FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[Joe Wally]

A podcast with some information regarding Mason Zurek's continuing football (that's football, not futbol) career in Germany:

http://www.americanfootballinternational.com/berlin-adler-hesse-chats-us-imports/

[Joe Wally]

The incoming freshmen have been added to the Wabash football roster recently.  In spite of my OCD, I am unable to confirm when this update occurred. 

A big class (59 kids) by my estimation.

[bashbrother]

Here's one of them..   WAF

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1625888/highlights/311072405

[sigma one]

Two other running backs worth a look on hudl:  Cameron Morgan, Bloomington North, and Lamore Boudoin from Louisiana.  Several to consider looking up:  Sam Berry, WR, Texas; Artie Equihua, DB, Crown Point; Jacob Macaluso, DL/LB, Louisiana; Connor Phelps, OL, Covington; Jared Shaw, QB/ATH, New York; Jared Bertram, LB, Evansville Central; Weston Murphy, QB, Arizona.  Murphy is already on the regular roster, as #13.  One big catch--TJ Kilbourne, OL transfer from Division II Walsh U., in Ohio.  He is from Decatur Central, and will press for a starting spot on the OL, where there are already three returning starters--Stucker, Leath, and Sturdivant.  Stucker and Sturdivant are all-NCAC.
     Plenty of other promising players as well.   

[Sir Battlescars]

Lets keep our thoughts and prayers with the Wittenberg football team as they are obviously going through a difficult time.

http://www.wittenberg.edu/news/2016/wittenberg-mourns-loss-football-student-athlete-miles-laboy

[DPU3619]

One big catch--TJ Kilbourne, OL transfer from Division II Walsh U., in Ohio.  He is from Decatur Central, and will press for a starting spot on the OL, where there are already three returning starters--Stucker, Leath, and Sturdivant.  Stucker and Sturdivant are all-NCAC.

I like Kilbourne. Coached against him a few years ago. DC had a REALLY good OL with him and Lukayus McNeil, who is now at Louisville.  That place has turned into a factory in the last 5-6 years or so. Their big LT from this past year will be a freshman at Miami Ohio. QB Tommy Stevens is at Penn State. And DC is loaded right now. Stud soph QB & junior RB.

[Joe Wally]

It would appear that the Little Giants have brought Bryan Watson (class of 2010) back from Olivet Nazarene to serve as an assistant on the football and track teams.

[BashDad]

1. 2002
2. 2011
3. 2015
4. 2006 2005
5. 2014

[wally_wabash]

1. 2002
2. 2011
3. 2015
4. 2006 2005
5. 2014

That's better.   

[sigma one]

Sorry, BashDad,  but I have to agree with Wally.  That 2006 team was 8-2 and didn't make the playoffs.  The 2005 team, as you well know, was 11-1, with the only loss to a fine Capital team 14-11.  Although not in my top 5, I think the 2007 team (11-2) is a close 6th.  Perhaps disqualifying them was a 24-21 loss to DPU.  But they won two playoff games, including a dramatic late win at Case Western Reserve.
     I had to think hard about numbers two and three--2011 and 2015.  Both were 12-1.  Both had scary playoff wins:  2011, 29-28 on a fourth-quarter 2-point conversion against a powerful North Central team when NCC led 21-0 at halftime;  2015  in overtime, 33-27 vs. Thomas More on a long fumble return.  I'll give the 2011 team a hair-thin margin, but I could argue the other way as well.  Fun stuff. 

[wally_wabash]

What's fun about this conversation are the degrees of subjectivity.  When you're talking about the "best" teams from this era, everybody has a different definition.  Is "best" the most talented overall roster?  Is "best" marked by the team that has the best win?  Most people probably have some combination of those things (plus a few more criteria) in varying percentages and will come away with slightly different lists. 

I go back and forth with 2002 and 2015 as the best team of this era.  Both were awesome.  I think I lean 2002 because I think that team had better wins.  Wittenberg was incredible in 2002 and Wabash got them twice.  Wooster had Tony Sutton in 2002 (the NCAC was just better in 2002 in general, tbh).  Plus there's the long lasting impact of that team having broken through a barrier (beating Wittenberg, nCAA tournament, advancing in the tournament) that set the tone for the next 15 years which counts for something.  So, 2002- best team of the era. 

BUT--2015 Wabash beats 2002 Wabash by 13 points h2h.  Probably. 

Although not in my top 5, I think the 2007 team (11-2) is a close 6th.  Perhaps disqualifying them was a 24-21 loss to DPU.  But they won two playoff games, including a dramatic late win at Case Western Reserve.

