FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

Started by admin, August 16, 2005, 05:05:01 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic.

Li'l Giant

Quote from: bashbrother on October 15, 2017, 01:59:57 PM
Upon ER's late exit from the program it seems the administration rushed to hire Morel.  Not place an interim label on him.. which they certainly could have.

When ER left that late I assumed that would be the move; interim season, national search afterward.

I agree with your analysis. And your prediction of 2019.
"I believe in God and I believe I'm gonna go to Heaven, but if something goes wrong and I end up in Hell, I know it's gonna be me and a bunch of D3 officials."---Erik Raeburn

Quote from: sigma one on October 11, 2015, 10:46:46 AMI don't drink with the enemy, and I don't drink lattes at all, with anyone.

BashBacker#16

Coach, what's your team's goal for 2017?
"We want to win the Bell game and beat DePauw."

In the world of job interviews, that's a knockout question !  What?  Beat DePauw?  That says it all.  You think CC or ER would ever say that in a million years?  NO.  That's regression.  Our goal is no longer conference championships, deep playoff runs against D3 elites like Mount, Whitewater, or St Thomas.

Back to the interview analogy:
Interviewer:  Why do you want this job?
Interviewee:  I want to be 6-4, 7-3, keep up the recruiting numbers, beat DePauw every couple of years, and do just enough to keep my job.

Onward and upward... 

Wabash Always Fight?

Li'l Giant

Quote from: BashBacker#16 on October 15, 2017, 06:28:10 PM
Back to the interview analogy:
Interviewer:  Why do you want this job?
Interviewee:  I want to be 6-4, 7-3, keep up the recruiting numbers, beat DePauw every couple of years, and do just enough to keep my job.

Well, when the candidate's head coaching record is 48-59 it makes going 6-4 seem like a real improvement.
"I believe in God and I believe I'm gonna go to Heaven, but if something goes wrong and I end up in Hell, I know it's gonna be me and a bunch of D3 officials."---Erik Raeburn

Quote from: sigma one on October 11, 2015, 10:46:46 AMI don't drink with the enemy, and I don't drink lattes at all, with anyone.

smedindy

I know the D-3 landscape enough that a losing record isn't a black mark on a coaches' record. I saw at least one Wabash coach (in another sport) back up Coach Morel, and another Facebook poster bring up the 2-year stretch where Creighton went 6-4 and 7-3.

But...I sense a return to the meh records of the 90's if something doesn't happen soon. That was removed from the Navarro / Parrish era and we were just happy to have a winning record and win the Bell, and losses to Anderson and Benedictine were sort of accepted if we won the Bell.

While the football team's success isn't part of the mission of the College, it's now so linked to the identity of the College that a run of 6-4 records and .500 Bell game records would see some of the luster lost and student recruiting in general may suffer.
Wabash Always Fights!

BayernFan

IMO Wabash will be fortunate to have a .500 Bell record over the next 4 years or so. 

Li'l Giant

Quote from: smedindy on October 15, 2017, 11:01:24 PM
I know the D-3 landscape enough that a losing record isn't a black mark on a coaches' record. I saw at least one Wabash coach (in another sport) back up Coach Morel, and another Facebook poster bring up the 2-year stretch where Creighton went 6-4 and 7-3.

CC had built some capital at that point. He had taken a deep run in the playoffs and after 2004 was still 3-1 in Bell Games. Kind of different. Also, he followed that up with a 11-1 season in 05. I'm not holding my breath for that kind of 2018. 

Quote from: smedindy on October 15, 2017, 11:01:24 PM
While the football team's success isn't part of the mission of the College, it's now so linked to the identity of the College that a run of 6-4 records and .500 Bell game records would see some of the luster lost and student recruiting in general may suffer.

