FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[wally_wabash]

I don't know if the LGs are quite there yet, but I think they are certainly closer to the Mount than they were in 2002. 

You do? I know that we've touched on this a little bit in PMs, but I'd like to hear your take.

Closer...maybe not close per se, but closer.  I guess what I mean here is that since 2002 Wabash has gotten both bigger and faster pretty much everywhere on the field.  In 2002, MUC was bigger and faster than the LGs at pretty much every spot on the field...it was men vs. boys.  Today it might be closer to men vs. adolescents.   

I'd like to see a playoff game between the two just to see how much the gap has closed...if at all.  Certainly, the last two losses at home last year is going to put the brakes on any sort of "Wabash might be ready to challenge the upper crust" talk.  I just hope that you guys don't think that that's what I was saying...I know better than that.   

I don't know if the LGs are quite there yet, but I think they are certainly closer to the Mount than they were in 2002. 

Maybe if ER gets some of his type of players in there, but I don't believe that they're close at all to Mount as that roster is currently constructed.  You're not going to beat Mount with a bunch of Indiana kids.  Just ain't happening. 

Couldn't agree more, Wes.  The kids that I've heard bandied about with regards to Wabash's recruiting class are coming from a lot of different places.  And I certainly don't think that this point is lost on the staff at Wabash...those guys work hard in a lot of different regions of the country to find students that are going to excel both academically and athletically. 

[wab64]

   I don't have any information about the Class of 2013 other than what I read here- Duster's cousin and the Mich City lad. I do hope that ER is working his recruiting grounds from Coe. From what I can see from the rosters of Coe and other Iowa schools, they have recruited heavily in suburban Chicago, where there are a ton of good programs and where Wabash was pretty thin in the recent past. After the experience of Adi, Andrew Rode, Scott Liska and Dan Ryan Wood, and ER's familiarity with recruiting there,it could mean some nice talent and great students. Wes may be right that you can't get it done with Indiana kids, but the mother lode may be up north, not to mention Da Region. When I was in school, there were a lot of Western Pa players, including some great ones, i.e. Jack Mchenry and others. The coaches liked "Pa. Boys",apparently.
      The greater Chicago area has furnished the Big Ten and Notre Dame with their rosters for decades (except Ohio State, of course) and it would be great to enroll some who are not quite so good, but come from a strong program.
         Dad of Bash Warrior, #1, this one's for you.

[Ryan Tipps]

I don't know if the LGs are quite there yet, but I think they are certainly closer to the Mount than they were in 2002. 

You do? I know that we've touched on this a little bit in PMs, but I'd like to hear your take.

Closer...maybe not close per se, but closer.  I guess what I mean here is that since 2002 Wabash has gotten both bigger and faster pretty much everywhere on the field.  In 2002, MUC was bigger and faster than the LGs at pretty much every spot on the field...it was men vs. boys.  Today it might be closer to men vs. adolescents.   

I'd like to see a playoff game between the two just to see how much the gap has closed...if at all.  Certainly, the last two losses at home last year is going to put the brakes on any sort of "Wabash might be ready to challenge the upper crust" talk.  I just hope that you guys don't think that that's what I was saying...I know better than that.   

As I've mentioned in the past, I'm still waiting for that marquee win before I can feel comfortable in saying that Wabash has progressed since '02. Back then, both Witt games were high-quality wins. We were versatile on offense and had a defense I'm still proud of. Since then, though, we have only two playoff wins against Top 25 teams (both times against Case).

We've gotten better over the years at winning in the NCAC, but until we can have even one run like Franklin had this past season, I think there is a lot of growth to be made. Playing competitively with Mount is 4+ years away, if we log some good recruiting classes, IMO. We're still unproven against the nation's big dogs (see: lopsided losses to end the past two years).

It's hard, too, knowing that 2005 was just 4 points away from solidifying more "eliteness" for the LGs. I think making it to the regional finals that year would have erased these doubts I have about Bash's ability to compete outside the NCAC.

I think we just need a little more patience, but we can get there

[BashDad]

4 points, but only six friggin' yards...

