FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[David Collinge]

Who has Depauw played? [...] Let's break it down a little further.  Wesley is legitimately good. [...] I'd argue that Witt and OWU are as good or better than anybody that Depauw has beaten this year. 

Ergo Witt is at least "legitimately good."  Anyone expressing that opinion a few weeks ago was accused of "drinking the Witt Kool-Aid" by the same Wally.  My how things change! 

[HScoach]

Anyone have an injury status on Tristan Murray.  Thought I heard he left the game injured?

[smedindy]

Basically, Wally was right that Witt and OWU are right there with anyone DePauw has beaten, but the NCAC's non conference kills them, while only Millsaps is a real dog in the SCAC.

[wabndy]

The dannies set up a pretty thorough Monon bell page: http://www.depauw.edu/ath/football/monon/ which includes a bunch of highlight film clips from years gone by.

I hope someone on this board will go to the Monon Bell chapel this thursday and pass along the highlights.  Any word on who the speaker will be?

To comment on an earlier discussion - this particular rivalry just really doesn't lend itself to comparison.  Those of us who went to Wabash understand what a unique place it is - and I think that carries over to the bell game as well.  After Wabash - I spent some time in grad school at a large football-centric university.  More intense?  As someone said earlier - when you have more than 70,000 fans - it is going to get heated.  But this rivalry exists on a different playing field.  Take the Michigan/Ohio State example.  Fundamentally, the schools are essentially the same type of large midwestern state universities with really no difference between the makeup of the student body.  You start to see that with say a Michigan / Michigan State rivalry.  As a former Wabash admissions counselor told me many years ago.  "Go visit Wabash, and then go visit DePauw.  If you any doubt in your mind that Wabash is not a better place to be - then you should go to DePauw."  Describing that difference (be it in haiku, blank verse, or sonnet) is something that I cannot describe other than "go see for yourself."  It is because these two schools are who they are that makes this rivalry not just another D3 rivalry with an old trophy.  Putting superlative tags on the game "the oldest, the most played, etc." are neither factually accurate or meaningful.  People looking from the outside in at us talk this game up often end up scratching their heads.  Coach Creighton started scratching his head from the day he got hired until the moment Knott threw a pass that bounced off of Short into the arms of Casper in 2001.  For those of us who were in Greencastle on that day, who had suffered for 5 years (including the 42-7 disaster that closed out the 9-1 no playoff bound season), there is no doubt what this game means.  I don't care if we aren't the oldest, or the longest played, or the fact in the grand scheme of college football - a sub 10,000 game attendance is paltry.  I want nothing more than the ability to go up to any danny that I happen to run into in my many travels to remind him, lest he forget, where the bell is.  Can't do that right now - look forward to being able to do it after next weekend.  Dannies to hell - I want the bell.

[nike]

OK Bishops. Bring it on. For third place. Sorry Kenyon.

[wally_wabash]

I believe what I said, DC, was that...

Witt and OWU are as good or better than anybody that Depauw has beaten this year.

The key word there being "beaten".  Depauw didn't beat Wesley, so Wesley was exempt. 

smeds, you ought to know better than to live and die by the computer rankings.  Do you really believe that Allegheny is on par with Millsaps?  We're all familiar with how Allegheny has managed to lose their games...it's not like they've been terrible.  The SCAC isn't a strong conference.  The bottom feeders in the NCAC, which are consistently some of the worst teams in D-III drag Wabash's SOS down, which in turn hurts our computer rankings.  Wabash can't do a thing about whether or not the bottom of the NCAC ever wants to get competitive.  But we have to play them and we have to play teams that play them, so they hurt us. 

Per Massey, most of the SCAC falls in line somewhere between Wooster and Denison, teams that Wabash beat by a score of 96-10.  I just can't and won't believe that Depauw has played a significantly tougher schedule than we have.  They've been on a stroll through cupcake city since week 1. 

[frank uible]

formerwab: It is my impression that as a generality University of Michigan students and alums arrogantly believe with certainty that they are superior to their counterparts at OSU and MSU while those counterparts have some doubts and are defensive about that proposition.

[wabashcpa]

(including the 42-7 disaster that closed out the 9-1 no playoff bound season),

This is why I cannot answer the question posed by usee.  After this game, then maybe we can start making comparisons to the 2002 team.

[smedindy]

Wally - Since the Massey ratings I like take margin of victory into account - playing them doesn't hurt that bad if we TCB, like Saturday.

