FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

Started by admin, August 16, 2005, 05:05:01 AM

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Whitecarrera

That's a hosel shank, if ever I've seen one!
It's either a thoughtful comment or smartass sarcasm. Recognize the difference.

smedindy

I'm not gonna kick dirt on the grave of the season. It was challenging, yes. And it's obvious DPU's focus on defense has paid off. Let's focus on fixing the D and I think Wabash can shine.

And hey, we were a lot better than Wittenberg, so that's something. A small something...
Wabash Always Fights!

WABCOL86

Dang Smeds, talk about damning with faint praise.  No, I think the problems (rot?) goes much deeper than just "fixing the D."  Watching these last few teams I notice a distinct lack of toughness and I place that firmly on how they are coached.  We spend all this money on new digs for football, we didn't do this for 7-3 and 6-4 teams.  Yeah, I know a lot of programs would love that, be we have moved past that point as a program (or we were past that point...now, not so much).  As someone who has followed Wabash Football since I as a pre-teen, color me extremely dissatisfied with the product placed on the field.  We managed to have really great student-athletes and still contend for championships and semi-regular NCAA appearances because we had coached who knew how to coach them up (and yes, lost them to higher level programs, but that is the price one pays for better than average coaches).  No one is kicking the doors in for Morel and company.  This is my take, your mileage may vary.
Been rooting for Dear Old Wabash since 1976...

sigma one

#35823
Let's be balanced about the Wabash coaches.  Both Creighton and Raeburn left for "higher" positions.  Not every DIII coach does that.  There are coaches across the division who stay in one place and win championships repeatedly.  Not everywhere, but in many of the better programs.  So it's a mix:  for every coach that "moves up" there are successful coaches who stay put.  Creighton's and Raeburn's coaching careers have gone differently.  One has taken a mediocre program at EMU and elevated it year on year to bowl game status despite all the impediments there.  Raeburn bolted for Savannah and could not elevate them; in fact, they cut him loose and dropped football.  He is now coaching at Gannon and has elevated that program that has its own difficulties in a competitive league with PA state universities.  This year, he's gotten them to 8-3.
     It's not fair to say that every young successful coach is ambitious to leave for greener pastures (and more money).  It's just that Wabash had two exceptional coaches who decided to go, both for different reasons (trust me).  Now, they have a competent coach who, let's be clear, will be around as long as he chooses to stay, and the program has slipped back into the NCAC pack.  I'm as concerned as anyone about that because, like everyone else, I've been spoiled over the last 20 years.  We all expect/want Wabash to be better than they are currently.  I'll have more to say later today or tomorrow both about the LGs specifically and college football's trends (which won't soothe the feelings of any of us but that try to put the current situation into a broader perspective)  Then, we can continue to debate whether I am right or wrong.    It's just that Wabash has been lucky, and unlucky, enough to have two successful coaches who decided to leave.  For a small selective liberal arts college (for men only) with all the restrictions that go along with being that to have 15+ years of sustained excellence is unusual.  We have not slipped so far that we cannot recover.

WAF5290

2 pick 6's and putting the ball on the turf won't win you many big games.

sigma one

#35825
True enough.  A combination of a very strong DPU D and a great game plan, and an off-day for the Wabash QB.  Thompson struggled all day against the Tiger pass rush, and then had to play from behind, which forced him into uncharacteristic mistakes.  After DPU drove down the field on their first possession, Wabash needed to respond, if for no other reason than to make DePauw think that their D would struggle.  Instead, after a good drive, Wabash fumbled in the Red Zone.  From that point on, the LGs were never really into the game.  Credit DPU for what they did on Saturday against an offense I did not think they could contain. 

Li'l Giant

Let's be clear here that these two things can absolutely both be true: (1) Wabash can (and has) backtracked since the coaching change in 2016 and (2) Depauw can (and did) beat the absolute crap out of us on Saturday.

Yes, the team did things on Saturday to contribute to that whupping. But these games don't happen in a vacuum. Like I said in the immediate aftermath of the game Saturday: if your coaching staff has a QB that might end up being the best ever to play at Wabash and you can't do better than 7-3 with no Bell, then there's a problem with the coaching staff.

LG
"I believe in God and I believe I'm gonna go to Heaven, but if something goes wrong and I end up in Hell, I know it's gonna be me and a bunch of D3 officials."---Erik Raeburn

Quote from: sigma one on October 11, 2015, 10:46:46 AMI don't drink with the enemy, and I don't drink lattes at all, with anyone.

wally_wabash

Quote from: sigma one on November 14, 2022, 10:59:23 AM
True enough.  A combination of a very strong DPU D and a great game plan, and an off-day for the Wabash QB.  Thompson struggled all day against the Tiger pass rush, and then had to play from behind, which forced him into uncharacteristic mistakes.  After DPU drove down the field on their first possession, Wabash needed to respond, if for no other reason than to make DePauw think that their D would struggle.  Instead, after a good drive, Wabash fumbled in the Red Zone.  From that point on, the LGs were never really into the game.  Credit DPU for what they did on Saturday against an offense I did not think they could contain.

