FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[HCAlum86]

I do not mean to be pejorative in this at all, as I fully realize that you attend Wabash for the education and opportunities it affords you off the field; but have they ever had any significant issues retaining players because of the "single-sex" issue?

Believe me, I do not at all believe that to be a valid excuse to leave an institution such as Wabash, but kids in their college years make illogical decisions all of the time. Having said that, I figure that most of the kids that commit to play football there also do so because they love playing football at a high-level. But, are there any instances of an impact player leaving the school over the make-up of the student body?

Again, just to preface this again so no one can possibly misinterpret this... I believe Wabash is an excellent school, a classy football program with a proud tradition, and most of all I believe it would be foolish to leave the school for that reason; I just wondered, has it happened to anyone of any significance within the athletic program?

[Caveman # 95]

I've not heard of anyone...significant or other...

[wally_wabash]

I don't have any data on this...just the overall sense that I've had since coming to Wabash and now for many years after graduation.  Wabash has a great admissions staff (many of whom are alumni) and a solid alumni referral program that do a really, really good job of targeting and recruiting young men that are Wabash material.  That sounds really self-righteous, but isn't intended to be so.  As you've pointed out, Wabash is a unique place (most obviously because of the all male student body) and it isn't a good fit for everybody.  That alumni are so involved in prospective student recruiting and that so many of the admissions staff are alumni makes it easy (easier anyway) to recognize and focus admissions efforts on students that aren't going to be overwhelmed by Wabash, particularly the all-male thing.  It's people that are of Wabash and from Wabash finding future Wabash men...it's a system that's been in place since I was recruited almost 20 years ago and long before that even. 

None of that is to say that there aren't ever students that leave the College for whatever reason, maybe seeking coeducational student bodies, but I wouldn't say that it's a big problem or even really a problem at all, per se- most kids that are going to get scared off by Wabash's student body never apply, never get actively pursued by the College, or elect not to attend in the first place if they get that far down the college choice path with Wabash. 

[Li'l Giant]

I'm pretty much in agreement with Wally.

I worked for admissions as a student and do a lot a couple of college fairs a year for Wabash here in Texas. My sense is the students that have reservations about the lack of women tend not to get to campus anyway. They move on to other schools fairly early in the process.

I have, like I'm sure all alumni, known guys who left Wabash for a myriad of reasons (money, distance from home, a major Wabash doesn't have, a good job, family tragedy, general unhappiness with Wabash). But I've honestly not heard of anyone leaving for that stated reason. Doesn't mean it hasn't happened, just that I've never heard of it.

I will add this: of all the people I've ever known were generally unhappy at Wabash, a majority of them were legacies who felt some familial pressure to be there. I don't have kids but I doubt I will exert any pressure on any future son to go to Wabash. If he finds the place to be the fit for him, great. But I know not all families work that way. And it's not to say it doesn't happen at other schools. It does. But because Wabash relies so heavily on alumni help in recruiting, and because Wabash alumni tend to be evangelists for Wabash, I think some legacies probably would have been happier going to other schools.

[sigma one]

Retention of football players is not an issue at Wabash.  By this I mean retention at the college.  As with most DIII programs, a significant number of football players will not persist on the team through all four years, although more do at Wabash than at many places.  Leaving because the college is all male is not a significant factor.  As has been pointed out, some prospective students who find out that Wabash is single sex don't come; many don't even apply.  Students at Wabash know that they are in a rigorous academic environment, and student-athletes manage to balance academics and athletics.  Even the athletes who decide not to continue in their sport very rarely leave the college to seek out athletic opportunities elsewhere.  They continue their education knowing the advantages of the alumni network and potential for success after Wabash.
     About  40-45% of Wabash students are on an intercollegiate athletic team during any given year.  And over 60% start their freshman year on a team.  As an aside, can anyone name a school of like size that has 120 or so football players and also over 60 year in and year out in the track and field program?  Wabash started this year with its largest enrollment ever; I think the number was something like 923.     

[HCAlum86]

It is always schools with extensively involved alumni bases that thrive. Not a surprise at Wabash.

Another reason why I respect Wabash is that they are a DIII power with no need for "previous school" next to the player's name on the roster, if you catch my drift.

[wabndy]

I concur that students who matriculate have already by and large bought into the program. It's not like some schools, those with a religious affiliation come to mind, who get to a campus and find that the school is either "too religious" or "not religious enough" for their expectations. Those are traits that you aren't going to pick up on with a glossy view book or a two hour campus visit. The college for men thing is pretty hard to miss.