[wally_wabash]

As I've mentioned in the past, I'm still waiting for that marquee win before I can feel comfortable in saying that Wabash has progressed since '02. Back then, both Witt games were high-quality wins. We were versatile on offense and had a defense I'm still proud of. Since then, though, we have only two playoff wins against Top 25 teams (both times against Case).

And I can't argue with that.   The results are what they are and Wabash certainly doesn't have that signature "put 'em on the map" win although I would say that the win over DePauw in 2005 was a very, very good win (those Tigers should have won their league but were forced to skip their trip to Texas) and the 2007 win over Franklin was also a much-better-than-people-think win.  Those were both really really good teams.  But you're right...the LGs won't be grouped with the elite until they get over, even just once, on a team from the OAC or CCIW (or WIAC if the playoff bracket winds up that way) and that's more than fair.  The lopsided results against playoff teams from those leagues* certainly suggest that there is work to be done...work that is being done I'm sure. 

*Except 2005 vs. Capital...2005 was the best team Wabash has fielded during this recent stretch of gridiron success.

[DPU3619]

The results are what they are and Wabash certainly doesn't have that signature "put 'em on the map" win although I would say that the win over DePauw in 2005 was a very, very good win (those Tigers should have won their league but were forced to skip their trip to Texas) and the 2007 win over Franklin was also a much-better-than-people-think win.

Agree with this, but for the sake of providing a counterpoint, I'd say that the last 2 Bell losses (the most previous one, in particular) are worth just as much in the other direction.  As well as the '05 DePauw team played, the '07 and '08 teams were run up and down the field by Trinity and Millsaps. They also were really close to losing to Sewanee, BSC, and Colorado.  Yeah, the final record on the ledger was good for those DePauw teams, as it usually is, but they didn't play a ton of inspiring football between Week 2 and Week 9 either season when you look at the final scores.

[DadofBashWarrior..]

   I don't have any information about the Class of 2013 other than what I read here- Duster's cousin and the Mich City lad. I do hope that ER is working his recruiting grounds from Coe. From what I can see from the rosters of Coe and other Iowa schools, they have recruited heavily in suburban Chicago, where there are a ton of good programs and where Wabash was pretty thin in the recent past. After the experience of Adi, Andrew Rode, Scott Liska and Dan Ryan Wood, and ER's familiarity with recruiting there,it could mean some nice talent and great students. Wes may be right that you can't get it done with Indiana kids, but the mother lode may be up north, not to mention Da Region. When I was in school, there were a lot of Western Pa players, including some great ones, i.e. Jack Mchenry and others. The coaches liked "Pa. Boys",apparently.
      The greater Chicago area has furnished the Big Ten and Notre Dame with their rosters for decades (except Ohio State, of course) and it would be great to enroll some who are not quite so good, but come from a strong program.
         Dad of Bash Warrior, #1, this one's for you.

I have not been on here in a while...that loss to Wheaton was not at all what I was hoping for...my sites are set on the future...There is not a question whatsoever that the Chicago area must be tapped by Wabash...All you have to do is look at what John Thorne is doing building a dynasty at North Central...look at where his kids are coming from...he has turned a nothing program into a Nationally respected program...no history there at NCC...just great coaching and even greater recruiting...Frankly I think we need a task force built for Wabash Recruiting in Chicago Area...

On another note...I could not be filled with more joy than to have Andrew graduating weekend before last...Oddly enough his brother my son #2 was graduating from Marquette the very same day so I went down to Wabash on Sat to celebrate with him and Sunday to Marquette...

Bringing even more joy to my soul is the fact that Andrew has accepted an assitant coaching job at an Indiana University...It is his desire to coach football as his career...

To those of you I have become aquainted with...the 4 years he has spent at Wabash have been more than a Dad could ask for...I have enjoyed the interaction here with many of you ...

I will never forget being unable to make a game and only getting it by the interaction on here....
I will make it in the next post...

WABASH ALWAYS FIGHTS

[DadofBashWarrior..]

Rode has had a great game.  He's caught a handful of balls, made some great special teams plays including the blocked punt. 

If it were mine to give, Rode would get the game ball today. 

