FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[D3_DPUFan]

In these economic times, I would think travel would override many other considerations.  Flying (I assume) EVERY team to Texas at least once a season has gotta be a killer for the athletic budget!

No doubt the $$ is substantial. Last season, DePauw actually flew twice to Texas (Trinity and Austin). The year before it was a trip to Colorado Springs. I believe Colorado College had to fly to all of its away games...and of course they no longer have a program.

[bashbrother]

Why should Depauw stop at national exposure, how about international?   I know a few people at the US Information Service in Mexico City.   

[cave2bens]

Actually, Wabash and DePauw in the same conference would  be incredible...to put a conference title and trip to the playoffs on top of what is already at stake in the Bell game would be something special indeed. But to me, Wabash is the only attractive thing about the move. I don't have all the stats and academic rankings and endowment numbers that folks quote on here.

As far as endowment figures (and GOK what those are on a daily basis, presently  ) and academic levels, I'd classify the two conferences as isomeric.

[cush]

Is this horse before cart stuff? ie is earlham really gonna leave the ncac? How about the idea of depauw + wabash jumping to the UAA together? sure depauw + wabash don't fit the profile of the UAA school's but they a great school's, just a little different type who would bring solid athletic programs(the uaa could boost its #'s) and fill a geographic gap between chicago/washu and case/cm in the UAA...if the uaa could add two eastern school's, MIT + ?, it could break into two 6 team divisions which would ease travel. What's in it for depauw/wabash? they would get to hang with some of the best school's in the land, have the educational value of traveling to great cities, and increase their brand exposure....sorta the same concepts depauw has in mind being in the scac but the uaa would be at a higher level, no ? though travel would be $ and difficult. I do think the concept of branding with exposure and the value of travel is worthwhile but being d3 doesn't bring the buck of d1. For instance, boston college joining the acc brands bc throughout the south and that might attract some students. Back to the point, if earlham does leave, my take is the smart move for depauw would be to join the ncac and if they want to schedule a travel/branding game, they got a lot of school's to pick from across the country for a non-conf games.

[D3_DPUFan]

If they are giving consideration to the move at all, I have to believe that the economic benefit of a move to the NCAC would win out rather easily over the desire to participate in a "national" conference, if one could consider their current conference that at all.

Who ever referred to the SCAC as a "national conference"? 

Is this horse before cart stuff? ie is earlham really gonna leave the ncac? How about the idea of depauw + wabash jumping to the UAA together? sure depauw + wabash don't fit the profile of the UAA school's but they a great school's, just a little different type who would bring solid athletic programs(the uaa could boost its #'s) and fill a geographic gap between chicago/washu and case/cm in the UAA...if the uaa could add two eastern school's, MIT + ?, it could break into two 6 team divisions which would ease travel. What's in it for depauw/wabash? they would get to hang with some of the best school's in the land, have the educational value of traveling to great cities, and increase their brand exposure....sorta the same concepts depauw has in mind being in the scac but the uaa would be at a higher level, no ? though travel would be $ and difficult. I do think the concept of branding with exposure and the value of travel is worthwhile but being d3 doesn't bring the buck of d1. For instance, boston college joining the acc brands bc throughout the south and that might attract some students. Back to the point, if earlham does leave, my take is the smart move for depauw would be to join the ncac and if they want to schedule a travel/branding game, they got a lot of school's to pick from across the country for a non-conf games.

cush---
i like the uaa concept...

[frank uible]

In DI FBS Notre Dame, Army and Navy play the most geographically scattered schedules which tend to broaden their institutions' exposures to various sections of the country. No DIII team comes close to this factor the way those three do. I suppose that with effort a DIII team could put together such a schedule but at the cost of considerable travel expense and increased time away from the classroom for its players.

[Mr. Ypsi]

In DI FBS Notre Dame, Army and Navy play the most geographically scattered schedules which tend to broaden their institutions' exposures to various sections of the country. No DIII team comes close to this factor the way those three do. I suppose that with effort a DIII team could put together such a schedule but at the cost of considerable travel expense and increased time away from the classroom for its players.

Plus, with d3's insistence on 'regional' games, most of the games would effectively be 'exhibitions'!

[D3_DPUFan]

In DI FBS Notre Dame, Army and Navy play the most geographically scattered schedules which tend to broaden their institutions' exposures to various sections of the country. No DIII team comes close to this factor the way those three do. I suppose that with effort a DIII team could put together such a schedule but at the cost of considerable travel expense and increased time away from the classroom for its players.

A good reference...and in ND's case an opportunity to play in front of their various pockets of alums and, "subway alumni"...I would highly doubt that DePauw's decision to join the SCAC a few years back had much to do with football in particular, but moreover exposing the DePauw name through ALL of the men's and women's sports programs and other activities in those areas...just my guess.

[wally_wabash]

Actually, Wabash and DePauw in the same conference would  be incredible...to put a conference title and trip to the playoffs on top of what is already at stake in the Bell game would be something special indeed.

It is incredible.  It used to be that way.  The difference now is that there is also an AQ involved...so as great as it was in the 90s, it would probably be even better now that we're in the AQ era. 

IMHO, what the SCAC affiliation has done is broaden the recruiting base of talented players who find it attractive to play a schedule that includes travel and compeititon in places like San Antonio, the Dallas area, Memphis and the south..not just a bus ride away. I think you will find that good players from Chicago and St. Louis, or for that matter right here in Indiana, find the SCAC as a plus over other situations. (Please note, I am not bashing the NCAC, simply pointing out a perceived positive of the SCAC).

