FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[BashDad]

...if we want to bend some on academics...

Wabash doesn't have to bend their academics at all to play any of these other teams in Division III.  Wabash can be academically rigorous AND also play a football game against any other Division  III school (all of them, btw, operate on the same non-scholarship, STUDENT-athlete principle that we do).  Are we really so elitist that we shouldn't consider playing a football game against a school just because they aren't in the right tier according to USNWR?  One of our own NCAC teams is going to play (gasp!) a PUBLIC school this weekend!  Let's hope to God nobody actually sees it...would hate one of our own to be seen with that kind of riff-raff. 

I mean seriously, that's how ridiculous this sounds. 

Agreed!

[pennstghs]

Raider, I haven't watched UWW at all this year but from knowing Wittenberg's offense. If Witt can get any running game going against Whitewater, I think that should be the key but I think to have any chance against Whitewater, Wittenberg should try the opposite.

That is establish the passing game to open up the running lanes in order to try and play a possession game. If Witt can somehow force turnovers and win the time of possession battle. That is the only way I see them winning.

The matchup to watch is the Witt D-line vs the UWW offensive line. If Witt can get any penetration at all, Witt will keep this closer than anyone thinks

[1990 Champs]

Looks like the general consensus is that Wittenberg will be smashed by UWW. Does anyone have a much differing opinion or insight that indicates that Witt can win?

I've not seen UWW at all, and saw parts of a few Witt games.  UWW looks like they have a very big offensive line.  If they have sacrificed speed for that size, Witt's D-Line has a chance.  The Tigers' D is decent sized but extremely quick and agressive to the ball.

That's all I got, Raider 68!

[maripp2002]

I couldn't agree more that it would be awesome to have some variety. If it were up to me, I think it would be just fantastic to have a SCAC v. NCAC challenge week. Or heck, I wish the NESCAC would open up to 10 games, because I would love to see Wabash v. Amherst and Witt. v. Trinity, etc. The one thing that stops that, I believe, is the need for in-region games.

In fact, maybe that is something the NCAA could bend the rules on. If an entire conference agrees to a two year home and home with another conference they could count it as an in region game. I would love to see that. It encourages at least one fun road-trip every few years.

I know that we really shouldn't be worried about who we schedule (with regards to academics) year in and year out, but I believe that remark was made regarding reforming a new conference. I couldn't agree more that Wabash shouldn't be afraid to schedule the big boys of the MIAA, HCAC, CCIW, etc. In fact, a few years ago Wabash did do a home and home with Franklin, and scheduled Millikan, Huntingdon and back in 2000-1 with Wheaton.  

In the end though, we're with the UAA for the next few years, but after that is over, I would't mind seeing some adventerous scheduling. And yes, I do like playing Wash U. but just not every year. My hope is that at some point we start to get some perennial contenders on the schedule. So for now, my hope is that whoever is on the docet from the UAA kicks some serious butt and that way whoever makes the playofs is ready to roll in both conferences.

[Raider 68]

Looks like the general consensus is that Wittenberg will be smashed by UWW. Does anyone have a much differing opinion or insight that indicates that Witt can win?

I've not seen UWW at all, and saw parts of a few Witt games.  UWW looks like they have a very big offensive line.  If they have sacrificed speed for that size, Witt's D-Line has a chance.  The Tigers' D is decent sized but extremely quick and agressive to the ball.

That's all I got, Raider 68!

I have monitored UWW all season like many of Raider alums and fans.
As a former player, I look for keys, stats and variables and one that
could stand out in the Witt/UWW is team speed.

In 2003 Mount had a huge  offensive line (average 6'4-5"and right at 300+) but were not quick. UWW is not that large, but not sure how quick they are vs. a quick defensive line. My point is if Witt's defense line is very quick, they could pose some problems for UWW. Mount then went away from pure size vs. quickness and agility and it has served them well since 2003. Also, the key to Mount's defensive scheme is quickness and movement to the ball which is a attribute of Witt.

We will see if that is a factor on Saturday, or big plays, and mistakes take Witt out of their game plan and force them to play catch-up.

[ADL70]

maripp

I've tried to make the point, not very eloquently I guess, that the special treatment of in-region games is not justified given the absurd definition of "in-region."

What is the NCAA trying to encourage by this special treatment?

[smedindy]

...if we want to bend some on academics...

Wabash doesn't have to bend their academics at all to play any of these other teams in Division III.  Wabash can be academically rigorous AND also play a football game against any other Division  III school (all of them, btw, operate on the same non-scholarship, STUDENT-athlete principle that we do).  Are we really so elitist that we shouldn't consider playing a football game against a school just because they aren't in the right tier according to USNWR?  One of our own NCAC teams is going to play (gasp!) a PUBLIC school this weekend!  Let's hope to God nobody actually sees it...would hate one of our own to be seen with that kind of riff-raff. 

I mean seriously, that's how ridiculous this sounds. 

I think you're morphing my point somehow to fit your agenda. (Maybe you should be a pundit?) I probably over-emphasized academics but it is a legitimate factor.

Remember, we can't play week 1, thus the OAC is out. Do we want to play Manchester or Anderson? No. If we did, we'd probably still be in the Heartland. Do we need to play 'in region' - for the most part yes (which means that Wash U. is out but I'd like dispensation for that and that means the SCAC is out - Centre is 241 miles away by Google). Who's left?

I'm all for a CCIW matchup, but again, the CCIW tends to look to Wisconsin, Michigan and Iowa for their non-conference games. The NATHC and the UMAC teams won't do us any good. So it's basically down to the UAA, MIAA, and some select HCAC teams unless we can convince some decent CCIW teams (sorry North Park) to schedule us non-conference. Besides Millikin, and IWU in the playoffs, we haven't played a CCIW team in a while.

