FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[ADL70]

Academics are how you land the recruit that MUC cant.

Rumor was MtU recruited All-Ohio QB Dan Whalen who went to CWRU.

[wally_wabash]

This reminds me of a conversation Wally and I had whilst watching the Stagg Bowl. Wally commented on how the ESPN studio guys at halftime were criticizing Kehres for something they disagreed with. Wally stated that a coach that has lost 20 games in 21 years can do whatever he damn well pleases. My comment to Wally was that he could have his punter at QB and 6 TEs in the game and studio guys don't get to criticize him.

What's funny is that Kehres DID have his punter at QB.  Micheli (the one who lit UWWWWW up, not the other guy that stunk the joint up) handled the punting for MUC in the Stagg Bowl.  I didn't see 6 TEs though...probably because you can only dress 52 guys for the playoffs and he didn't have 6 TEs available.  The vaunted Kehres 6 TE formation is for regular season games only.   

[ski]

Kehres? Even if you think that he is the best in D3, he does have a major advantage over most other coaches. When you have 250+ kids to choose from, your odds of finding quality is much better than when you are dealing with a hundred kids or less, as in many cases. It is true that he created this advantage by building a great football program, but it is an advantage nonetheless. Many other D3 schools are not willing to commit the dollars to their program that Mount has. Wooster, for example, would be hard pressed to find the funds to bring in more than the 100 they carried this year. They were forced to cancel JV games and change their method of feeding the players after away games, all this do to athletic budget cuts. Wooster is committed to its academics, as I am sure many other schools are. This academic pursuit also keeps them from bringing in players with lower academic scores such as the 17 on the ACT's that will pass at Mount.
The bottom line, these are the cards that are dealt, so Mount will remain the team to chase. But there are many other schools in D3 that struggle to put a competitive team on the field, as they have many hurdles in their path. But they manage to do it and that's a real victory.

[smedindy]

The thing is that Mt. Union's success will breed success - as kids will want to be part of that program. Thus the huge numbers.

I think the key for teams like Hiram and Oberlin is getting and keeping rosters in the 50s and 60s of players, where you can build depth and groom the kids for the future without telling a freshman to go play Witt and Wabash right out of the box.

[lancer98]

The thing I wonder is when Mount is recruiting all these kids, do they tell them the amount they will be coming in with? 

Competition makes you better and you will get it at many schools you go to but most kids would shy away from that if they knew and understood the situation they were getting into.  Maybe at 18 you don't understand that? Then again many high-school heroes don't realize the amount of talent at the D3 level until they go through their first traning camp and think they can come in and play right away(some can but not many at better schools).  I admit I didn't realize the telent level at first and it took my freshman year to adjust.  Fortunetly, I was able to adjust and have what I would characterize as an average career.  Unfortunetly some kids never do however and quit.  At Mount those numbers are obviously pretty high I would suspect.

[wally_wabash]

Wooster is committed to its academics, as I am sure many other schools are. This academic pursuit also keeps them from bringing in players with lower academic scores such as the 17 on the ACT's that will pass at Mount.

Do you have any sort of data to back this up, or are you running on the assumption that dominant football inherently involves academically challenged kids? 

I can't stand the academics card.  Mount Union (and the rest of the OAC for that matter) is a far better institution than many on this board care to give them credit for.  You'd like us to believe that MUC is a glorified community college, but that simply isn't the case.  I don't believe for one second that academics has much at all to do with how good your football team can be.  You can find good players who fit academically at your school...regardless of what school that is.  Those kids are out there.  It's up to the institution and the recruiting staff to sell the school.  Academics aren't why MUC is better than everybody else.  If you want to point the finger in the way of support from the administration, dollars spent on the program, etc. fine.  Those are far bigger factors in my mind.  Some actual numbers would be nice to see though before we start making those accusations as well. 

And I don't even care for the OAC...I feel dirty.   

[wooscot]

Lancer98,

Average career?  The jury's out on that one!

