FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[DPU3619]

Yes, TRAVEL!!! W&J is a much better fit for ALL but 2 of the NCAC schools from a Travel stand point.  Wabash and Wittenburg and Greencastle is only 23 minutes closer to Springfield than Washington Pa.

Maybe this is just me and my history of dealing with long bus rides in the SCAC, but when you're talking about no more than an hour or two worth of difference in the length of bus rides, does it really make that much of a difference?  Is that seriously a dealbreaker?

[formerd3db]

I heard today from someone inside Wooster's athletic department that Earlham leaving the NCAC is a done deal.

And go where? This perplexes me.

Li'l Giant:

This has been discussed by others here in the past, however, the "best" and probably most realistic option for Earlham should they leave the NCAC is to join the HCAC.

[oldtiger]

The NCAC has apparently canceled media day for FB and BB.

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/high-school-sports/coping-with-the-recession-belts-tighter-in-sports-too-232024.html

Witt, and others, will not be offering printed media guides this season. Sadly to this fossil, I will be surprised if we see them return.

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/coping-with-the-recession-colleges-save-by-not-printing-media-guides-232045.html

[wally_wabash]

Fear not...preseason polls and media guides will be available via the interwebs (most of the league's schools have been making their media guides available electronically for some time now).  I can applaud this move as a cost cutting measure...we should all be embracing electronic media by this point. 

More about the NCAC going paperless here....note that preseason polls are supposed to be available Wednesday! 

[D3 Guy]

I'm new around here, but a longtime follower of NCAC sports and at the risk of upsetting you Wabash guys I doubt the league would look to Depauw to enter the league. A school from Western Pa. or an Ohio school makes more sense for the league by far according to a couple of coaches I've spoken to. As a matter of fact it's possible the league may revisit the travel to Wabash and the fact that as the only all male school in a league founded in large part to provide equal rights to both male and female athletes, the league may look for 2 new schools and cut Wabash from the NCAC. This would make for lower travel cost and make it easier for the female sports to schedule. Like I said not to upset anyone, but from a league standpoint it makes far more sense.

[BashDad]

That seems ridiculous. Wabash was an all-male school when they were extended an invitation to join the conference and, aside from 'gheny, travel is pretty painless.

[wally_wabash]

The league would be doing themselves a huge disservice to NOT look at adding DePauw.  DePauw more than fits academically, and raises the level of competition in pretty much every sport across the board for both the men and the women (see, we Wabash guys aren't necessarily blind to the women's sports).  

I guess I might not be seeing this whole travel issue.  Are we perhaps a little too sensitive to this right now?  The NCAC is a pretty comfortable conference geographically.  Am I wrong in thinking that most trips can be made in one day?  It's not like we're the SCAC or C-USA or something spread out over numerous time zones.  It seems to me that the one school that isn't making one day trips almost exclusively is Wabash and as long as Wabash is fine with the overnights, what's the problem?  Are we seriously talking about excluding Wabash because half of the teams at the other schools have to make one overnight trip to C'ville every year (or every other year for football and baseball)?  I'm really not seeing how this is a dealbreaker.  

[D3 Guy]

The league just cut media day, so it seems to me they are very sensitive about the travel issue, keep in mind the NCAC is more than just a football league when games are played on Saurdays. Its winter nights for basketball and such. With Earlham leaving, the NCAC is mostly and Ohio league with 2 other schools and Wabash is the longest trip for almost every school. I like the trip to Wabash myself but it really looks to me like this a key time for the league to decide which direction they want to go.

[Mr. Ypsi]

At some risk, a neutral observer would like to weigh in.

[Note: I personally feel DePauw would be an excellent addition.  More years ago than many of you were born, Mr. Ypsi strongly considered both Wabash and DePauw before deciding on IWU.]

With Earlham apparently gone (is it official yet?), Wabash goes from the most remote campus to by far the most remote campus.  There is some basic logic to the NCAC being a mostly Ohio league.

For most sports, would it make sense to have Wabash and DePauw paired as travel-partners (or travel-destinations)?  Would that ease the travel problems?

[Might really test 'respect' concerning the Monon Bell to have Wabash and DePauw teams travel on the same bus! ]

[DPU3619]

Another question I have for the Wabash folks - how does the administration feel about being an outlier in this conference?  Among the many reasons Wabash might want DePauw to be in the SCAC, wouldn't the fact that they would have an opponent within shouting distance be one of the more important ones?

[Li'l Giant]

It's not like Earlham is right next to Wabash anyway. It's what, 120 miles from C-ville to Richmond? We have always been the westernmost school and Earlham leaving doesn't change that. Someone has to be the western and easternmost schools.

Kind of like I asked about Earlham, where would Wabash go if the NCAC were to give us the boot? I don't see where we could go that would be a better (or even similar) fit for us. I can't imagine the college wanting to leave for that reason alone. I would imagine any conference shift at this point would be involuntary on Wabash's part.

[wally_wabash]

The league just cut media day, so it seems to me they are very sensitive about the travel issue, keep in mind the NCAC is more than just a football league when games are played on Saurdays. Its winter nights for basketball and such. With Earlham leaving, the NCAC is mostly and Ohio league with 2 other schools and Wabash is the longest trip for almost every school. I like the trip to Wabash myself but it really looks to me like this a key time for the league to decide which direction they want to go.

