 2 0 1.000  7 12 .368  Provisional
Hope (MIAA) 16 1 .941  19 1 .950  
Calvin (MIAA) 10 1 .909  17 2 .895 
Washington and Jefferson (PrAC) 12 2 .857  16 3 .842   Pool B
Franklin (HCAC) 14 3 .824  17 3 .850 
Capital (OAC) 13 3 .813  17 3 .850 
Denison (NCAC) 13 3 .813  17 4 .810  2 non-Pool B>.799

Otterbein (OAC) 14 4 .778  16 4 .800 
**Pitt-Greensburg (AMCC) 13 4 .765  16 4 .800 
Thomas More (PrAC) 11 4 .733  15 6 .714   Pool B
Wittenberg (NCAC) 12 5 .706  14 6 .700 
Wilmington (OAC) 14 6 .700  14 6 .700   6 non-Pool B>.699

*DePauw has the best record in the SCAC.
**Medaille has the best record in the AMCC.

[Ralph Turner]

Central Region

Maryville (Mo.) (SLIAC) 9 0 1.000  15 4 .789  
Rockford (NIIC) 15 2 .882  17 3 .850    Pool B
Lawrence (MWC) 13 2 .867  17 2 .895 
*Washington U. (UAA) 11 2 .846  17 2 .895 
Wheaton (Ill.) (CCIW) 11 2 .846  16 3 .842 
Carroll (MWC) 13 3 .813  16 3 .842         1 non-Pool B>.799

Illinois Wesleyan (CCIW) 12 4 .750  15 5 .750 
Concordia (Wis.) (LMC) 14 5 .737  15 7 .682 
UW-Oshkosh (WIAC) 13 5 .722  15 6 .714 
UW-Stevens Point (WIAC) 12 5 .706  15 5 .750    3 non-Pool B>.699


*WashStL has the best record in the UAA.

[Ralph Turner]

West Region

Simpson (IIAC) 12 0 1.000  17 3 .850  
Puget Sound (NWC) 15 2 .882  18 3 .857 
Pacific Lutheran (NWC) 11 2 .846  16 3 .842 
Concordia-Moorhead (MIAC) 14 3 .824  15 4 .789 
St. Benedict (MIAC) 13 3 .813  15 4 .789         2 teams>.799

Luther (IIAC) 10 3 .769  14 4 .778 
Cal Lutheran (SCIAC) 9 3 .750  13 5 .722  
Chapman (IND) 8 3 .727  12 6 .667              Pool B
Gustavus Adolphus (MIAC) 13 5 .722  13 5 .722 
Buena Vista (IIAC) 10 4 .714  12 7 .632     5 non-Pool B>.699

[Ralph Turner]

I count 19 teams >.799 and 44 teams >.699.

The Handbook states that there will 4 Pool B bids and 21 Pool C bids awarded.  I believe we can see the Pool C contenders (and Pool B contenders) from these lists.

[Pat Coleman]

My apologies for not getting to this yesterday, but here are the updated QOWIs through games of Thursday, Feb. 2. Although I did not post these until today, they do account for all regional games through Thursday and none of Friday's results.

1-10
DePauw     12.923
Southern Maine    12.059
Scranton    11.929
Williams    11.765
Rochester    11.706
Mary Washington    11.667
Baldwin-Wallace    11.625
Brandeis    11.625
Bowdoin    11.600
Hope    11.353
               
11-20
New York University    11.222
St. John Fisher    11.188
Cortland State    11.133
Bates    11.056
Randolph-Macon    11.000
Wesleyan    11.000
Oglethorpe    11.000
Messiah    11.000
McMurry    10.833
Washington U.    10.750
               
21-30
Simpson    10.750
Mount St. Mary    10.722
Pacific Lutheran    10.692
Capital    10.625
Puget Sound    10.625
Richard Stockton    10.611
Eastern Connecticut    10.579
William Smith    10.571
Mississippi College    10.500
Carroll    10.400
               