This will always stick in my mind...as wonderful memory when I could not be at the game

[wally_wabash]

Rode has had a great game.  He's caught a handful of balls, made some great special teams plays including the blocked punt. 

If it were mine to give, Rode would get the game ball today. 

This will always stick in my mind...as wonderful memory when I could not be at the game

Wow...digging deep into the archives for that one! 

[raiderguy]

Rode has had a great game.  He's caught a handful of balls, made some great special teams plays including the blocked punt. 

If it were mine to give, Rode would get the game ball today. 

This will always stick in my mind...as wonderful memory when I could not be at the game

Well don't make it sound like you are leaving us....hope you will stick around. It looks like you just had your 200th post and I think that is the magic number to get karma rights. Pat can verify that. The fun is just about to begin for another season. Hope to hear from you again soon.

[smedindy]

Any more word on Earlham?

[LGHistorian]

smed-
     I am sure you have been reading the boards but if you haven't - I believe the last info was that EC would PROBABLY leave the NCAC after the 2009-10 season with sights set on joining the HCAC.


     Some other info that I have heard through 3rd hand sources indicate that those hoping for a Wabash-DePauw reunion occuring in the NCAC better not hold their breath.  Indications are that the consensus of DPU coaches are against joining the NCAC.  They want to continue to participate in a conference with national rather than regional roots.  Unless my quick glance at the D3 confererence board missed something that means either staying in the SCAC or hoping to join the UAA.  The sticking point that I mentioned to my source was that the UAA is made up of private research institutions located in major metropolitan areas.  DPU misses on 2 of those 3 categories.
     Also no one yet on this board has responed to my request for info concerning how long or what is required to have a PBK chapter at a college.  Sometimes I get the IMPRESSION from what is said on this board that no current college that does not have a PBK chapter can ever get a PBK chapter.  My limited research shows that there are colleges every year that do, in fact, establish new chapters.

     Here are some things to ponder:  DPU administration (slumping economy - travel expenses?) vs DPU coaches (keeping national presence, recruiting base?). Will the NCAC offer admission to its first non-PBK college (John Carroll?) and will the UAA be interested in adding DPU (non-research and non-metro). 

     Just wondering on a rainy day here with not much else to do.

[D3_DPUFan]

Don't know if anyone has noticed that College Football Live (ESPN2/ESPNU) is doing "50 States in 50 Days"...a focus on college football, state by state. DI programs, stars and stats are featured, but there have been a few DIII programs mentioned so far.

To all DPU and Wabash posters and fans/friends of the Monon Bell Classic...why don't we send some comments/suggestions/stories related to the Bell game, the tradition of the Tiger and Little Giant programs and the reasons why the folks at ESPNU should give it some attention beyond Purdue, IU, ND, BSU, etc.

I think New Jersey/Delaware is today; not sure when Indiana will be featured, but IMHO, the Monon Bell Classic deserves more than a brief mention! 8)

http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/mailbagESPN?event_id=16564   8)

[wally_wabash]

One option that hasn't been mentioned in the case of Earlham's leaving is that the NCAC sticks with the 9 remaining schools.  If JCU doesn't mesh with the blueprint of an NCAC school, then why force it?  There's not a real pressing need to have 10 (only the divisional setup in baseball takes a ding with respect to symmetry, but I'm sure we can find a way to make that work...we've got smart people running these programs). 

I've tried to find a reason why DePauw shouldn't come into the NCAC should the opportunity arise and frankly I just can't find it.  You can recruit nationally without being in a conference that is spread out all over the country.  Oberlin does it.  Wheaton does it.  A lot of schools do it.  The fit is better scholastically, geographically, and DePauw would be major players in almost every sport sponsored by the conference immediately.  If the only downside is that it could adversely effect recruiting (which is speculative at best), then I think DePauw's administration won't be able to let the opportunity pass.  There's just too much about it that makes sense. 

But that's just my opinion...

[DPU3619]

will the UAA be interested in adding DPU (non-research and non-metro). 

DePauw achieves none of the things it's shooting for by leaving the SCAC and going to the UAA.  There's absolutely no reason for it.

They don't hate the SCAC for academic, prestige, or endowment reasons.  They hate the travel.  Going to the UAA makes that worse, not better.