FB: Northern Athletics Collegiate Conference

[baseman201]

Jaybird-

THE WHOLE POINT OF BOWL GAMES....$$$, I agree with you yes.

So I said they could name the playoff games for bowls.  Maybe a semifinal game being sponsored by Tostitos, then the championship game being sponsored by Nokia or something like that.  First round games being sponsored by "smaller" companies like the San Diego Credit Union.

IT CAN BE DONE!!!!!

I am glad we all agree on that along with probably 98% of this country.

[79jaybird]

My guiding phrase is "if there is a will, there is a way"  and anything can be accomplished.  I would love to see a D-1 Nat'l Tournament to decide the football champion.

[bufan]

Using computers is not a joke.  If you wanna take the top 4 teams and do a playoff, I can see that, no arguments.  But someone suggested every conference winner??  Ok, lets see Troy or Middle Tennessee St from the Sunbelt, great you get USC first round, good luck.  They dont deserve a chance because they are not one of the best teams.  I think you agree with me that MTSU is not one of the best teams in the nation so why do the deserve a chance?  The arguments you hear about who got snubbed from D3 or D2 are only as publicized as the sive of the event.  If there was a playoff in D1 it would be HUGE debate/controversey whatever, there would be snubbed teams and such.  The general public doesnt know that cortland state didnt make it.. but if LSU got snubbed??? then it would be something to talk about.  The BCS gives you the two top teams in the nation whether you like it or not.  If USC loses on sat. and Mich is number two, fine, then thy are the top 2, if florida jumps them(doubtful) then they are the top 2.  It gives you the top 2 teams, which is its purpose.

Again i love that 15 seed over 2 as suggested by someone, I really do.  But is it the absolute BEST way to dtermine the best team throughout the regular season?  Other wise, by having a playoff what ure saying is, its ok to lose a game or 2.  I want my national championship game to have 2 teams who have sustained a consistent level of play throughout the year, not 2 teams that are just "hot" at the moment.

[79jaybird]

BUFan, if you are a #2 seed and you can't beat a #15, then you don't deserve a chance to dive deeper into the playoffs, because you are only as good as your last win.  IMO, the less CPU involvement the better, and the more head-head on the field battles, the better.

[79jaybird]

What if you had this scenario

Winner of Big 10 vs. Winner of Pac 10
Winner of SEC  vs. Winner of ACC
Winner of Big East vs. Winner of the WAC MTN
Winner of WAC  vs. Winner of the Big 12
Winner of the Sun Belt vs. _______ a highly ranked, good record #2 team

The Winners advance and the losers are done.  As somebody said earlier, this would not be very difficult to arrange but you have $$ issues, time too.  As much as I wouldn't mind seeing the football season extended, a Tournament format would lengten the football season by 2-3 weeks.

[baseman201]

Bufan-

Thats how brackets work, the top ranked teams plays the low ranked teams, hence the #16 seed playing the #1 seed in the basketball bracket, so then do you have a problem with that?

What if they used computers in basketball too?

Hey, how about we tell George Mason that since they are an 11th seed they don't deserve to play the top teams in the nation and won't have a chance to play. (went on to the final four)

EVERYONE DESERVES A CHANCE!!!

If USC is so good, they can prove it by making it through the bracket to the national championship, if not then they don't deserve to be there.........period.

And like I said there are only 12 conferences in D-I A football, only 12 teams.  Guarantee the season would be over before the 1st of January.  So they can't use the excuse of taking too long.  And Jaybird, some teams will be sitting around for longer then 2-3 weeks waiting for their bowl game anyhow

I like your bracket scenario though.

[bufan]

baseman

I understand how brackets work and I do agree that the season would actually be slightly shorter if there were a playoff.  The time off is ridiculous, I think we all can agree.  The comparison of basketball and football is apples to oranges.  You think Oral Roberts football(dont know if they even have it) would beat Kansas football?  Basketball has a lot of parity in it as you can see with Butler beating Tennessee and Gonzaga.  Would Butler's winless football team beat Tennessee football? Come on.  So that is why that comparison is not valid in my opinion.  And there are so many D-1 basketball teams that I do feel you need more teams in the post season.  The NCAA is not in favor of the higher ranked teams, it is built for upsets.  I dont wanna get into it too much, but i thinkwe are in somewhat agreement that the higher seeds are at a disadvantage in most cases.

That aside, but we are in agreement that given USC wins against UCLA, we will see the best two teams in the nation playing in Glendale...if you answered yes then the system has worked.  We have the two best teams playing for the nat'l champ., thats the goal

[Fartcus Smellwood]

I am going to have to disagree because I don't think USC is the second best team out there. I still think U of M is the better team and I promise you, I can't stand U of M so this isn't out of favoritism...I am a ND fan and have a huge grudge on both teams. U of M loses to #1, USC loses to Oregon St.