31-40
Hardin-Simmons    10.389
Illinois Wesleyan    10.375
Bridgewater (Va.)    10.368
Concordia-Moorhead    10.353
Muhlenberg    10.350
Medaille    10.294
Wheaton (Ill.)    10.231
Lawrence    10.214
Mount Holyoke    10.188
Springfield    10.167
               
41-50
Colby-Sawyer    10.167
Union    10.167
Moravian    10.158
UW-Oshkosh    10.111
Greensboro    10.083
Salem State    10.063
Otterbein    10.056
Wittenberg    10.000
Maryville (Mo.)    10.000
St. Benedict    10.000
               
51-60
Catholic    10.000
Middlebury    10.000
UW-La Crosse    9.938
St. Lawrence    9.933
Calvin    9.909
Trinity (Texas)    9.909
Gwynedd-Mercy    9.889
Maine-Farmington    9.882
Norwich    9.875
Johns Hopkins    9.867
               
61-70
Emory    9.857
UW-Stevens Point    9.824
Howard Payne    9.765
Chapman    9.727
Endicott    9.706
Oneonta State    9.706
Baruch    9.688
Emmanuel    9.688
Denison    9.667
Washington and Jefferson    9.643
               
71-80
Bridgewater State    9.625
Luther    9.615
Gustavus Adolphus    9.611
Chicago    9.600
Virginia Wesleyan    9.600
RPI    9.571
McDaniel    9.526
Wilmington    9.500
Rockford    9.471
New Jersey    9.471
               
81-90
Franklin    9.471
George Fox    9.455
Hood    9.385
Ripon    9.375
Maine Maritime    9.375
St. Norbert    9.375
Dickinson    9.316
Oswego State    9.313
Montclair State    9.278
Cal Lutheran    9.250
               
91-100
La Verne    9.200
Elmira    9.167
North Park    9.133
Lakeland    9.125
Maryville (Tenn.)    9.118
DeSales    9.105
Millikin    9.063
Keene State    9.059
Ithaca    9.000
Albright    9.000

[Pat Coleman]

1-10
Scranton     12.467
DePauw    12.400
Southern Maine    12.111
Baldwin-Wallace    11.706
Mary Washington    11.563
Bowdoin    11.529
Williams    11.526
Hope    11.471
Rochester    11.316
Messiah    11.125
               
11-20
Washington U.    11.071
St. John Fisher    11.056
Bates    11.000
New York University    11.000
Richard Stockton    11.000
Brandeis    11.000
Cortland State    10.882
Puget Sound    10.882
Pacific Lutheran    10.857
Randolph-Macon    10.833
               
21-30
Mount St. Mary    10.684
Wesleyan    10.684
Carroll    10.588
McMurry    10.579
Oglethorpe    10.556
St. Benedict    10.500
Capital    10.471
Muhlenberg    10.450
Concordia-Moorhead    10.421
Simpson    10.417
               
31-40
Maryville (Mo.)    10.400
Moravian    10.400
William Smith    10.375
Wheaton (Ill.)    10.357
Wittenberg    10.333
Lawrence    10.313
Emory    10.250
Salem State    10.235
Colby-Sawyer    10.158
Hardin-Simmons    10.158
               
41-50
Gwynedd-Mercy    10.150
Eastern Connecticut    10.150
Illinois Wesleyan    10.118
Norwich    10.118
Maine-Farmington    10.000
Springfield    10.000
Mississippi College    10.000
Calvin    10.000
Gustavus Adolphus    10.000
Bridgewater (Va.)    9.952
               
51-60
UW-Stevens Point    9.944
Maine Maritime    9.889
Otterbein    9.842
UW-Oshkosh    9.842
Medaille    9.833
UW-La Crosse    9.765
Mount Holyoke    9.765
Johns Hopkins    9.750
Catholic    9.737
Bridgewater State    9.706
               
61-70
St. Lawrence    9.706
Chapman    9.667
Baruch    9.667
Union    9.650
McDaniel    9.650
Emmanuel    9.647
Denison    9.647
Franklin    9.611
Maryville (Tenn.)    9.611
St. Norbert    9.556
               
