FB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[formerd3db]

I think Mr Ypsi makes a very valid point about another scholarship offering program taking away some DIII players.  Michigan already has some very good DII schools that attract kids.  A ton of choices for a player to make.  The strength of the MIAA DIII schools has to be an excellent education, generous academic scholarships, and the opportunity to play football.

I wholeheartedly agree with you Uncle Rico.  The only problem is that these DIII schools are extremely expensive, although the MIAA schools are about $10,000 less than many of the DIII schools in OH and IN, etc.  As you point out, academic scholarships are available, yet, unfortunately, sometimes that is not even enough to assist parents.  As such, when their sons are offered the partial scholarships that the DII schools and the NAIA schools are able to provide along with the lesser tuition/R&B that those schools also have, that adds to the eventual choice for the latter in many instances , although obviously not all.  Unfortunately, it still comes down to $ many times in today's society - that's just the way it is.  On the other hand, sometimes parents and the student-athletes aren still able to find a way to attend the DIII school of their choice despite these conditions.

[Raider 68]

I think Mr Ypsi makes a very valid point about another scholarship offering program taking away some DIII players.  Michigan already has some very good DII schools that attract kids.  A ton of choices for a player to make.  The strength of the MIAA DIII schools has to be an excellent education, generous academic scholarships, and the opportunity to play football.

I wholeheartedly agree with you Uncle Rico.  The only problem is that these DIII schools are extremely expensive, although the MIAA schools are about $10,000 less than many of the DIII schools in OH and IN, etc.  As you point out, academic scholarships are available, yet, unfortunately, sometimes that is not even enough to assist parents.  As such, when their sons are offered the partial scholarships that the DII schools and the NAIA schools are able to provide along with the lesser tuition/R&B that those schools also have, that adds to the eventual choice for the latter in many instances , although obviously not all.  Unfortunately, it still comes down to $ many times in today's society - that's just the way it is.  On the other hand, sometimes parents and the student-athletes aren still able to find a way to attend the DIII school of their choice despite these conditions.

The D3 schools in Ohio are around $31-38K per year before any financial assistance.

[formerd3db]

I think Mr Ypsi makes a very valid point about another scholarship offering program taking away some DIII players.  Michigan already has some very good DII schools that attract kids.  A ton of choices for a player to make.  The strength of the MIAA DIII schools has to be an excellent education, generous academic scholarships, and the opportunity to play football.

I wholeheartedly agree with you Uncle Rico.  The only problem is that these DIII schools are extremely expensive, although the MIAA schools are about $10,000 less than many of the DIII schools in OH and IN, etc.  As you point out, academic scholarships are available, yet, unfortunately, sometimes that is not even enough to assist parents.  As such, when their sons are offered the partial scholarships that the DII schools and the NAIA schools are able to provide along with the lesser tuition/R&B that those schools also have, that adds to the eventual choice for the latter in many instances , although obviously not all.  Unfortunately, it still comes down to $ many times in today's society - that's just the way it is.  On the other hand, sometimes parents and the student-athletes aren still able to find a way to attend the DIII school of their choice despite these conditions.

The D3 schools in Ohio are around $31-38K per year before any financial assistance.

Raider68:

I think you are talking about the cost of tuition only.  Just about 4-8 years ago when we were taking our daughters around looking at colleges and universities, many of the OH (and some IN) DIII schools were $10,000 above the highest cost MIAA schools for total costs.  According to the current websites of the following schools, that still appears to be the situation and all of these figures I'm listing below include tuition, R&B, etc. :

1) Kenyon College - total cost $50,400
2) Case Western Reserve  - total cost $44,000
3) Ohio Wesleyan - total cost $45,674
4) Rose Hulman (IN) total cost $54,314
5) Hope College total cost $34,620
6) Olivet College (MI) total cost $26,000

Hope, Kazoo and Albion have traditionally had the highest total costs.  Olivet, while providing a very good education, is at the bottom i.e. lowest cost.  I did not check Trine or Kazoo, however, included the above two MIAA schools just to show the comparison as again, I know that Hope has been among the top 1-2 in the MIAA for many years.