I think is overblown a bit...I have a good friend who ran cross country at RHIT during their SCAC days...he does NOT speak fondly of the travel involved.  Repeating his perspective here would probably violate any number of the site's Terms of Use.  Are these trips to the gems of the South really that glamorous?  I envision them in the same way I view business trips...you're not dropping your football team into Memphis to turn them loose at Graceland or on Beale.   You're there to play your game and get back on the bus/plane and get back to class.  These aren't vacations. 

Is this horse before cart stuff? ie is earlham really gonna leave the ncac?

I'm reminded of a saying...something about smoke and fire.  There was a lot of smoke coming from the pages of the student newspaper at Earlham at the end of the semester. 

[Ralph Turner]

If an outsider can stick in his $.02:

In these economic times, I would think travel would override many other considerations.  Flying (I assume) EVERY team to Texas at least once a season has gotta be a killer for the athletic budget!

I'm speaking hypothetically here Ypsi... but bussing to Texas can be done. 

In 1997, we traveled to Brownwood TX by bus from Crestview Hills, KY.  Did we win?  No... but we did make it to and from..  25 hours total drive time.

Wow!  That is a long way to drive for some Underwood's BarBQ!   

[frank uible]

If your team plays WashU at WashU, you play the game on Francis Field where the 1904 Olympics occurred. If your team plays Chicago at Chicago, you play the game on new Stagg Field on the campus where old Stagg Field had been - the site of the Manhattan Project. If your team plays Wesleyan at Wesleyan, you play the game on Andrus Field, the oldest (1881) football field still in use as a football field . If your team plays Williams at Williams, you play the game on Weston Field, the oldest (1875) athletic field currently used for football. There must be certain claims for places like Centre (Bo McMillin and the Prayin' Colonels) and Sewanee (charter member of the SEC). What about Nixon and Whittier? I don't believe Coolidge (Amherst) played football. Garfield (Williams) attended college before football was devised. Etcetera, etcetera. No active site seeing required.

[Mr. Ypsi]

If your team plays WashU at WashU, you play the game on Francis Field where the 1904 Olympics occurred. If your team plays Chicago at Chicago, you play the game on new Stagg Field on the campus where old Stagg Field had been - the site of the Manhattan Project. If your team plays Wesleyan at Wesleyan, you play the game on Andrus Field, the oldest (1881) football field still in use as a football field . If your team plays Williams at Williams, you play the game on Weston Field, the oldest (1875) athletic field currently used for football. There must be certain claims for places like Centre (Bo McMillin and the Prayin' Colonels) and Sewanee (charter member of the SEC). What about Nixon and Whittier? I don't believe Coolidge (Amherst) played football. Garfield (Williams) attended college before football was devised. Etcetera, etcetera. No active site seeing required.

You left out Ronald Reagan, who played football at Eureka College (though I don't know if they still use the same field).

[D3_DPUFan]

If you play on the Mountain at Sewanee, where the hotties still wear dresses to games, you play at McGee Field, the oldest football field in the south (1891); if you play (played) at Colorado College, you play(ed) at Washburn Field, the oldest football facility west of the Mississippi.

[DPU3619]

Are these trips to the gems of the South really that glamorous?  I envision them in the same way I view business trips...you're not dropping your football team into Memphis to turn them loose at Graceland or on Beale.   You're there to play your game and get back on the bus/plane and get back to class.  These aren't vacations. 

Not as much for football, but it tends to be more exciting for the travel partner sports.  When you're at Sewanee on a Friday and drive down to Atlanta on a Saturday morning, you've got all day to see the city. We've done that on our trips several times.  We've visited the CNN tower, the Alamo & Riverwalk, Beale St. & Graceland and so on and so forth. 

Maybe you're right that it's not that big of a deal, but I still believe that seeing all of these landmarks is part of the recruiting package.  We're going to the Alamo while you're going to the middle of Ohio.  I have to believe that works at least a little.  Now, if the youngster thinks that he's taking a vacation to San Antonio while only doing 2 halves worth of work against the Trinity basketball team, he's mistaken.  But, I don't think that's the idea our coaches are planting in their heads, either.

If our coaches believe that's part of the deal, they're going to be rather hesitant to changing. 

[wally_wabash]

Are these trips to the gems of the South really that glamorous?  I envision them in the same way I view business trips...you're not dropping your football team into Memphis to turn them loose at Graceland or on Beale.   You're there to play your game and get back on the bus/plane and get back to class.  These aren't vacations. 

Not as much for football, but it tends to be more exciting for the travel partner sports.  When you're at Sewanee on a Friday and drive down to Atlanta on a Saturday morning, you've got all day to see the city. We've done that on our trips several times.  We've visited the CNN tower, the Alamo & Riverwalk, Beale St. & Graceland and so on and so forth. 

Maybe you're right that it's not that big of a deal, but I still believe that seeing all of these landmarks is part of the recruiting package.  We're going to the Alamo while you're going to the middle of Ohio.  I have to believe that works at least a little.  Now, if the youngster thinks that he's taking a vacation to San Antonio while only doing 2 halves worth of work against the Trinity basketball team, he's mistaken.  But, I don't think that's the idea our coaches are planting in their heads, either.

If our coaches believe that's part of the deal, they're going to be rather hesitant to changing. 

Alamo...Graceland...Beale St...Grandpa's Cheese Barn.  Same difference. 

I don't at all disagree with DePauw using these things as a part of what they are selling to recruits.  They'd be stupid not to.  But I also don't think that DePauw, or any decent school for that matter, couldn't recruit student athletes if they don't have that card in the deck.  As I've said before, there are smart people behind these programs and I'm sure that changing their message a bit given a different set of geographical circumstances wouldn't be beyond their ability.