71-80
Ripon    9.556
Howard Payne    9.556
Endicott    9.556
Dickinson    9.550
Chicago    9.529
Oneonta State    9.526
New Jersey    9.500
Greensboro    9.462
Luther    9.429
Montclair State    9.421
               
81-90
Carleton    9.389
Hood    9.385
Middlebury    9.368
Oswego State    9.353
DeSales    9.350
UW-Stout    9.313
Cal Lutheran    9.308
Wilmington    9.286
Lakeland    9.235
Trinity (Texas)    9.231
               
91-100
Nichols    9.222
Virginia Wesleyan    9.188
Western New England    9.176
Elmira    9.143
Christopher Newport    9.125
Marymount    9.125
Salve Regina    9.100
George Fox    9.077
Washington and Jefferson    9.067
Albright    9.059

[jagluski]

Has there been any thought within in the NCAA about changing the QoWI?  To me, this doesn't really seem like a good rating system.  I guess I'm thinking something that better accounts for strength of schedule.

Hypothetically, a team could play and win all road games against teams from .333 to .500 (which I realize isn't possible and even less possible with conference schedules),  or split home and road games with teams from .333 to .500 for 22 or so games and then beat 3 good teams(+.667) at home.  This would give them a QoWI of 11 in the first case and 10.92(it's still 10.68 if the teams are .500-.667) in the second case, which would rank about 13th on the list...probably guaranteeing a Pool B/C bid, especially with the gowdy record.  Even a loss in one of the +.667 games, wouldn't hurt this ranking much; the 10.92 would only fall to 10.68.

However, is this hypothetical team really as good as or better than Wash U(which I use because I know the team as an alum, so I can best use them to make my argument) and has a really close QoWI to this 11(11.071).  Wash U has beaten DePauw, Brandeis, Rochester(x2), Chicago, and Emory and lost to NYU and Maryville. 

This seems like a much stronger schedule than what I suggested in the first scenario and that a team playing it with the record Wash U has(18-2) would be much better than the team with the hypothetical QoWI of about 11 above(at either 25-0 or 25-1). 

I'm not saying Brandeis/Rochester are not good teams(in fact, I think they're definitely tournament caliber and can make noise in the tournament---just the opposite), but I am just using them here because they illustrate my point well(I am NOT trying to equate them with the hypothetical team I developed earlier).  Brandeis's QoWI is 11.  Wash U beat them by 17.  Rochester's QoWI is 11.316 and Wash U beat them by 24 at home and 4 on the road.  (To account for the flip side, Wash U did lose to NYU with a QoWI of 11 by 2 and Maryville with a QoWI of 10.400 by 7).

I guess to me, it just seems that this system, as is, is flawed.  Is a home win over a team that has a winning percentage <.333 always better than a close road(or home) loss to a good team?  I would argue not always and rarely ever, especially in terms of getting ready for the close games of the tournament, but the QoWI rankings suggest yes.

I dont know why the NCAA couldn't just use it's RPI system(it already has it developed) and calculate it for D3.  I don't know what the right system is...I don't have any answers, but these are just thoughts I've been having recently.  I'm sure the NCAA doesn't want to spend time figuring it out though because D3 women's basketball doesn't generate too much revenue.

Thoughts?

[Pat Coleman]

Yes, there is talk about changing the measurement. Something was put on the ballot for the last NCAA convention but was tabled for further discussion.

With the advent of computerization and the ability to analyze reams of data, I think we will head this direction.

[jagluski]

Thanks...I think that would be really good for the game.

[Pat Coleman]

Regional rankings:
http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=125

[Pat Coleman]

Updated QOWI through games of Thursday, Feb. 9. Now includes regional record.