The bottom line as we all know is that the cost of a college education is not inexpensive anymore (heck, it never really was if we really compare the different eras that our parents and we grew up in ).  In addition, while many of the DIII schools have some nice financial aid packages, it still is a tough challenge.  For example, on one of the above listed OH schools finanical aid/cost sections on their website, it mentioned that the average finanicial aid package awarded to students - which included all types of scholarships including community scholarships, etc.) was $27,000.  However, not everyone gets that "break"/opportunity i.e. while many do, there is at the same time a large number of families who do not qualify for such and end up paying the majority of those costs (believe me I know! and regardless of what type of employment or career someone is in, I'm sure that most everyone will agree with me when I say that it still is not easy to fund the cost of a college education for one's son or daughter.  Moreover, we all know it is even more freightening and difficult, to say the least, for those students who do not have the privilege/luxery or whatever term one wishes to use (let's play semantics here ) of having some family assistance in that and thus have to do it all on their own.

I'm not complaining here, nor being critical, but rather just sharing all of the above information about financial costs as listed on the current websites of the above DIII schools for the purpose of our general discussion.  Also, in this context, I would just add, if I may, that even at the DIII level, recruiting for football student-athletes is just as intense as at other levels and we all know that besides having to "sell one's school" to prospective recruits (which of course, also depends on other factors that players are seeking i.e. academic curriculum for a specific desired career, the town, the campus, etc., etc.), the coaching staff in working with/in conjunction with the financial aid staff at any school has to try and see what the best financial aid package is for any family even though it is not an "athletic scholarship".  Without getting too much more into this philosophy regarding DIII vs DI or DII as far as athletic/academics (and all the factors that go along with someone choosing between those levels as far as their athletic careers if they have that choice), I'm sure most all of us would agree that those who are offered and choose a "full ride" (or partial ride at DII or DIAA uh, FCS I mean ) certainly are fortunate to have their education financed totally or in part.  Of course, that also applies to DIII for those receiving aid (although if it is in the form of loans as opposed to grants such as the athletic scholarships, that is a different situation per se and thus, those who receive the grants and don't have to pay back any of the $ are even more fortunate in that regard).  Just my opinion, but also, a worthwhile "off-season" discussion.

[sac]

Don't forget Olivet's reduced tuition program for students who choose to "commute", its a pretty significant reduction, 50% comes to mind but I've forgotten the true number.

13,000 vs 30,000+ in the rest of the MIAA is a pretty significant difference.


Albion and Kzoo are either pretty close or have gone over the $40,000 mark.



That 13,000 at Olivet is more than I paid for 1 year at Hope 20 years ago now....and thats crazy.

[formerd3db]

sac:

Indeed, that is crazy!  Calvin (non-football, of course) has been a little more than Olivet in the past, yet still is in the mid-'20's I believe (without having checked their website of recent).  As I recall, just a few years back i.e. within the last 10 or so, when Olivet was around $16,000 total, they were somewhere around $18,000 or slighly above.  I do not know if Calvin has a reduced benefit for commuters, although they do have a substantial amount of commuting students.

Also, I could be wrong, however, I think Hope will be going up slightly and be over $36,000 for the upcoming year.  And even though we are talking about total costs here for all the schools, that still doesn't really cover all the true costs as there is additional monies spent by the students for other activities at school extracurricular, of course

[Pat Coleman]

http://www.calvin.edu/prospective/tuition/

2010-2011 Academic Year

    * Tuition: $24,645
    * Room & Board: $8,525
    * Fees: $225

[Raider 68]

Another issue is that all these college costs come from after tax dollars from the parents.  If one assumes a 35%  total tax bracket then the income necessary to pay for one year of a D3 school whose total cost is $40,000 would be $61,500 before tax per year or almost $250,000 for four years.

Obviously student loans would ease the parents burden, but another issue is finding a good job in today's market given the investment for a BA degree. The student better chose the right major field of study!

[LetItRain]

Trine will run $33,900 this year all in (tuition, room, board, activity fees/parking, etc...).

Every year we get a letter defining the increase in tuition.  Our son will be a senior this fall.  I think Trine ran about $29,000 all in when he was a freshman. 

[formerd3db]

http://www.calvin.edu/prospective/tuition/

2010-2011 Academic Year

    * Tuition: $24,645
    * Room & Board: $8,525
    * Fees: $225

Thanks Pat for checking on those #'s for us.  I knew that Calvin's was at least in the mid-'20's, although admittedly am surprised they are at the $33,000 range.  I guess we shouldn't be surprised at that as it is similar to Trine as LIR just shared with us and as all the schools have to keep up with increased costs.