Does nobody think U of M would beat USC?
Besides that, whoever ends up playing OSU is going to get beat and I even feel like crap for saying that because they embarrassed ND last year in their bowl game (0 for 3 ).

Playoffs would be a great idea and would bring way more excitement to D-1 football. Baseman and Jaybird, you should team up and go figure something out...you can do it.haha.

[formerd3db]

bufan:
It is legit to compare football to basketball as far as the playoffs.  So what if one team is "hot" at the moment and the other not?  That's what it's all about.  Just because one team is in the overall aspects better than another team, means nothing.  Look at this last year, for example in the NHL, MLB and the NBA with all the Detroit teams - record wise, they clearly were the best in the leagues; unfortunately, they hit a slump at playoff time.  Do you seriously think that the other teams that beat them didn't deserve the chance and do not consider themselves worthy of the title of champs?  Ridiculous to think otherwise, IMO.  Same with collegiate football - you take a chance, play the game on the field and whatever happens, happens.  If you win, you played better and are the champ - that's how it works.  

[bufan]

Ok im gonna steal Bob Davie's thought, but it is very valid.  If there was a playoff, whether it be 4 teams, 8 teams, 16..it is very safe to say Michigan and Ohio State would be in.  We will all agree.  What do teams do when they know they are in the playoffs?  They rest there starters.  So thats what we would have likely seen in the Mich-OSU game.  Wouldnt have been much  of a game if that was the case.  Aside from being a rivalry game, that game was so huge because of what was at stake, because of the BCS system that gave was excitement times 100.  If there was a playoff it would have been another chapter in their rivalry, yes, and still exciting, but not near was exciting as it was because they would both be in the playoffs anyways.  The game was given additional meaning because of what was at stake.

You may argue that well they had the Big Ten Championship to play for.  Yes they did, but if a national championship is at stake, is the big ten title more important?

formerd3db, thats the problem, its all about a team getting hot. And again the comparison is unfair to pro sports.  I believe in the Eastern conference of the NBA there was a team under .500 in the playoffs(within the last couple years or so)  ARE YOU KIDDING? your telling me they deserve a chance.. the format is what it is, yes, but tell me ure honest feeling about that.

Marcus- if ure argument is who U OF M and USC lost too, my argument is again, who they beat.  Michigan beat nobody, they embarrassed ND(and until Brady Quinn wins a big game, im still not a believer), which USC did as well. They beat central michigan and ball st.  And ill be nice and say the beat Wis. who is GARBAGE. yes Garbage.  USC has beat Ark, Neb, Cal, and lost to Oreg. st who is now 24th in the BCS...so apparently voters think something of them.  IF YOUR GOING TO COMPARE LOSSES YOU MUST COMPARE WINS

Hey i can defend man to man, but i can go zone too..I will argue this as long as you'd like.  Everyone has their opinion on who is best or second best and so on.  The bottom line is so do these voters.  I dont want there opinions and bias, cause they do the same thing we are doing, sitting around deciding who is best.  I want a clear cut no. 1 and no. 2.

And no U of M most certainly would not beat USC.  Michigan gave up 500 yds of offense, forced 3 turnovers and still lost to Ohio State. IF USC allows 500 yards to OSU I will send you a gift certificate to ure favorite restaurant.  And what makes everyone thing that this rematch, if it were to happen would be like the first game??  I dont think Texas quite had 500 yds last year, maybe they did..not sure  I know vince young had over 450 himself cause he is absurd...but ne ways USC's defense is statistically better than last year, and OSU's offense is no where near what Texas's was.

I am a buckeye fan, i live in ohio, but i wouldnt be so sure that USC would lose for sure.

[79jaybird]

If Michigan was the better/best team out there, then they would have taken care of business the 1st time and beat Ohio St.  Ohio St. beat them fair and square, and IMO I don't think Michigan deserves a second chance to knock off OSU, when there is an equally strong opponent out there. (USC)

BUFan-- Oral Roberts does not have a football team, but like Wichita St.  they did have a fb team at one time in their history.  Wichita St. discontinued their football after that tragedy (understandable), but I do think if they were to start up a football team again, they could create a nice rivalry with Illinois St., SW Missouri St., SIU, etc.

NHL- 8 teams total 16 NBA 8 teams total 16  NFL  16 total (I believe)

This is a never ending debate that is always going to be blockaded by corporate america because the $$ is the underlying factor here.

Last thing,  I see Northern Illinois is most likely going to the Pointsettia Bowl.  Pointsettia Bowl?  "What's next, rabbies shots for the Easter Bunny?"