Not being from the state of Indiana, I do think it is a lot harder recruiting out of state. Indiana is awash in Wabash alums/disciples. A young man growing up in Indiana knows about the school, the all male status, and probably has a huge amount of information. I work a college fair here in Tennessee and at times I feel like my table is made of kryptonite. I see the eyeballs catch the "college for men" on the view book sitting on the table and watch the prospectives barely brake stride moving on to the next table.  They've never heard of Wabash and won't even give it the time of day because of the all male status. I tried to work with a prospect once who was very interested but couldn't get past the ribbing he was taking from his high school buddies. It's definitely a factor in why a healthy majority of the students still come from Indiana.  Once you get a prospective to look beyond that- and get him to give us a fair look - then real conversations can begin.

[wally_wabash]

Skull game this weekend.  Here's some things that we know:

- Wittenberg is strug-uh-ling to run the football.  8th in the conference in rush offense, 8th in the conference in rush yards per attempt.  This is not Wittenberg football. 
- The last time Witt lined up the week before a big game, they got taken to the limit at Denison.  Next week is the biggest game of them all for Witt. 
- Tomorrow's weather is going to be cold (not a huge deal), maybe rainy (not really a deal at all), and almost definitely windy (big deal).  20-30 mph windy.  Wind will jack up a passing game without prejudice. 

I'm not saying anything here.  I'm just saying that for one team playing at Selby on Saturday, this is the Super Bowl.  For the other team, this game is next to nothing because the Super Bowl is next week.  The elements aren't going to cooperate.  Maybe there are some elements in play there that could lead to an interesting result in Delaware.  Maybe. 

[smedindy]

Retention was an issue when I was a student. Not for football, but for overall. We changed that philosophy in the 90's when some of the other posters were there. My pledge class had 26 members, and i think we had lost nine by Christmas of our sophomore year.  Again, that was a different time and place for the school. We had a high admissions rate and threw a lot of financial aid around.

I think a lot of those who melted couldn't hack it academically for the most part. In looking back at those my pledge class lost, almost all of them were unable to handle the rigor. Great guys, and did well in high school, but this isn't high school...

[sigma one]

Wally, I agree on a maybe, but a very small maybe, in Delaware tomorrow.  Like so many others, I am surprised that Witt has not been able to run the ball more successfully this year.  Maybe it's because their passing game is not as overwhelming as in the recent past.  They are playing with the same running backs as a year ago, and with an experienced offensive line.  Year in and year out Finchem's teams have wanted to pound the ball.  On the whole, I just think Witt's defense v. the rush will be way too much for OWU if conditions don't allow the pass to dictate the game.
     Wabash didn't let Orsini get started on the ground, while Herman is gaining more yards and OWU is getting Cagney more into the ground-game mix, I don't think Witt will let Orsini get free on the read option.  Without that the OWU offense becomes too reliant on the short passing game, which for years hasn't won important games for them even when Espinosa was completing a high percentage of his throws. 
     Tomorrow will tell us more (perhaps) about whether the close game with Denison means much--if OWU can stay close, or if the Denison result was just one of those weeks.
     Moving to Wabash/Hiram.  Conditions there will also be trying, and the wind will definitely affect the passing game, where Hiram is very proficient.  Partridge has been successful getting the ball down the field; the Terriers lead the NCAC is yards per completion.  Early on,  with, Robinson at RB, Hiram was running the ball effectively.  He is not listed on their two-deep for this week.  He is still listed on their website roster--that doesn't necessarily mean anything.  Injured? Whatever.   If both defenses are able to crowd the line of scrimmage, the distinct advantage remains with Wabash.  Maybe, too, the conditions will mean that the short passing game will be more of a factor.  I'm sure Hiram is looking to see how they compare to the top of the conference, particularly since they were shut out by Witt earlier in the year, and Witt also dropped 48 on them.  I'm not worried about the final result, but how it plays out should be worth seeing.

[wabashcpa]

Sounds like a heavy dose of Holmes and Zurek to me.  Pound the rock.  At least 50 carries between them tomorrow.  Feed the beasts.

[HCAlum86]

Does Wabash go under center for much of their run game this year??

[wabashcpa]

In what limited action I have seen the QB is in shotgun.

[bashbrother]

Does Wabash go under center for much of their run game this year??

I don't remember seeing them out of the shotgun formation this year..  They may have gone under center for a 3rd or 4th down jumbo run formation, goal line and in victory formation at the end of the games, but that's probably it.

[wally_wabash]

If what's going on here in central Indiana is what's going to be happening in eastern Ohio tomorrow, Hiram's x-factor (Partridge) is going to be extremely compromised.  Very, very windy out here tonight.  Mother Nature can be the ultimate nickel back.