FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[jam40jeff]

- Tough loss for Allegheny.  CWRU will celebrate this as a major accomplishment, but the reality is that this game set up perfectly for the Spartans.  They were getting the Gators seven days after a gut-punch loss to Wittenberg, at home, in a game that really was a lot bigger for CWRU than it was for Allegheny.  The week after effect is real and timing matters during the course of a football season.  Good win for CWRU (can't remember the last time CWRU had a regular season win against an opponent of Allegheny's caliber), but I can't help but wonder what happens on any other week of the season.  

I think that any other week of the season, a freak occurrence doesn't happen.  Absent the scoop-and-score while CWRU was running out the clock, Allegheny would not have scored a TD Saturday.  Give credit where credit is due.  With the situation CWRU was facing with 2:30 left in the game, 9 times out of 10 they win the game 20-9.

[wally_wabash]

Give credit where credit is due. 

Wait a sec...

Good win for CWRU (can't remember the last time CWRU had a regular season win against an opponent of Allegheny's caliber)...

That's right, I did. 

With the situation CWRU was facing with 2:30 left in the game, 9 times out of 10 they win the game 20-9.

And I believe that if this game is played any week other than the week after the Witt game, Allegheny probably doesn't need a late score to tie and get to OT.  Fact: this is the biggest game on CWRU's schedule this season.  Also a fact: this is, at best, the third biggest game on Allegheny's schedule.  The teams are coming at this game from different perspectives.  I'll say it again...good win for CWRU.  Barring an epic gag job over the next five weeks, the Spartans will be back in the playoffs and probably hosting a game. 

[jam40jeff]

Give credit where credit is due.

Wait a sec...

Good win for CWRU (can't remember the last time CWRU had a regular season win against an opponent of Allegheny's caliber)...

That's right, I did.  

You conveniently cut out the part where you followed it up with ", but".

I find it hard to believe that there's some powerhouse Allegheny team that didn't show up this week, especially going off their CMU score.  Also, I think Witt is highly overrated this year.  I guess I'll reevaluate my opinion of Witt next week after seeing Oberlin play.  Maybe it's just from years of having it beaten into my head, but I can't imagine a real Top 25 team (let alone the #7 team) locked in a battle with Oberlin.  People say Oberlin is better this year, but I can't imagine they're THAT much better.  Maybe they are and I'm wrong, but I'll have to see it to believe it (next week).

[wally_wabash]

Why do you feel the need to justify every CWRU stat or score?  "Oh, I know it was an overtime game, but they tied it on a weird fluky play and 9 times out of 10 we would have won by two touchdowns." 

"Well, the defense was pretty awesome and they would have totally shut (insert typical struggling NCAC program here) out except we pulled our starters at halftime.  And our offense probably would have scored 200, but Coach D tossed out the anchor." 

Seriously...it's like you've got short guy syndrome or something.  You've got a good team.  You don't need to go out of your way to inflate anything by playing the if this/if that game. 

I'll say it for the THIRD time.  That's a good win for CWRU.  It's the best regular season win they've had in three years (probably more, but nobody was paying attention before then).  The result is official, nobody's gonna take it away from you.  You don't have to explain how it could have been 20-9 or 45-2 or anything else.  It's a win. 

[jam40jeff]

Why do you feel the need to justify every CWRU stat or score?  "Oh, I know it was an overtime game, but they tied it on a weird fluky play and 9 times out of 10 we would have won by two touchdowns."

#1 - Other than one post where I disagreed with your assessment that CWRU only won because they caught Allegheny on an off-week, where have I justified or inflated any CWRU score or stat?  Are you mistakenly attributing ADL70's "mop-up QB rushing stat" comment about the Denison game to me?

#2 - You shouldn't use quotes if you're misquoting.

"Well, the defense was pretty awesome and they would have totally shut (insert typical struggling NCAC program here) out except we pulled our starters at halftime.  And our offense probably would have scored 200, but Coach D tossed out the anchor." 

Once again, show me any post I've made that sounds anything like that.

Seriously...it's like you've got short guy syndrome or something.

Sure, I guess when you put words in my mouth (see both quotes above) it kind of sounds that way.  Then again, there's also the reality of the situation, which is quite different from what you've presented.

You don't need to go out of your way to inflate anything by playing the if this/if that game. 

Pot, meet kettle.  You're the one that came along claiming that CWRU wouldn't have beaten Allegheny "if this" (they didn't catch them the week after Wittenberg)"/if that" (any of the other 9 weeks they would have beaten CWRU).

You don't have to explain how it could have been 20-9 or 45-2 or anything else.

Am I not allowed to have a rebuttal to your assertion that it was a fluke win for CWRU?

I'm not unrealistic or trying to pump up CWRU so they get more Top 25 votes or anything.  I know they're not as good this year as they have been.  I know there's very good teams in the NCAC (the one you root for included).  I know CWRU would probably get pounded this year by some of those teams.  I just don't agree that Allegheny is better than CWRU this year.

[wabco]

OK ... OK

CWRU won/beat Gheny.  Whether it is a beat down or whatever, does not matter.  Vis: Wabash/OWU or Wabash/Woo score.

I just hope Bash can prevail over Gheny as well and then Witt and then the Dannies (the way we are going with injuries ... not sure we have enough players) ... so then we can play CWRU ... assuming both make the playoffs ... and then the last 4 or 5 smacks above can be fun for real. 

