FB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[sflzman]

Wooden shoes?

The game between Hope and Kalamazoo will mark the  renewal of the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry between the Flying Dutchmen and Hornets. The rivalry started in 1910. It has been known as the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry since 1931.
 
Having a pair of hand-carved wooden shoes as a traveling trophy was the idea of Hope football coach Milton "Bud" Hinga who was a Kalamazoo College graduate.

Thakns! That helps a lot....it's kind of a cool traveling trophy.

On a sidenote about MIAA rivalries - Alma/KZOO will meet for the 100th time this year.

[Flying Dutch Fan]

Wooden shoes?

The game between Hope and Kalamazoo will mark the  renewal of the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry between the Flying Dutchmen and Hornets. The rivalry started in 1910. It has been known as the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry since 1931.
 
Having a pair of hand-carved wooden shoes as a traveling trophy was the idea of Hope football coach Milton "Bud" Hinga who was a Kalamazoo College graduate.

Thakns! That helps a lot....it's kind of a cool traveling trophy.

On a sidenote about MIAA rivalries - Alma/KZOO will meet for the 100th time this year.

Hope@Kalamazoo is also the 100th meeting

[BoredatWork56]

How many traveling trophies are there in the MIAA. We all know about the famous wooden shoes, but what are the others?

Trine-Adrain has the Black and Blue Border Brawl trophy.

[Raider 68]

Wooden shoes?

The game between Hope and Kalamazoo will mark the  renewal of the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry between the Flying Dutchmen and Hornets. The rivalry started in 1910. It has been known as the "Wooden Shoes" rivalry since 1931.
 
Having a pair of hand-carved wooden shoes as a traveling trophy was the idea of Hope football coach Milton "Bud" Hinga who was a Kalamazoo College graduate.

Thakns! That helps a lot....it's kind of a cool traveling trophy.

On a sidenote about MIAA rivalries - Alma/KZOO will meet for the 100th time this year.

Hope@Kalamazoo is also the 100th meeting

Who is the favorite?

[realist]

Following up on the discussion on the b-ball board regarding Calvin adding football. 
How many of the D3 football programs operate in the black (break even or make a profit) or are most programs subsidized?  What are the operational expenses on a yearly basis to field a football program? 

[Mr. Ypsi]

Following up on the discussion on the b-ball board regarding Calvin adding football. 
How many of the D3 football programs operate in the black (break even or make a profit) or are most programs subsidized?  What are the operational expenses on a yearly basis to field a football program? 

That is a very difficult question to answer, because it depends on what revenues should be counted.  I'd say that direct football revenues vs. direct football costs, virtually every d3 program would be in the red.  But if alumni giving rises due to fb, or, especially, if a number of students are paying tuition who otherwise would not be enrolled, many if not most fb programs would be cost-neutral or even profitable.

[sflzman]

How many traveling trophies are there in the MIAA. We all know about the famous wooden shoes, but what are the others?

Trine-Adrain has the Black and Blue Border Brawl trophy.

I had heard of something "way-back-when" with Albion/Alma....but I don't know if anything exists now.

I also know Kalamazoo/Olivet is supposedly a "Huge" rivalry, and even got shown on ESPN's 50 states in 50 days leading up to the first week of College football last summer, but I do not remember if it said anything of a traveling trophy.

I am close to the Alma SID, and I know he has an MIAA history book so I'll look at that sometime later this week to see further....

[D306]

WOW

Looking at the "pick-ems" I was surprisd to see so many people picking Kazoo over Hope

I thought I saw something in the young Kazoo team others would wait longer to trust.

Get a little defense play and they can make some noise in the coming years, with this young group of offense talent.

Great set of games in HS and College this weekend. Good weather to take in a few.

[formerd3db]

Actually, I wasn't surprised that some people picked Kazoo over Hope today.  Since they beat Albion last week, in part, that I do not doubt had something to do with it.  In addition, after seeing them play today against us (Hope) I can see why.  Kazoo is a much improved team compared to its recent years.  Had Hope not "made the plays" when they needed to today (unlike they were not able to do in our first four games), Kazoo certainly could have won the game.  However, Hope was not going to let happen what did last year when Kazoo came back blazing in the second half and almost (although not quite) won the game.  Hope's 35-24 win today was a much needed additional boost of confidence, which we'll need for next week playing down at Albion.  It is always tough playing down there, even with Albion having a tough year as it has been.

