FB: North Coast Athletic Conference

[Superfoot Wallace]

I know the NCAC granted the Little Giants a share of the title that year.  And I'm not weeping because I've read it before.

But its still not a triumvirate, and in my esteem if none others, that is what is needed to share a conference championship.

And I don't confuse championships with playoff selections, wasn't my point at all.

I'll just keep wearing my Penn State hat from 1994 and you go ahead and think the Little Giant's are on some kind of conference championship unseated streak.  Just isn't so and statistics and awards are being bent and lent.

Quarterfinals?  Easily two of the weakest teams in the whole of the tournament, not just the region had there.  There's yer piss and moan.

signed,
Bradshaw and Kiik

[D3_DPUFan]

Quarterfinals?  Easily two of the weakest teams in the whole of the tournament, not just the region had there.

[wally_wabash]

Wabash is supposed to apologize for the tournament draw?  Please.  

Quarterfinals?  Easily two of the weakest teams in the whole of the tournament, not just the region had there.

Remind me again how many teams (strong, weak, or somewhere inbetween) that DPU has beaten in the playoffs. 

Wating....waiting....

You're out of your element here. 

[D3_DPUFan]

easy, chief... no need to get defensive...  

[Superfoot Wallace]

Depauw beat at least one team that was in the playoffs this year.  And while comparative scores don't fly around here, think they would've soundly handled either of those opponents I referenced.

Comparative scores deny the rock, paper scissors afterall.

Not a fan of Tutsie?  I take the good and leave the bad with him.  Consider him family as I grew up in the Decatur Central youth wrestling program where he wrestled and eventually coached.  At least 'Think Cradle' family.

signed,
Stantz and Venkman

[D3_DPUFan]

Depauw beat at least one team that was in the playoffs this year.  And while comparative scores don't fly around here, think they would've soundly handled either of those opponents I referenced.

Comparative scores deny the rock, paper scissors afterall.

Not a fan of Tutsie?  I take the good and leave the bad with him.  Consider him family as I grew up in the Decatur Central youth wrestling program where he wrestled and eventually coached.  At least 'Think Cradle' family.

signed,
Stantz and Venkman

accurate take on your first sentence.

and you misunderstand my reference to tutsie...only wanted to get the former out there for folks who don't know. i like the guy and think he is a good coach...think there were just too many things---some he could control and some he couldn't---that did him in. i wish him well...any idea what he will be doing next?

[wally_wabash]

That wasn't the question, MacLeod.  Somebody who is as careful with their prose as you are should recognize that.  I'm disappointed in you.  

[Superfoot Wallace]

Guess I did misunderstand.  Wow!

Tutsie's gone from Warren football?

Didn't know.

Liked how much he innovated with both the T and the doublewing without being wing t.  Though, sometimes wondered if Jeff George was pulling strings or the referees couldnt count, because quite often with a hurry up huddle that doublewing doubled as T and left tackles uncovered and the Warriors went uncalled for the penalty.

It's not a penalty if the flags not thrown though.  Can run the quick or no huddle to take advantage of your opponent as much as the officials I guess.  Owe them no duty of candor.

And wally, I wasn't answering your question just as my rhetorical question sought no answer, seeing as how we had covered those bases before.

signed,
Spectre and Mitchell

[K-Mack]

At the risk of breaking up this riveting back and forth, what is -- in the humble opinion of the NCAC posters -- the appeal of Wabash over Coe?

Being familiar with Coe and Raeburn, I think it's a great hire. But I can't find many plain-to-see reasons why he'd want to leave Coe for Wabash, so I'd like to have some message board opinion to tide me over until preseason when we can ask him straight up. (in the articles I read, I didn't get a lot of clarity on it)

My main guess is that Wabash has a great alumni base with deep pockets and pays better.

Football-wise, it might be a better job in that the NCAC is an easier league to win year-in, year-out, IMHO, than the IIAC, but high academic credentials (plus no female students) means it's got to be a more difficult place to recruit football players too.

Crawfordsville, well, I've never heard it described as a happening place to be or a wonderful place to raise children, although it might be. As Midwestern Cities go, Cedar Rapids seemed pretty cool. Perhaps getting closer to Ohio roots?

The DePauw-Wabash rivalry is a special thing to be a part of, but Coe-Cornell isn't a bad rivalry either.

I know Bash gets great fan support and that's a rare and special thing.

Maybe the sum of all those slight advantages add up to reason to make the move. Maybe it was just time for a change. But maybe I'm missing something.

Anyway, expect to get a different answer here than on IIAC, so shoot ...

[Mr. Ypsi]

At the risk of breaking up this riveting back and forth, what is -- in the humble opinion of the NCAC posters -- the appeal of Wabash over Coe?

Being familiar with Coe and Raeburn, I think it's a great hire. But I can't find many plain-to-see reasons why he'd want to leave Coe for Wabash, so I'd like to have some message board opinion to tide me over until preseason when we can ask him straight up. (in the articles I read, I didn't get a lot of clarity on it)

My main guess is that Wabash has a great alumni base with deep pockets and pays better.