Budget cuts caused Woo to cancel JV games and not feed players after away games?  Wow...maybe I should start earmarking my donations to some sort of football fund.  Another advantage I think Mt has is that Keheres in the AD.  Plus, as somebody already mentioned, the success of the football program really brings a lot of publicity to the school, which I am absolutely positive results in $$$ coming into the school (donations, grants, student applications, etc...).  I don't care how nice of a financial aid package a school can offer, you have to assume a lot of this kids are paying at least half tuition if not more.  That's a lot of jack just to suit and watch your team win championships year after year.

[Kira & Jaxon's Dad]

Another advantage I think Mt has is that Keheres in the AD.

There is that NCAC education for you.  "Keheres in the AD"  Sure am glad I went to MTU.    <I am kidding all>

Also, how could an incoming freshman NOT know about how many players are expected to be there?  Everyone always posts it on here and I am sure the HS players watch this board.   UWW HC Brez also commented on it in his post game press conference.

[lancer98]

Lancer98,

Average career?  The jury's out on that one!

Ok..I'm being humble...above average j/k.

You know I actually got meaningful time after you graduated and I didn't have to tackle your fat butt on scout team all the time.   

[wooscot]

Kehres is AD...as I said earlier to a former teammate, I've been lost without my academic gameplan since graduation (Wooster guys will get this one)!

Lancer98, I was a slim and trim 220 when I made a habit of trucking you during practice!

[SaintsFAN]

wooscot,

re:  Academic Gameplan.

I get that also...Dean Paul implemented that while at Thomas More...and I'm sure does now at Ohio Northern.

[joelmama]

Its still the Gagliardi trophy, no?

The Kehres trophy,  I like the ring of it.

[joelmama]

Kehres? Even if you think that he is the best in D3, he does have a major advantage over most other coaches. When you have 250+ kids to choose from, your odds of finding quality is much better than when you are dealing with a hundred kids or less, as in many cases. It is true that he created this advantage by building a great football program, but it is an advantage nonetheless. Many other D3 schools are not willing to commit the dollars to their program that Mount has. Wooster, for example, would be hard pressed to find the funds to bring in more than the 100 they carried this year. They were forced to cancel JV games and change their method of feeding the players after away games, all this do to athletic budget cuts. Wooster is committed to its academics, as I am sure many other schools are. This academic pursuit also keeps them from bringing in players with lower academic scores such as the 17 on the ACT's that will pass at Mount.
The bottom line, these are the cards that are dealt, so Mount will remain the team to chase. But there are many other schools in D3 that struggle to put a competitive team on the field, as they have many hurdles in their path. But they manage to do it and that's a real victory.

There is a lot of BS in this post but I will only address one point.  That is the money.  When will you take a simple look and realize that MUC football generates much more cash for the school than it spends.  Where does the tuition come form for the 175 kids that come out for the team in fall? Also many do not stay on the team for all four years but most stay in school.

As for academics LK is more proud of his graduation rate than his winning percentage.

[joelmama]

The thing I wonder is when Mount is recruiting all these kids, do they tell them the amount they will be coming in with? 

Competition makes you better and you will get it at many schools you go to but most kids would shy away from that if they knew and understood the situation they were getting into.  Maybe at 18 you don't understand that? Then again many high-school heroes don't realize the amount of talent at the D3 level until they go through their first traning camp and think they can come in and play right away(some can but not many at better schools).  I admit I didn't realize the telent level at first and it took my freshman year to adjust.  Fortunetly, I was able to adjust and have what I would characterize as an average career.  Unfortunetly some kids never do however and quit.  At Mount those numbers are obviously pretty high I would suspect.

obviously many never see the field in a varsity game.  Most do in a JV game and many realize they are not good enough to go on.  LK does tell his recruits that they will need to be patient (unless your name is Stickley or Kmic).

[joelmama]

Wooster is committed to its academics, as I am sure many other schools are. This academic pursuit also keeps them from bringing in players with lower academic scores such as the 17 on the ACT's that will pass at Mount.

Do you have any sort of data to back this up, or are you running on the assumption that dominant football inherently involves academically challenged kids? 

Wow Wally you are the man.  +K for you.