[formerd3db]

Another issue is that all these college costs come from after tax dollars from the parents.  If one assumes a 35%  total tax bracket then the income necessary to pay for one year of a D3 school whose total cost is $40,000 would be $61,500 before tax per year or almost $250,000 for four years.

Obviously student loans would ease the parents burden, but another issue is finding a good job in today's market given the investment for a BA degree. The student better chose the right major field of study!

Excellent points Raider68.  Indeed, for the 4 years at many of the DIII schools now it is well over $200,000 (and just think how that is for those of us who had two kids going to DIII schools at the same time - ouch

[formerd3db]

Trine will run $33,900 this year all in (tuition, room, board, activity fees/parking, etc...).

Every year we get a letter defining the increase in tuition.  Our son will be a senior this fall.  I think Trine ran about $29,000 all in when he was a freshman.  

LIR:
Thanks for sharing that with us.  It puts Trine essentially "right in line" i.e. in the middle of the MIAA schools in regards to that as well as on the same average of annual increases in cost.

BTW, best wishes to your son as he enters his senior year.  That will be exciting for him as well as you as a family.  I'm sure that you will find that it seemed like it has passed by very quickly i.e. perhaps just "seems like yesterday" when he reported as a freshman to pre-season camp.  Of course, I'm sure you will agree with me when I say that "the end to the bleeding in insight for you and your wife i.e. the financial aspect for you  .  At least I recall that feeling the past 1-3 years in regards to our own daughters!  Anyway I hope h has an enjoyable summer - this should be the "best "one - it was for me before entering my senior collegiate football year and and I wish him all the best for that as well.

[formerd3db]

I forgot to mention awhile back that recent Alma College QB and graduate MacKenzie McGrady signed a pro football contract in Finland and is playing for the Lappeenranta team (American style football) in that European league.  It is my understanding he is already there after having graduated from Alma College last month at the school's annual spring graduation.  Congrats to McGrady.

[Raider 68]

Trine will run $33,900 this year all in (tuition, room, board, activity fees/parking, etc...).

Every year we get a letter defining the increase in tuition.  Our son will be a senior this fall.  I think Trine ran about $29,000 all in when he was a freshman. 

When our son went to Mount, he received a reduction of his tuition for being a Legacy. A legacy is granted to students whose parents were prior graduates of the school. At that time,
it was about $3-4K reduction off tuition. Do the MIAA schools have the same program?

[Stinger]

Trine will run $33,900 this year all in (tuition, room, board, activity fees/parking, etc...).

Every year we get a letter defining the increase in tuition.  Our son will be a senior this fall.  I think Trine ran about $29,000 all in when he was a freshman. 

When our son went to Mount, he received a reduction of his tuition for being a Legacy. A legacy is granted to students whose parents were prior graduates of the school. At that time,
it was about $3-4K reduction off tuition. Do the MIAA schools have the same program?

Kalamazoo has a legacy scholarship, however I am not sure how large it is. 

K's total cost is at $40,419.  There are relatively few full-pay students.  I enrolled at K in the fall of 1993. I believe total cost was $19,900.   Pretty amazing that's it doubled in that time.

[Raider 68]

Trine will run $33,900 this year all in (tuition, room, board, activity fees/parking, etc...).

Every year we get a letter defining the increase in tuition.  Our son will be a senior this fall.  I think Trine ran about $29,000 all in when he was a freshman. 

When our son went to Mount, he received a reduction of his tuition for being a Legacy. A legacy is granted to students whose parents were prior graduates of the school. At that time,
it was about $3-4K reduction off tuition. Do the MIAA schools have the same program?

Kalamazoo has a legacy scholarship, however I am not sure how large it is. 

K's total cost is at $40,419.  There are relatively few full-pay students.  I enrolled at K in the fall of 1993. I believe total cost was $19,900.   Pretty amazing that's it doubled in that time.

When we in western Michigan, we lived in Colony Woods, in Portage, Our son graduated from Portage Central HS, after his first 2 yrs in Ohio.  He had a few friends/classmates that went to K'zoo when he went to Mt. Union.