And I'm wondering how willing the administration is to let that happen before doing something.
"I believe in God and I believe I'm gonna go to Heaven, but if something goes wrong and I end up in Hell, I know it's gonna be me and a bunch of D3 officials."---Erik Raeburn

Quote from: sigma one on October 11, 2015, 10:46:46 AMI don't drink with the enemy, and I don't drink lattes at all, with anyone.

wally_wabash

Quote from: smedindy on October 15, 2017, 11:01:24 PM
I know the D-3 landscape enough that a losing record isn't a black mark on a coaches' record. I saw at least one Wabash coach (in another sport) back up Coach Morel, and another Facebook poster bring up the 2-year stretch where Creighton went 6-4 and 7-3.

LG beat me to it, but prior to those 2003-2004 seasons, CC had accomplished the following:
- Snapped a 5-year losing streak to DPU and started his own Wabash career 2-0 in the Monon Bell Classic
- Beat Witt (twice)
- Won the NCAC
- Won 19(!) games...in a row 
- Took Wabash to the playoffs for the first time in the AQ era and for the first time at all since 1977
- Obliterated what we though the ceiling for Wabash football was..he reset the standard

I had been hopeful after last week that we've just witnessed a really slow start to this season and that what we saw vs. Denison was closer to a baseline performance for the LGs, but I think heads are in the sand if people are looking at this year's results against Albion, Hiram, Wooster, and now OWU and think that one good game against Denison is more representative than the other 80% of the schedule.  And that's the bummer.  Because we know Wabash ought to be better than they've played this season. 
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

wally_wabash

One good thing from Saturday, IMO, is that I think Ra'Shawn Jones is a really good player.  He's found himself on the field a lot more over the last two weeks due to injuries at the wideout spots, but he's been good.  He was the top pass catcher on Saturday for Wabash and he got open deep on at least two other occasions where Murphy missed him with overthrows.  Wabash needs to figure out a way to stretch the field and decongest the LOS, and Jones is the guy.  Have to start completing some of those passes though to make a defense respect it.  But it's there.   
"Nothing in the world is more expensive than free."- The Deacon of HBO's The Wire

wabco

Sad Sad SAD.   Look at the lack of accomplishment and creativity exhibited in every phase of the coaching.  Rush 3 till .... till ... till ... game over?  Don't use RBs who demonstrate ability to get yards even against a front 7.  Launch passes intended for the stands over and over and over.  Work out special teams so having a kick blocked is becoming more normal.  Use up 2 of your 3 TOs in the second half because the sideline cant figure out what to do/call.  This is just the latest chapter in the ever spiraling downward of WAF and wins.  Look over the last 2 years. Steady decline ... discernable if you review the lack of dominating accomplishment. Look at the records of the teams we have crawled to a win over.  Now we go against the good teams. Heaven help us.  AND OUR STUDENTS ARE GOOD ... OUR ATHLETES ARE GOOD. The answer is 1) lack of ability on the part of our coaches  (look at their prior history ... it should not come as a surprise  ... there is no coach ability conversion of Saul on the horizon).

How did we get there?  Two years ago, ER jumped at another opportunity (and I use the word "opportunity " advisedly.  We needed a coach because of timing.  Morel was a comfort choice.  IT ALSO FIT IN A PLAN FROM THE TOP.  SPORTS IS A BOTHER.  (Doesn't go to the games.  Sports not important in the CA liberal arts world wide inclusion.)  So ... remove the athletic director who has lifetime real life coaching training, real lifetime experience as an AD, and IS a Wabash Man.  Replace him with a mid level bureaucrat who worked internally in the NCAA and taught a summer 1 week business course at Wabash in the Olab program.  Then let er rip!  Lets see.  Accomplishments in last 2 years:  ticket prices go up 60%, screw around with tailgating at Bell Game to institute lock step rules (where nothing was broken) and charge money to tailgate, and control control control, negotiate the end to national broadcasting in the name of saving money and now have a local Indiana company televise (do some PR lipstick on this pig of an idea), And have you tried to go from the football parking lot into the Allen Center ... no longer possible ... the gates to the football field are manned and guarder (if you can believe that ... guarded). At homecoming put up some tents in the fenced athletic field and move the students there for tailgate   (separate them from the general population? ... or just more regulation ...)  This football malaise comes from beyond the average ability coaches. (Coaches are really nice people but simply in Peter Principal.)  Plan ... excellence in athletics does not matter?