2007 was one of the most interesting teams we've seen.  Wabash goes from having an all-time QB ready to go bananas in 2007 to having no idea who the QB is to kind of accidentally discovering the next great Wabash quarterback (where is Hudson all time?  Top 5 for sure, yeah?) and somehow working their way back into the quarterfinals.  Wild year. 

[sigma one]

Interesting speculation on 2002 vs. 2015.  Wally, your points about the break-through season and the double wins vs. Witt are spot on.  That team featured Knott at QB, of course.  He was throwing to Short and Clifton.  Chris Morris was the RB (until Zurek, the all-time leading ground gainer in Wabash history--who would have gained even more yardage if Lafitte had not come along).  The defense featured Boulais, Blair Hammer, and Stu Johnson.  The 2015 team had Zurek, and his excellence, plus an offensive line with Wes Brown, Stucker, and Sturdivant (the last two return this year).  On defense:  three all-conference defensive linemen, including McCullen; Ludwig, Austin Brown, Pettiford, and Ethan Buresh--those last four return for 2016.  Throw in Tutsie at kicker. 
     I agree that the 2002 bunch faced tougher competition in the NCAC, but the 2015 team just dominated through the regular season.  They won all ten games by at least 24 points.  Both reached the NCAA quarter finals, losing to Mt. Union 45-16 (2002) and St Thomas 38-7 (2015). 
     The other 12-1 team, in 2011, included Horn, Kitley, Akinrabade, Gum, Clegg, and Austin Hodges.  They were not as good offensively as the 2002 and 2015 teams.  They lost to Mt. Union 20-8.  That's the team that got North Central 29-28, a signature win vs. a team that came in thinking they would be the ones to go on to play at Mt. Union.
     So, yes, 2002 and 2015 were exceptional.  Fun to speculate:  2015 by about two TDs vs. 2002?  Maybe, because they might control the football and keep the Knott-led offensive off the field and/or in poor field position while smothering the running game.  What a game that would be to do one of those computer simulations on.     

[HansenRatings]

To throw a little objectivity in here (by way of the subjective decisions I made in designing the model), here's where my model ranks best 6 Wabash teams since 1999:

	Year	Peak Rating	Final Rating	Average
1.	2015	0.9749	0.9720	0.9735
2.	2002	0.9632	0.9526	0.9579
3.	2005	0.9427	0.9427	0.9427
4.	2014	0.9431	0.9356	0.9394
5.	2003	0.9321	0.9321	0.9321
6.	2011	0.9304	0.9304	0.9304

These are computer rankings, so they're not perfect, but it's not always your best teams that make it the furthest in the playoffs or win the most games either. It is nice to see how closely these match up with people's subjective rankings though.

Reference:
https://loghan.shinyapps.io/Ratings_History/

[sigma one]

HansenRatings, another good way of validating the status of the best Wabash teams since joining the NCAC in 2000.  The 2003 team at #5 surprises me.  That team was 7-3, the year after the first playoff run.  They lost to Kalamazoo in the season opener(!).  Also losses to Allegheny and a Tony Sutton Wooster team.  The K'zoo loss was by a TD, but Wabash trailed throughout.  The loss at Allegheny 7-6 on one of the worst, muddy fields on which I have ever witnessed a game.  Only Wooster was decidedly superior in almost every aspect of the game.  Wabash was a very good defensive team, giving up only about 13 points/game; so there is that.  Worth remembering is that after losing their first three games Allegheny won the conference that year, without a conference loss, and then lost by a single point in the playoffs. They beat both Witt and Woo in addition to Wabash.  Oberlin also beat Witt that year.  It was the NCAC at its most balanced, and most confusing.   So, 7-3, the second worst record since 2000 (2004 was 6-4).  Since then, no season with more than two losses; 11 straight years of one or two losses. 
     Just as an observation, I think the 2003 team would have a hard time matching up with any of the Wabash teams beginning in 2005, with the possible exception of a young 2012 team that lost to Allegheny and Oberlin, and finished 8-2.  They might be competitive because of the defense led by Blair Hammer in his senior season, but the offense would struggle against the good defenses Wabash has produced throughout the long run of good one and two loss teams.   
     The computer position of the 2003 team has to have something to do with the way the computer measures strength of schedule and other factors.  Wabash did trounce Witt that year, 41-14; also DPU, 37-20.  So that is no doubt factored in by the computer.
     Enjoying the discussion during this dead period.
     

[BashDad]

I meant 2005!