It was extremely hot/humid today at the game - no clouds, totally sunny and no breeze at all.  While I will take that over the rain we had the last couple of weeks during the games, it was almost too hot.  Towards the end of the game, some players started having cramps even though they were taking lots of fluids.  Also, starting QB Feys sprained an ankle in the 3rd quarter but was able to return to finish the 4th quarter.  He'll probably play next week, but will obviously need to work with the training staff this week.

Reports on the other MIAA games today?

[Raider 68]

Actually, I wasn't surprised that some people picked Kazoo over Hope today.  Since they beat Albion last week, in part, that I do not doubt had something to do with it.  In addition, after seeing them play today against us (Hope) I can see why.  Kazoo is a much improved team compared to its recent years.  Had Hope not "made the plays" when they needed to today (unlike they were not able to do in our first four games), Kazoo certainly could have won the game.  However, Hope was not going to let happen what did last year when Kazoo came back blazing in the second half and almost (although not quite) won the game.  Hope's 35-24 win today was a much needed additional boost of confidence, which we'll need for next week playing down at Albion.  It is always tough playing down there, even with Albion having a tough year as it has been.

It was extremely hot/humid today at the game - no clouds, totally sunny and no breeze at all.  While I will take that over the rain we had the last couple of weeks during the games, it was almost too hot.  Towards the end of the game, some players started having cramps even though they were taking lots of fluids.  Also, starting QB Feys sprained an ankle in the 3rd quarter but was able to return to finish the 4th quarter.  He'll probably play next week, but will obviously need to work with the training staff this week.

Reports on the other MIAA games today?

Formerd3db,

Congrats on the big Hope win, this may really help their season for the positive!

[formerd3db]

Actually, I wasn't surprised that some people picked Kazoo over Hope today.  Since they beat Albion last week, in part, that I do not doubt had something to do with it.  In addition, after seeing them play today against us (Hope) I can see why.  Kazoo is a much improved team compared to its recent years.  Had Hope not "made the plays" when they needed to today (unlike they were not able to do in our first four games), Kazoo certainly could have won the game.  However, Hope was not going to let happen what did last year when Kazoo came back blazing in the second half and almost (although not quite) won the game.  Hope's 35-24 win today was a much needed additional boost of confidence, which we'll need for next week playing down at Albion.  It is always tough playing down there, even with Albion having a tough year as it has been.

It was extremely hot/humid today at the game - no clouds, totally sunny and no breeze at all.  While I will take that over the rain we had the last couple of weeks during the games, it was almost too hot.  Towards the end of the game, some players started having cramps even though they were taking lots of fluids.  Also, starting QB Feys sprained an ankle in the 3rd quarter but was able to return to finish the 4th quarter.  He'll probably play next week, but will obviously need to work with the training staff this week.

Reports on the other MIAA games today?

Formerd3db,

Congrats on the big Hope win, this may really help their season for the positive!

Thanks Raider.  Yes, it was nice to get that and, as I mentioned, it will be a postive for heading into next week's game at Albion (even though it will be tough down there).

Congrats on your Mount's win also.  While I expected them to win, I was surprised to see that they only beat Marietta by 28-14.  I guess Marietta is a much improved team it would appear.

[Raider 68]

FormerD3db,

The Mount game was a very sloppy and one of the worst for the Raiders in terms on concentration. While Marietta has improved, Mount should have won by 42+, but rarely do they have down weeks! When you have a young team, it can happen!

[CometAlum]

I can take a loss, but I cannot take lack of game preperation and competitiveness. Olivet's program has been run into the ground.

After speaking with a senior who quit due to the lack of competence from the the coaching staff, I learned why we won't win a game this year. Players are not required to weight train or watch film. They do not have playbooks they can study, the coaches many of the coaches show up right before practice and leave right after practice. Players are not allowed to give feedback to the defensive coordinator on what's happening on the field. Roster is down to 60 players, they do not run a scout team. This program is just plain bad.