The last time we played these schools:

Augustana - 1966
Carthage - Never
Elmhurst - Never
IWU (non playoff) - 1983
North Park - Never
North Central - Never
Wheaton - 2001

I don't know why that is, but it is.

Therefore, the UAA may be the best of what we can get without playing week 1.

[Ryan Tipps]

Remember, we can't play week 1...

I know this has been asked before over the years, but is it really a situation of "can't" or "won't" or "haven't, because of tradition"?

[Pat Coleman]

OAC teams play in Week 2 on occasion.

[maripp2002]

I've tried to make the point, not very eloquently I guess, that the special treatment of in-region games is not justified given the absurd definition of "in-region."
What is the NCAA trying to encourage by this special treatment?


I wish I knew. I guess it somehow must help with deciding pool-c? I think Pat or Keith would be the guys who can probably best answer that. I mean, from our POV, what is really the difference between an in-region game with let's say IWU and Hanover and an out of region game with Hanover and Linfield? I don't think it changes the football any? I think if the NCAA opened that up just a bit we would be more likely to see the regular season match ups people want. How awesome to see Ithaca v. St. Johns, or UMHB v. Wesley, or Linfield v. MUC in the regular season?

Pat or Keith help us out here, what is the significance of in region games vs. out of region games? 

[Pat Coleman]

The Division III member schools have decided as part of their basic guiding philosophy, to value in-region competition.

In various sports this is manifested in various ways, and with a different number of schools sponsoring each sport, not every regional alignment is the same as every other. But yes, if you read the selection criteria for every Division III team sport, in-region competition is the guiding focus of the primary criteria and non-region competition (or games against teams that aren't in Division III) is secondary or likely not even considered.

[bleedpurple]

Raider, I haven't watched UWW at all this year but from knowing Wittenberg's offense. If Witt can get any running game going against Whitewater, I think that should be the key but I think to have any chance against Whitewater, Wittenberg should try the opposite.

That is establish the passing game to open up the running lanes in order to try and play a possession game. If Witt can somehow force turnovers and win the time of possession battle. That is the only way I see them winning.

The matchup to watch is the Witt D-line vs the UWW offensive line. If Witt can get any penetration at all, Witt will keep this closer than anyone thinks

UWW has faced many different style defensive lines in rolling through their WIAC schedule. I'm not saying they were the qualitiy of Witt, but I will say there was no noticeable drop-off whether the line featured size or quickness or both. The IWU defensive front came to UWW with a great reputation and battle tested. UWW rushed for 236 yards and threw for 271.

Winning the battle up front is huge in any game. Against the UWW offensive line, you are working against the area of the team that might be the most consistent unit they have. QB Jeff Donavon has thrown 4 interceptions all year and been sacked 4 times all year.

For more on the UWW O-Line vs the Wittenberg front 7, feel free to check out my blog:

http://uwwfootball.blogspot.com

The Pound the Rock posting should be the 2nd posting down the page

[altor]

The Division III member schools have decided as part of their basic guiding philosophy, to value in-region competition.

And to expound on that a little more, I tend to infer that the reason they value the in-region games is for a couple reasons.  Please note that these are reasons that I came up with that make sense to me.  I've never actually seen them in an NCAA publication.

1.  At this level, most travel budgets are limited.  It is unfair to allow a school to gain an advantage in post-season selections just because they have funds available to travel all over the country, picking the best teams in order to load their schedule (or lesser teams in order to pad their record, I suppose).

2.  The number of times a student-athlete misses class should be limited.  At the big schools, classes are offered multiple times during the week.  Student-athletes can load their schedules to keep away from afternoon or Friday classes that they will likely miss.  Also, larger schools can afford tutors to travel with the team when they go on long trips, which limits the damage done by constantly missing class.  These options are not really available at most D-III schools.

[badgerwarhawk]

Whoever wins the WARHAWK/Wittenberg game will host the semifinal the following week. 

[FightinScot]

I have monitored UWW all season like many of Raider alums and fans.
As a former player, I look for keys, stats and variables and one that
could stand out in the Witt/UWW is team speed.

My point is if Witt's defense line is very quick, they could pose some problems for UWW. Mount then went away from pure size vs. quickness and agility and it has served them well since 2003. Also, the key to Mount's defensive scheme is quickness and movement to the ball which is a attribute of Witt.

We will see if that is a factor on Saturday, or big plays, and mistakes take Witt out of their game plan and force them to play catch-up.

I'll give my perspective, as an offensive lineman who has played against witt this year- I figure since the playing days are over I can speak up a little more...

Witt's D is fast. Just about all of em. Fast, though, doesn't mean as much as people think it does at D-Line. What sets Witt's D-Line apart is, IMO, the fact that they're quick and fast. They don't have to slow down to make a quick move, which is the very reason they've got as many sacks as they do- esp. Vallery. They're real tough in the pass game if they can get the O linemen to stop their feet or shift weight. I know nothing about UWW, I didn't have the time to watch them, so I'll just make some "if" statements. Witts DE's play a hard outside contain, which can open up lanes inside. If UWW's interior lineman can man block Witt's DTs and get to the linebackers to slow them down, they will have no problem running the ball. A lot of teams can't do that because they won a lot of 1 on 1 battles inside, or can't keep up with the speed of the LBs.

Field conditions will play a huge role in the game too- if its a dry, fast turf surface, it plays to Witt's strengths. They aren't overly big, but the team speed is tough. Take away some of the footing, and, well look no further than Woo vs Witt in the mud at Papp a year ago  to see what happens.

I'm interested to see how this one goes- Witt deserved the NCAC championship with the way they played...they've played with a chip on their shoulder all season and there's no doubt in my mind that they were the best team this year. I can't bring myself to root for 'em, but I hope they have a good showing this week.