Football-wise, it might be a better job in that the NCAC is an easier league to win year-in, year-out, IMHO, than the IIAC, but high academic credentials (plus no female students) means it's got to be a more difficult place to recruit football players too.

Crawfordsville, well, I've never heard it described as a happening place to be or a wonderful place to raise children, although it might be. As Midwestern Cities go, Cedar Rapids seemed pretty cool. Perhaps getting closer to Ohio roots?

The DePauw-Wabash rivalry is a special thing to be a part of, but Coe-Cornell isn't a bad rivalry either.

I know Bash gets great fan support and that's a rare and special thing.

Maybe the sum of all those slight advantages add up to reason to make the move. Maybe it was just time for a change. But maybe I'm missing something.

Anyway, expect to get a different answer here than on IIAC, so shoot ...

Despite not being a 'bash guy (or even NCAC), I'll lead off.

IF they can surpass the Mount (and 25 years ago, teams in the region would say the same about Augie; dynasties are not forever, even if Mount seems to be trying to prove otherwise!), I could readily envision the LGs in Salem (though there are other teams in the region also feeling that way); with no offense intended, I just can't say the same about Coe.

With no disrespect, if you think Coe-Cornell is even in the same discussion as Wabash-DePauw, you need to attend a Monon Bell!  [And, according to LG legend, at least, they don't need to be coed for recruiting - they have all the DePauw women! ]

A probably underutilized recruiting tool: they are less than 25 miles from what I think is the best state park in the entire midwest: the canyons (and floating trips) at Turkey Run are amazing!

Being closer to his roots may well have been the clincher.  With no knowledge of Raeburn or Zebrowski except their resumes, I was hoping Wabash would choose Raeburn solely on the possibility that he might want to be a Kehres or Gagliardi (while I'm guessing coach Z is anxious to go d1).  For raisng a family or setting down roots, Cedar Rapids and Crawfordsville are probably about a push, but the other factors (plus being closer to the ancestral roots) may have given Wabash the nod.

I will now turn the floor over to people who know anything and that you were hoping to hear from!

[K-Mack]

With no disrespect, if you think Coe-Cornell is even in the same discussion as Wabash-DePauw, you need to attend a Monon Bell!  [And, according to LG legend, at least, they don't need to be coed for recruiting - they have all the DePauw women! ]

1) Has Been to Monon Bell Game.
2) Did not say they were comparable, only that Coe-Cornell is not bad.
3) What gives you the idea that Z is eager to go D1? He's a grad of a D3 school (MUC) who left a D3 HC job (Lakeland) for a D3 OC job (UWW) and recently applied for at least two D3 HC jobs (Wabash, St. Thomas) and was a finalist.
4) I really don't think Cedar Rapids and Crawfordsville are a push, but my time in the midwest has been limited to weekend visits, so I'll defer on that one.
5) Why do you see the potential of Wabash getting to the Stagg Bowl before Coe? Some institutional reason, the support or something, or just a name-recognition/gut feel? You acknowledged the Mount Union hurdle, which the IIAC champ usually doesn't deal with, but that aside, I don't see a big competitive gap between the yearly IIAC champ and the NCAC champ. If there is one, I'd probably take the IIAC team in a head-to-head, but that's another discussion for another day, and certainly one great Wabash team can make a run. (Likewise, if you go by the logic that Coe is an IIAC contender, and Central was a top 5 team that made a quarterfinal run, why does that put them so much farther from the potential SB than Wabash?) There has to be some reason why you think the Wabash program is better built or school/program better-backed or funded or better-positioned for success, or some reason Coe is not. That's what I'd be looking for.

[Charlie Kohawk]

Football-wise, it might be a better job in that the NCAC is an easier league to win year-in, year-out, IMHO, than the IIAC, but high academic credentials (plus no female students) means it's got to be a more difficult place to recruit football players too.

Don't forget the positive side of an all male school -- no budget spent on women's sports. It had to be a factor.

[K-Mack]

Football-wise, it might be a better job in that the NCAC is an easier league to win year-in, year-out, IMHO, than the IIAC, but high academic credentials (plus no female students) means it's got to be a more difficult place to recruit football players too.

Don't forget the positive side of an all male school -- no budget spent on women's sports. It had to be a factor.

That's a good point.

As far as the women all coming from DePauw (or wherever), don't forget I have heard such claims from my H-SC brethren. They have three co-ed schools practically on top of them. Still, I couldn't imagine ... ah, maybe I'll just leave that alone. 

[Pat Coleman]

I kind of find it interesting to look at when you wonder if all of these Mount Union grads are trying to position themselves as the heir apparent to the job when Larry Kehres retires.

[smedindy]

Don't forget the positive side of an all male school -- no budget spent on women's sports. It had to be a factor.

Trust me - the athletics budget isn't grossly obscene. There'd be a lot of hue and cry if it were. At Wabash the money is spent on student experiences.