However, look at the non-conference games. It's hard to be a strong conference when three of your teams lose to Case.

The simple fact is 'Gheny has lost those games, and lost them over and over and over again.

Centre isn't what I call a cupcake, either. Unless you want to call OWU a cupcake.

[BashBacker#16]

Smeds - neither Wally nor myself are saying Wabash will not have to play well to beat DPU, I am just not shaking in my boots waiting to see this game.  Again, I like how Bash matches up...different then in some previous years.

Formerwabndy - Thursday's chapel? - hint - he's 6'8"

WabashCPA - don't be silly, please tell me you are not referring to the 9-0 '05 squad with the 9-0 '98 team.  The similarities stop at the 9-0 records (sorry OldGiant if you take offense).  Valid point with a lot of football left before we can accurately compare this year's team with 2002 - but, it is an interesting question and one that is not easy to answer.

Wally - what would your comparison look like...'02 vs. '05 ?  I don't feel I stated anything other then the obvious.  One other comment, I think this year's team has much more overall team speed then '02 - again on both sides of the ball and special teams play.

[oldgiant]

BB16

I don't disagree.  In '05, the AQ is in hand. In '98, the trip to the playoffs was lost.  It would only be fitting to return the favor to the vile depaw.  Seems to me that the situation in 1998 was exacerbated by a signal stealing scheme by the vile depaw  .  Is there no depth to which they will not sink?  Let us hope that they sink to the lowest depths of depression and dispair this Saturday as 'Bash drive north on 231 with the Bell.  As sweet as the Monon Miracle was in 2001  , revenge for 1998 will be right there with it.  It is time to collect!

[bashbrother]

I would like to send my prayers and well wishes out to the Wabash players and families from Newburgh, IN.  (Roop, Fields, & Millikan) I hope everything is ok with their families and friends after last nights tornado.

[wabashcpa]

WabashCPA - don't be silly, please tell me you are not referring to the 9-0 '05 squad with the 9-0 '98 team.  The similarities stop at the 9-0 records (sorry OldGiant if you take offense).  Valid point with a lot of football left before we can accurately compare this year's team with 2002 - but, it is an interesting question and one that is not easy to answer.

Obviously I hope the similarities do stop there!

I was in Memphis in 1998, and the only game I saw was the Bell game.  I don't know much about that team other than that game, so I don't know how to compare those teams, other than Wabash was in the HCAC at that time, which means we would have had to beat Anderson, Franklin, and Hanover, among others.  One would think that would have set us up for a more competitive game with DePauw than it turned out to be.  I would definitely say that this year's team has a leg up in terms of coaching.

I did see a couple games in 2002 (DePauw, MacMurray) and a couple so far this year (Earlham, Wittenberg).  At this point, I would rate the 2002 team ahead the 2005 team.  A nice convincing Bell victory could alter that opinion.

[oldgiant]

WASHCPA - in 1998, depaw (being the sneaky no accounts that they are) sent spys to all of the Wabash games.  They watched the signals as they came in from the Wabash sideline and then watched the plays.  By the time of the Bell Game, they had a complete catalog of Wabash's playbook and signals.  depaw was in the Wabash huddle on every play.  This is known as the great signal stealing scandel.  The 1998 Bell Game will live in infamy as long as the game is played.

Congrats to 2005 team!  Many of the seniors were freshmen on the 2002 team and have worked very hard to get back.  Great job!! 

Bring home the Bell and then on to the playoffs.

[wally_wabash]

BB16 -

I agree pretty much with what you've said regarding the comparison between the '02 and the '05 teams.  I think there's more speed all over for Wabash this year and I think we're more diverse with the passing game.  CC is quoted in the article on the website that this year's D is the best he's been around.  I said early on this season that I thought this defense was slightly better than the '02 defense. 

There are two points that give me pause.  First, this team hasn't had the one single win that made everybody take notice.  In '02, beating Witt (#4 in the country at the time) at their place on homecoming was monumental.  We haven't had anybody on the schedule like that this year.  Second, Wabash doesn't have a running game like they did in '02.  Roop, Ogden, and DJB have been serviceable, even pretty good at times, but none of them are giving us what Morris gave in '02. 

I think this team could certainly go as far as the '02 team did.  Then, depending on how the home field breaks down and who we get matched up with, they might be able to go further.  I'll have a better feel for that after the next couple of weeks.