Let me suggest that it does.  At Wabash ... excellence in scholarship and ACADEMIC ACHIEVEMENT goes hand in hand with excellence on the excellence on the playing field. Student recruitment is integrally intertwined with athletics.  It is an all male and robust environment.  Mediocre in anything does not cut it.  (or at least should not cut it). Inane regulation and no comprehension of the special spirit of Wabash ... its fans ,,, its alumni ... its family does not cut it.  We have time to right the ship from this temporary sleep.  Will it happen before recruitment/enrollment falls off.  Before Alumni and family attendance and interest (which is renowned by those who play us) falls off in frustration. Before contribution enthusiasm fatigue follows.  Before it takes an "Act of Congress" to get the ship of state back to where it was and should be.  I hope so.  I hope so. I hope so.  I ask that we get back to demonstrated expertise in our AD and in our coaches. I ask that we request ... nay ... demand ... our alumni step up step up step up like they have in the past.  I want strength in our Admissions withy recruitment of ever better students with the special nature of Wabash as a mainstay.  We are (or at least were) on the threshold of faster, stronger, better.  Leadership gentlemen, leadership.  WAF

1837Tigers

Quote from: wabco on October 16, 2017, 11:13:32 AM
negotiate the end to national broadcasting in the name of saving money and now have a local Indiana company televise (do some PR lipstick on this pig of an idea),

As the person who negotiated that which you denigrate (and I'm not sure where you get your facts), you're wrong.  The deal you describe came with a bill that was almost double last year's.  If you want to donate the difference maybe we have something, but in this budget environment (for both schools, and we share costs) it could not happen.  Fox Sports Midwest is based in St Louis, for the record, and the telecast will have similar or better national reach than we had before.

I'm also the person who made the deals with AXS.  I *love* those guys, and the late Darrell Ewalt did much to bring the telecast to new levels.  Darrell's passing and budget realities brought about this change.  If you want to rip the telecast, you may want to wait and see how it goes.  I'm very confident it will be terrific.

Pat Coleman

Darrell was giving you guys a deal, then? What's the ballpark figure to put something like that together?
Publisher. Questions? Check our FAQ for D3f, D3h.
Quote from: old 40 on September 25, 2007, 08:23:57 PMLet's discuss (sports) in a positive way, sometimes kidding each other with no disrespect.

ExTartanPlayer

I doubt that this post will win very many popularity points in these parts, but hear me out, if for no other reason than to see a dissenting opinion that comes from outside the Wabash echo chamber:

(please note that this does not deal with any other "administrative" issues, such as those raised by wabco regarding changes to the gameday experience; it is strictly an "on the field results" post)

Much of the wailing and gnashing of teeth seems to come from the perception that under Erik Raeburn the Wabash team had risen to a level where they were just a hair away from cracking the truly ELITE tier of Division III, and that the team has significantly regressed in the past 16 games since the coaching change.  With a pair of quarterfinal appearances in ER's tenure, I understand why that perception exists - but I also think it's a little off base.

Here's Part 1 of my counterpoint: are we really sure that Wabash was ever that close to breaking into that stratum of the division?  The 2011 team pulled out a remarkable win against North Central and fell behind 20-0 against Mount Union in the quarters before adding a few late points for a 20-8 final.  The 2014 team kept it close for a half with UWW thanks in large part to a blocked field goal return for TD; but they fell behind 38-7 early in the fourth and didn't score an offensive TD for the first 57 minutes of the game.  The 2015 team took a similar beating from St. Thomas (no offensive points until they trailed 38-0 in the fourth quarter).  None of that is any reason for shame - there are only a handful of teams around the division that have fared better against that level of competition - but it's merely to point out that the "high water" mark of Wabash football under Erik Raeburn might not have been quite as high as it feels, looking back today.  In their best seasons, Wabash was a very, very good team that was never all that close to being a genuine threat to the top-5 level.  Wabash played a nationally-elite program three times, got curb-stomped twice and scored zero offensive touchdowns while any of the three games were actually within reach.