Let's break this down:

Football - In a two year period, seven schools travel to Wabash (four in one year, three the next).  Nobody is making that trip more than every other year and a couple of schools aren't making that trip at all.

Cross Country - Wabash hosts one meet per year, and I don't think any NCAC schools are obligated to participate.  Wabash may occasionally host the NCAC championship, but obviously that is going to rotate around.  

Soccer - This looks like schools alternate home and away every year.  So every team comes to Wabash just once every other year.

Basketball - Everybody comes once per season except Allegheny and Hiram who only come west once every other season.    

Swimming/Diving - Wabash typically will host one invitational every year and like XCountry, NCAC teams aren't obligated to participate.  The conference meet is held in Canton every year so that's not an issue for the Ohio schools.  

Wrestling - The NCAC doesn't even sponsor wrestling so this is a non-issue.

Baseball -  Each of the four other "west" division teams will make the trip for a weekend series every other year.  

Golf - See swimming and cross country.

Tennis - I'll admit to not knowing much about tennis.  Looks like divisional teams alternate travel each year.  So the other four teams in Wabash's division make the trip every other year.  

Track - Ditto the golf, swimming, and cross country.  

So this is what we're talking about here...each school that gets tossed into the West division of the divisional spring sports can expect to make a trip to Wabash at most once for football, twice for hoops, once for soccer, once for baseball, and once for tennis every TWO years.  That's six trips to Wabash every two years.  The easternmost schools can expect three trips...again, every two years.  I cannot even begin to imagine that this is crushing our fellow NCAC schools.  There's just no way.  

Is there really a need to have every coach and SID travel to one central location for media day?  Why can't this be done via teleconferencing?  This seems like an easy and obvious way to trim some cost from everybody's budget.  Ditto cessation of printing media guides.  Cutting a league member because of a handful of long bus trips in a two year cycle?  That seems pretty extreme.  

[LGHistorian]

Just putting in my two cents worth here and in today's economy its probably not even worth that much.  I can't believe the NCAC would vote to oust Wabash.  Wabash has brought a great deal to the NCAC table in spite of the fact it is all-male and now an "isolated distance" from the heart of the conference. It would be like the Big 10 changing their mind and ousting Penn State because it is not a midwestern college and its difficulty in getting in and out of their remote location.

From the beginning the addition of Wabash had its detractors.  The Cleveland newspaper published an article basically saying "What is the NCAC thinking?" in adding an all-male school to an organization priding itself on equal treatment of men's and women's sports.  Also Wabash was invited to join they did not coming calling to the NCAC doors on their own.

As Wally said Wabash will bear the greater burden of travel costs than the Ohio schools.  Don't have any idea how it would compare to Allegheny's situation.

Also, before the untimely death of Mr. Collins someone else on this board said the short list of replacements for Earlham inclued DePauw, Centre, Washington & Jefferson and John Carroll.  Wouldn't  Mr. Collins have represented the views of the conference presidents and athletic directors rather than striking out on his own agenda?  I also believe someone on this board said he even had hopes of making the NCAC into a super conference of 12 to 14 schools.

I realize the economy has changed many things and money needs to be saved.  The elimination of media day and going "green" in use of less printed media is not a red flag, just getting in step with the rest of the world in my opinion. 

If there are schools within the conference that have issues with travel costs then it should be that individual school that should explore its options and not expect the conference to eliminate members in good standing just because it is too far to go or too expensive to play there.

[BayernFan]

so is this talk of booting Wabash serious, or mere speculation?  Likewise, is the talk of Earlham leaving official, or is it also conjecture?

I can't imagine the NCAC looking anything other than BAD were it to boot Wabash, the winner of the NCAC Football Title 4 years running.  Sore losers, anyone?

Wabash offers a LOT to the NCAC.... fan support and money, academic reputation, the offbeat nature of its student body, not to mention the NCAC's annual entrant in the Div III football playoffs.  Wabash travels better than any other school in the conference.

But if the NCAC doesn't want us, fine.  Wabash can and will probably hook up with another tough conference and go from there.

But the best case scenario in either case would of course be putting Wabash and the Dannies in the same conference.  That goes without saying.

Just the two of them in their own conference.  The Monon Conference.  Winner goes to the D3 playoffs. 

[wally_wabash]

so is this talk of booting Wabash serious, or mere speculation?  Likewise, is the talk of Earlham leaving official, or is it also conjecture?

The smoke was pretty thick at the end of last year from Richmond regarding Earlham's admin wanting to move from the NCAC to the HCAC.  Great student reporting over there at EC to pull the curtain back on that whole thing (EC's president actually likened the whole process to cheating on a spouse...I wish I were kidding about that).  So no official announcement on that, but it would seem that Earlham is pretty steadfast in making that move and fantastic50 reported here recently that he has heard from a reliable source that it is all but done. 

As for Wabash leaving...has to be pure speculation.  As has been noted by several posters, Wabash offers a lot to the conference and as was broken down yesterday, the idea that Wabash is crushing athletic department budgets because of all the travel (all six trips in a two year cycle) that teams have to do out to west Indiana simply doesn't hold any water.