Pointsettia Bowl, International Bowl, Insight. Com Bowl, c'mon we could do with 6-7 bowls total.
Rose,Orange,Fiesta,Sugar, Holiday, Alamo, Cotton, and perhaps 1-2 more.

[formerd3db]

bufan:
No way is the comparison unfair to pro sports.  The game is played on the court and on the field regardless of level.  And yes, a lower tier team deserves the same chance as anyone else, especially if they win the conference tournaments, like so many of the conferences at all levels have gone through.  Since the system is currently set up that way, that's, of course, why there are at-large bids - to provide for the better teams who won the regular season final, but faltered in the conference tournament and/or for the football playoffs in college; of course at the pro level the wild-card slots.  While you are right in the the majority of times the better team will win, by your logic, why even then play the games?  The top 2-4 teams in the nation, then can have their alleged claims as to who was best; and... in the same sense that we, at times, make rationalizations for a loss i.e. should of, could have, what if, et al, the same guess work speculation is applied to who's "opinion" is the better team, bias included; just like we've seen yesterday and today.  You don't think any of the top 4 or 5 teams (for that matter the top 10 teams at least) in DI currently don't deserve a shot at chance at the national championship? Let them sort it out on the field, then there's no question, plain and simple AND it doesn't matter if your team is in reality the better team.  If you don't play good enough at all times to win the game(s), you don't win the championship.  Having an "off day", hitting a slump at playoff time is just part of life, like anything else.  Otherwise, no point to having any playoffs at any level, which, of course, I disagree with.  But then, what do I know?  

[Cougswillwin]

Everyone is talking about D-1 playoffs here so here is my take....


I think there still should be the BCS system.  However, I think those that make the BCS games should be the teams that make the D-1 playoffs.  What I'm saying is that the top 8 teams according to the BCS make the "D-1 playoffs".  This also will cut back on the time that the BCS teams wait to play thier game according to the current format.  Someone said before the playoff games can be sponsored by the companies of the big time bowls, and I agree.  Each playoff game can still be called a bowl game, such as the Sugar Bowl, Coton Bowl, you get my drift.  And as the BCS does now, the title game can be rotated, Rose Bowl one year, Sugar Bowl next year, you know how it works.  As for the rest of the teams not in the top 8, I still think they should play thier bowl games as normal. 

I dont know what many people will think of this idea, but I think this is a very feasable way of deciding a Nat'l Champ, top 8 teams according to the BCS are in a playoff and the other "bowl teams" still play their bowl games.  Anyways, thats my input, let me know what you guys think.

[bufan]

formerd3db

You just said "If you don't play good enough at all times to win the game(s), you don't win the championship."  Would this include the regular season?  In BCS terms, good enough is numbr 1 and number 2.  All other 117 d-1 teams arent good enough.  I want the best two teams playing in my championship game.

This may slightly sound like a contradiction but follow me.  Im believe that Oral Roberts is a better basketball team than Kansas and I know you guys will disagree with me, but all i have to go off of is head-to-head play.  With that said, If there was a playoff and Louisville beat OSU(just an example of teams in the top 8)  I have to believe Louisville is better.  Where im coming from is, I dont it to come to that.  You play the regular season which I believe should mean everything.

If you had to pick the best 2 teams in baseball in the national league and american leauge at the end of the 162-game schedule...you would not have selected the St. Louis Cardinals, but the playoff format worked out for them and thats great, they proved it.  So I think what we would see is that if a playoff format were installed in college d-1 football, and then we could theoretically play a game with the current format...we would get 2 different winners.

The best alternative ive heard for this is as follows.  If there is no clear cut number 1(like OSU this season) then a plus 1 game is installed.  You would play all the bowl games as we see them now...then the computers and voters would do there thing one more time and whoever is spit out at 1 and 2, would play another game.

ALSO,  you talk about teams having chances to extend there season, do u realize what you would do even if u had a 32 team playoff??? the other 32 teams season in bowl games would be over.  There are 64 teams in bowl games(there about) and if u just eliminated half the bowls then you've ended all these seasons short.  And your talking about an 16 team playoff? youve just ended 48 schools post season opportunites.  talk about not having a chance.

[formerd3db]

bu:
I realize what you are saying, however, ...  ;DThe systems are already in place for determining conference champions both in basketball and football and we're talking about the DI playoffs (excluding the DIAA schools).  The system is already in place for rating the Top 25 teams; I believe it could be done.  Again, it's done in all the other divisions for football and you have about triple the number of schools in DIII than you have in DI.  Overall, though, I think they will eventually develop some type of DI playoff system but exactly when and what that will be is anyone's guess.  It will be interesting to see what, if anything pans out.