Here's Part 2 of my counterpoint: stripping away any other "intangible" factors like "they charge us more money for tickets now" and just looking at on-field results...it is entirely within the bounds of possibility that the results in the last 16 games would have been similar with Raeburn coaching (ducks to avoid onslaught of tomatoes being thrown at the stage).  The 2016 season was an 8-2 season with a 10-point loss to Wittenberg (ER career record against Witt: 4-4) and one of the best Bell finishes of all time, authored by a guy with 8,659 career passing yards for the other guys.  The last time Wabash played in the quarterfinals (2011) - the next season was an 8-2 season with losses to Allegheny and Oberlin (yes, I know that Oberlin team had some real dudes and treated the game like the Super Bowl...couldn't you say the same about DePauw last year?) and they did not return to the playoffs for another season after that.

I understand that there are structural concerns (off the field) and that the on-field product is not just a W's-and-L's concern, but "we gave up too many points to Wooster and Hiram and our offense looks bad" concern, and hey, I haven't actually seen them play live, as some of you have.  I am merely pointing out that, on the heels of a high-water-mark 2015 season that ended in the quarterfinals (with the team's all-time leading rusher and a pile of defensive stalwarts graduating) that a little regression in 2016 was a fairly unsurprising outcome, and that a 13-3 record for the next sixteen games was well within the range of possible outcomes that could have occurred under the old administration as well.
I was small but made up for it by being slow...

http://athletics.cmu.edu/sports/fball/2011-12/releases/20120629a4jaxa

smedindy

I thought a classmate and chair of the Faculty Athletics Committee had a great reply:

"In a time of flat-to-declining departmental budgets, the AD is taking steps to control ballooning costs in our athletic programs (budgets not keeping pace with roster sizes) and to lose less on our home football games (no way we can actually make money on these events). We all believe Wabash is different and special, but we are subject to the same financial realities that are kicking small college ass all over the country. This is a college-wide problem, not just athletics."

Increasing cost from $5 to $8, control costs by avoiding theft in the Allen Center, and changing up tailgating isn't so bad. Security is needed now with bad apples from outside the area coming in to cause trouble.

And, Fox Sports Indiana and Midwest are available nationwide on satellite services if you have a dish and probably people are more familiar with them than AXS, which is now really focusing on music and comedy.

Yeah, I'm not happy with the loss to OWU. But I'm happy that we continue to kick butt in cross country, track (indoor and outdoor), and wrestling. We should strive for 3rd in swimming (for now, and catching Denison and Kenyon will be a HUUUUGE stretch goal), and I'm glad our soccer team is doing better in the conference.

I'm more concerned why we couldn't capitalize on our NCAA appearance in baseball a few years ago, and why basketball seems to be stuck in an up-and-down treadmill.

Football is a main part of our identity, but to be honest, Wabash should be focusing on its entire athletics program, and making sure the other sports catch up to football (and wrestling and track).
Wabash Always Fights!

1837Tigers

Quote from: Pat Coleman on October 16, 2017, 01:52:25 PM
Darrell was giving you guys a deal, then? What's the ballpark figure to put something like that together?

That's a bit of a leap, Pat.  Darrell had a long background (and national Emmys) in sports telecasts, and the Monon Bell game was the only game AXS was doing in recent years (when we first signed on in 2003 we were part of a "Great College Rivalry" series, since gone).  With no Darrell, putting this together (we had a crew of 53 last year) was more challenging.

1837Tigers

Quote from: smedindy on October 16, 2017, 02:00:50 PM


And, Fox Sports Indiana and Midwest are available nationwide on satellite services if you have a dish and probably people are more familiar with them than AXS, which is now really focusing on music and comedy.

Thank you, Smed.  Yes on both counts.  As I just noted to Pat, our game was the lone football telecast on AXS the past few years.  Darrell and the guys loved doing it (and we loved having them), but his sudden passing last November changed the dynamics.  What a great, great guy (and terrific broadcaster) he was.