1-10
DePauw     12.400     15-0
Southern Maine    12.211    18-1
Scranton    12.188    16-0
Baldwin-Wallace    11.778    18-0
Bowdoin    11.765    15-2
Hope    11.556    17-1
Williams    11.526    16-3
Messiah    11.353    16-1
Rochester    11.316    15-4
Mary Washington    11.235    17-0

11-20
Brandeis    11.111    15-3
Bates    11.105    14-5
Randolph-Macon    10.944    17-1
Washington U.    10.929    12-2
New York University    10.900    17-3
Cortland State    10.882    16-1
St. John Fisher    10.842    17-2
Wesleyan    10.789    15-4
Richard Stockton    10.700    17-3
Oglethorpe    10.667    16-2

21-30
Puget Sound    10.647    15-2
Mount St. Mary    10.600    18-2
Muhlenberg    10.591    20-2
Gwynedd-Mercy    10.571    18-3
Pacific Lutheran    10.571    12-2
Capital    10.556    15-3
Carroll    10.471    14-3
Moravian    10.381    17-4
William Smith    10.375    13-3
McMurry    10.350    18-2

31-40
Colby-Sawyer    10.300    16-4
Johns Hopkins    10.278    16-2
Wheaton (Ill.)    10.267    13-2
Emory    10.250    10-6
Salem State    10.222    15-3
Springfield    10.200    15-5
Eastern Connecticut    10.190    16-5
St. Benedict    10.158    16-3
Simpson    10.154    13-0
Wittenberg    10.105    14-5
               
41-50
Bridgewater (Va.)    10.091    18-4
Illinois Wesleyan    10.056    13-5
Hardin-Simmons    10.050    18-2
Calvin    10.000    11-1
Maryville (Mo.)    10.000    11-0
Medaille    9.947    18-1
Lawrence    9.941    15-2
Mississippi College    9.900    17-3
Maine-Farmington    9.900    17-3
UW-Stevens Point    9.895    13-6
               
51-60
Norwich    9.889    15-3
Mount Holyoke    9.889    14-4
Gustavus Adolphus    9.857    16-5
UW-Oshkosh    9.842    13-6
Otterbein    9.800    15-5
Franklin    9.789    16-3
UW-La Crosse    9.778    12-6
Emmanuel    9.778    14-4
McDaniel    9.762    16-5
Concordia-Moorhead    9.750    15-5
               
61-70
Endicott    9.737    12-7
Maine Maritime    9.737    16-3
Howard Payne    9.737    16-3
St. Lawrence    9.667    15-3
Chapman    9.615    10-3
Bridgewater State    9.611    15-3
Baruch    9.579    15-4
St. Norbert    9.579    13-6
Dickinson    9.571    16-5
Greensboro    9.571    11-3
               
71-80
Union    9.550    13-7
Chicago    9.529    12-5
Denison    9.529    14-3
Maryville (Tenn.)    9.500    14-4
Oswego State    9.500    14-4
Catholic    9.500    13-7
Lakeland    9.500    13-5
New Jersey    9.474    13-6
Wilmington    9.455    15-7
Ripon    9.421    12-7

81-90
UW-Stout    9.412    12-5
Montclair State    9.400    14-6
Western New England    9.368    14-5
DeSales    9.333    13-8
Keene State    9.316    13-6
Carleton    9.316    13-6
Oneonta State    9.316    14-5
Middlebury    9.300    13-7
Virginia Wesleyan    9.235    12-5
Trinity (Texas)    9.231    10-3
               
91-100
Cal Lutheran    9.214    11-3
Texas-Tyler    9.158    14-5
Nichols    9.150    15-5
Luther    9.133    12-3
RPI    9.125    10-6
Wesley    9.105    14-5
William Paterson    9.100    11-9
Marymount    9.059    11-6
UW-Whitewater    9.059    9-8
UW-Eau Claire    9.053    10-9

[Pat Coleman]

Regional rankings: http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=128

[fisheralum03]

Pat, how can ROCHESTER with a regional record of 16-5 be ranked ahead of teams like Medaille, Cortland STATE or Fisher?? I'd put them ahead of NYU b/c they beat them twice.  Is it basically based on head to head record as the first criteria??

[jagluski]

Pat, how can ROCHESTER with a regional record of 16-5 be ranked ahead of teams like Medaille, Cortland STATE or Fisher?? I'd put them ahead of NYU b/c they beat them twice.  Is it basically based on head to head record as the first criteria??

Without looking at anything, I have a strong hunch.  Who have Medaille, Cortland State, Fisher played/beaten?  My guess is absolutely no one with any regional ranking/standing.