Now, changing focus:  I, for one, respect the Gheny team this year and think Wabash will be in for a dogfight and am happy it is on our field.  I echo the need for a RB to step up and see this as an opportunity.  I can't help but believe we have the talent in the RB stable ... it just seems mystifying (and if mystifying to me ... imagine its effect on ER) that one has not stepped out yet. Our team is improving week to week ... a little more maturity/familiarity/confidence by Belton in his leadership role matched by a RB who decides to "You Can Dooo It" ... and maybe, just maybe, we have the chemistry we are working toward ... just in time.  I think Wash U will be a good adversary for this to continue to progress.

[wally_wabash]

I think you're reading too much into what I said about Allegheny suffering the week-after effect.  I believe what I said was, I wonder what may have happened in a week that wasn't the week after the Witt game.  I didn't say, that 9 times out of 10 Allegheny would have won 35-12.  No declaration of result...just wondering aloud if Allegheny wasn't quite at their best on Saturday.  Maybe they were.  I don't know...just wondering, that's all.  You'll notice that Wittenberg wasn't exactly at their best either on Saturday...there's evidence to suggest that the Witt/Gheny game may have taken a little something out of those teams.  

And my "quotes" obviously weren't direct quotes...just generalizing the stuff I read about CWRU games here and there.  Y'all get really excited about thumpng on a bunch of teams that win 2-3 games every year.  Have a little perspective is all I'm saying.   Take your ten wins and cross your fingers that you don't get thrashed in Round 1.  

[jam40jeff]

I think you're reading too much into what I said about Allegheny suffering the week-after effect.

Possibly.

And my "quotes" obviously weren't direct quotes...just generalizing the stuff I read about CWRU games here and there.  Y'all get really excited about thumpng on a bunch of teams that win 2-3 games every year.  Have a little perspective is all I'm saying.

We're not all the same person.  But if there are some CWRU fans that get a little over-excited (and I may at times, although I really do try to maintain perspective), you have to forgive them.  We spent a long time in the cellar, so having a good team seems all the sweeter, kind of like the first 70 degree day in the spring after a long Cleveland winter.  It's all relative anyway.  I'm sure many Mount Union posters would laugh at any of us thinking our respective teams are good.

[aueagle]

Last week it was me and OWU......This week it's wally and Case....
.     ............................Good Times...............................................

[ADL70]

Wally

Before the game I suggested a possible Allegheny let down on the UAA board,  but I disagree with your assertion that the game meant more to CWRU.

The Spartans, even with a loss to the Gators, would still likely have a good shot at Pool B at 9-1.  But a second loss leaves Allegheny needing to beat Wabash and then for Wabash to beat Wittenberg to have a shot at the playoffs (though I don't recall how the NCAC tiebreaker works).

[Wabash Hokie]

Wabash Fans - the local Wabash alumni are having a tailgate before the Wash U game this weekend.  We are meeting in a parking lot a few blocks south of the Wash U football field on the campus of Fontbonne University - located on the SE corner of Big Bend and Wydown Blvds.  Look for the signs.  A link to the Wabash website for more info is below.

http://www.wabash.edu/alumni/news.cfm?news_ID=8302

The tailgate starts at 11:00AM local time (Noon Indiana time) with the game kicking off at 1:00 local time.  The  weather forecast is perfect so make the drive to St. Louis.  If you spend the night, you can join us Sunday morning for our W.A.B.A.S.H. (Wabash Alumni Benefitting and Serving Humanity) Day event. 

Go Little Giants.

[wally_wabash]

Of course the game meant more to CWRU.  CWRU has to run the table.  They just have to.  If CWRU goes 9-1 and lose to the only team above .500 on their schedule (Wooster may also get there, largely by virtue of not having to play Allegheny this season), they're out.  This was the season for CWRU.  This was the one game that they had to bring it and win at all costs.  There is an awful lot of room for error for the Spartans on every other game on that schedule.  

[Ryan Tipps]

Of course the game meant more to CWRU.  CWRU has to run the table.  They just have to.  If CWRU goes 9-1 and lose to the only team above .500 on their schedule (Wooster may also get there, largely by virtue of not having to play Allegheny this season), they're out.

I agree that this game meant more for Case. As you suggested, wally, nonconference games will always mean more for the team without the AQ than they do for the team with the AQ.

However, this year's Pool B field isn't all that meaty, and we can expect to be drawing from weak conferences. A 9-1 Case team? Yeah, they still have a decent Pool B shot because their competition is the likely 10-0 teams Wesley and SUNY-Maritime and then....um.... yeah, this is where it gets to "who knows" land. Minnesota-Morris, who lost to their only above-.500 team? They have a weaker sked than may have a weaker sked than Case.

Other contenders, like Salisbury, Huntingdon and Norwich, will be at least two-loss teams by the end of the year. And Case still would have had a path to the postseason via Pool C even if Pool B slots ran out

I agree that this game was huge for the Spartants in terms of getting a convincing win on the record (seeding is still very very important!), I'm just not sure that it was a win-at-all-cost situation for them.

[seventiesraider]

Of course the game meant more to CWRU.  CWRU has to run the table.  They just have to.  If CWRU goes 9-1 and lose to the only team above .500 on their schedule (Wooster may also get there, largely by virtue of not having to play Allegheny this season), they're out.  This was the season for CWRU.  This was the one game that they had to bring it and win at all costs.  There is an awful lot of room for error for the Spartans on every other game on that schedule.  

I'm confused, are you saying the NCAC might get three playoff teams plus Case that plays sort of a NCAC schedule? Most years the second place team on the OAC gets snubbed. I'm ok with Case and the winner of the NCAC.

[usee]

Good thing the NCAA doesn't have to check with you. Isn't there some high school board you need to update?