I thought Wabash had really good momentum out of halftime.  There was a long way to go, obviously, but 2nd and 1 at the DPU 23 turned into a pick 6 on a panic throw away attempt and that was that.  A sack there makes it what, 3rd and 6 or so?  That's not a bad spot for that offense with two downs to get those yards.  If that drive cashes in, it's 28-14 and it starts to feel like a here we go again situation on the other sideline. 

Great plan and execution though by DePauw.  They're in a good position to advance again this weekend, I think. 
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

Li'l Giant

Quote from: wally_wabash on November 14, 2022, 04:04:42 PM
If that drive cashes in, it's 28-14 and it starts to feel like a here we go again situation on the other sideline. 

I don't think that would have happened at all, even assuming we score there. DPU looked pretty locked in the entire game. At no point did I believe we were going to get in their heads. And indeed we never did. To the contrary, the entire Wabash team looked rattled. It looked like they thought they could make up a 28-7 deficit in one possession like it was a Rock & Jock hoops game with the 21 point circle and so they were forcing things. Throw in defensive and special teams missteps and the entire team looked like it had just seen a ghost.

I think the way both teams mental states bore themselves out reflects on....you guessed it: coaching.

Theirs was superior to ours in every facet of the game.

LG
"I believe in God and I believe I'm gonna go to Heaven, but if something goes wrong and I end up in Hell, I know it's gonna be me and a bunch of D3 officials."---Erik Raeburn

Quote from: sigma one on October 11, 2015, 10:46:46 AMI don't drink with the enemy, and I don't drink lattes at all, with anyone.

smedindy

The killer was the first fumble by Liam. Moving the ball well to answer a score, and then losing it. More so than the pick six to start the third. That deflated Wabash.

Then the bad punt in the early 2nd quarter that led to it being 14-0 made it worse.

Only the INT in the end zone was a highlight after that, it seemed.
Wabash Always Fights!

wabashcpa

DePauw traveling to Pittsburgh to take on a 10-0 Carnegie Mellon, and if they manage to get past the Tartans a trip to Naperville awaits. 

At least they still get to play.  I miss the playoffs.  Those were fun.

Shamrock

My loyalty to the NCAC does not extend very far.  it certainly doesn't extend to the point that I cheer on my rival.

Go Tartans!

sigma one

#35832
Some of what I point out here is patently obvious, but also illustrative.  "Offense sells ticket, but defense wins championships"-- Paul Bear Bryant.  Recently, however, in a high-scoring era with wide-open offenses it takes both offense and defense to win consistently.

*Of the 32 teams in the Playoffs this year, 23 are in the Top 50 nationally in Scoring Defense.  Only 5 gave up 20+ ppg.  Mt St Joseph and Northwestern both gave up 25 ppg.
*Of those 32 teams, 21 rank in the Top 50 nationally in Scoring Offense.  Only 4 averaged fewer than 30 ppg.   Three of those averaged 29, and Northwestern averaged 27.
*DePauw finished the regular season #19 in Total D:  13 ppg, and #24 in Total Offense:  40 ppg.  (+ 27 ppg--that's 4 tds)

Wabash completed the season #14 in Total Offense:  42 ppg.  They gave up 34 ppg.   (+8 ppg--that's 1 td).  We could throw out the North Central game, but that makes it too complicated.

The plus/minus totals in average points scored v. average points surrendered for the Playoff teams ranges from +52 (North Central, #1 in both O and D) to +2 (Northwestern; they finished the season 6-4).  After that it's Gallaudet at +6.   Including these two, 6 completed the season below +20. 
Clearly Wabash has much work to do on defense.  But that's not the whole picture  The LGs defeated Wooster  (48-14), Ohio Wesleyan (42-24), Oberlin (66-20), Hiram (59-23), and Kenyon (49-25).  In those 5 games  Wabash led at the end of 3 qtrs by these scores:  48-14, 42-10, 66-20, 56-17, 49-13.  Combined in these games, against the teams in the lower half of the conference, Wabash scored a total of 3 points (!) in the 4th qtr, while the 5 opponents scored a total of 32.  We know that the Bash philosophy is to pump the brakes after the middle of the 3rd qtr;  very admirable. 
     So, the Wabash D is not quite as bad as it at first appears, but it's still bad and cause for much concern.  The #14 team in total offense, and who knows where in total defense--with that +8 margin for the entire year an obvious major problem.
     I once mentioned to an old friend of mine, a legendary h.s. coach, that Team A in the NCAC had 10 starters returning the next year on D; his reply was "Are those the same guys who gave up 40 points per game this year!"  Wabash has 9 or 10 starters and a lot of key reserves back in 2023; go figure.   The LGs also reportedly have 10 starters returning on Offense with 2 OL listed as seniors scheduled to come back.
     Something has to be done
     Replying to a comment early this fall about the staff putting all the emphasis on offense, including moving players from the D side on the ball to the O side:  this is not happening.  With only one two exceptions, the defensive players are in the positions they played in h.s.  And they come to campus with credentials about like those of earlier classes.  I know: the obvious answer is to coach them up.  I believe there's a chance of that, but we have to wait 10 months to see what happens.  I guess I will always be a perennial optimist.   




Whitecarrera

Is that legendary HS coach your old roommate?  (If so, no questioning the status — just curious)
It's either a thoughtful comment or smartass sarcasm. Recognize the difference.