I know it is a new coaching staff and they had a very hard non-conference schedual, but three of those four teams we have been playing anyway and ha e been semi-competitive against them. Now we get blown out at Homecoming against Adrian. 4 first downs and 0 3rd down conversions. How long do play cover 2 before you realize it is not working.
It may be a lack of talant, but come on same story diffrent week.

I am thinking about wearing a paper bag over my head at the next home game.
Signed, Depressed.

[sflzman]

I can take a loss, but I cannot take lack of game preperation and competitiveness. Olivet's program has been run into the ground.

After speaking with a senior who quit due to the lack of competence from the the coaching staff, I learned why we won't win a game this year. Players are not required to weight train or watch film. They do not have playbooks they can study, the coaches many of the coaches show up right before practice and leave right after practice. Players are not allowed to give feedback to the defensive coordinator on what's happening on the field. Roster is down to 60 players, they do not run a scout team. This program is just plain bad.

I know it is a new coaching staff and they had a very hard non-conference schedual, but three of those four teams we have been playing anyway and ha e been semi-competitive against them. Now we get blown out at Homecoming against Adrian. 4 first downs and 0 3rd down conversions. How long do play cover 2 before you realize it is not working.
It may be a lack of talant, but come on same story diffrent week.

I am thinking about wearing a paper bag over my head at the next home game.
Signed, Depressed.

Wow, that's definately not what you want to here from a team that is struggling. I know the coaches at Alma were still in the film office at 8:00 pm on Friday working on film for Trine. There isn't a day of the week where I don't see those guys in the office by noon, or out of the office before 7:00. This also may be easier with the great coaching facilities at Alma - not sure what Olivet has - becuase we have 3 full coaches offices for football, each of them have 2 workstations, along with a film office that has 2 workstations, and a complete workroom that has two (going to be 4 within the next year) workstations.

But on the flipside, with the cover 2 you are talking about. At one point, if you're a coach, you may decide that you're bad, so just try to build your program with the offense and defense you are going to run....you may struggle for a few seasons, but at least you're putting in your offense/defense into the program.

[formerd3db]

CometAlum:

If how the program is being run is true (assuming what the senior told you is exactly what has been going on), that is not only very sad, but disappointing.  And the attendance turnout for yesterday's Homecoming game there as reported was atrocious. Those kind of arrangements constitute the same type of situation that Olivet was in before Sigler took over a few years back; coaches arriving late (or not showing up at all people reported), and the roster getting down to about 42 people for the latter half of the season one year.  Of course, a new staff has to be given some leeway and a chance, particularly in the first year.  However, if Coach Hulkow and his staff continue to run the program like you say it is, I would say that most people would agree with you that Olivet is in trouble for quite some time.  Could it be that Hulkow is in over his head?  This, albeit small college football, is college football and it is a completely different "animal" than high school, even if someone had a successful career in running a top notch high school program including state championships.

I realize that at the majority of small schools (and particularly one the size of Olivet), the assistant coaching staff salaries are miniscule, most of the coaching staff are part-time, holding other full-time jobs with families and/or are going to school and the hours even at this level are very long and time consuming - much, much more than high school.  You can't run a program like it is done in high school in most of the ways it is done at the latter level and if coaches aren't able to commit to the extreme amount of time it takes at this level, a program will be at the lower tier and medicore at best.  I am not saying that Hulkow and staff are not committed nor putting additional time into their weekly preparation, as obviously, I do not know any details or particulars other than what you have told all of us here, and based on what you are sharing from the senior (and assuming that person is not just a disgruntled player who did not get playing time or some other underlyiing dispute/problem between him and the coaching staff). However, if what you relate is the status of the program at present, Olivet has/is regressing back to its very poor state of operations that it had a few decades ago and that is very sad.  I can't believe the administration and/or the alumni would allow that to happen at this point - they seemed to have made some great strides the past 12 years or so overall including the facilites, the last 3 years in football notwithstanding.  Yet, when only 955 people show up for the Homecoming football game, something is wrong.  Just my take on this based on the info you have related.