FB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[ThunderHead]

I'd be surprised, I though Cole kind of built the Alma program. He has had success there, but I think everyone could agree the expectations where higher this year, and they were not met.

Still - does that mean there is someone else out there better or who understands Alma better?

[Raider 68]

I'd be surprised, I though Cole kind of built the Alma program. He has had success there, but I think everyone could agree they expectations where higher this year, and they were not met.

Still - does that mean there is someone else out there better or who understands Alma better?

Thunderhead,

Agree, your karma is moving up!

[sflzman]

Just curious if anyone out there believes that  Coach Cole is done at Alma after this year. Whether he resigns or is fired. The rumor I heard was that the AD convinced the President of the college to allow him to continue this year. Just curious as to other opinions.

sflzman.

Have any word of this?

There was actually rumors pre-season that this would be Cole's last year whether we had a good season or not. If anything is true, then I don't know....

I'd be surprised, I though Cole kind of built the Alma program. He has had success there, but I think everyone could agree the expectations where higher this year, and they were not met.

Yes Cole had a great thing going here, but these past three graduating classes (2010,2011,2012) are all the first three in the Cole Era not to win an MIAA championship

Still - does that mean there is someone else out there better or who understands Alma better?

Trust me when I say this is like pulling names from a hat when I say I've not heard this once, and it's just my opinion of to what COULD happen:

If they stay internally I'd say look towards John Lewis the D.C. right now. Of anywhere on this team that has been the area that has looked the best and had the best players on this team the past few years.

As far as where they would potentially go to outside of Alma I have no idea where you even begin in looking for a potential candidate.

[ACMIAAD3]

Like I said just curious... I also think that if they stay inside the program that Lewis is probably the one who gets it...I wonder if the AD will get a directive from the president to go outside. Will see I would love to see Alma get back to contending every year. Thanks for the input everyone.

[ACMIAAD3]

Here's to hoping that the Scots finally put it all together and finish strong against the Bull Dawgs... GO Scots!!!

[sflzman]

+k to that one brotha! 

[Mr. Ypsi]

JoePa has coached his last game.  The University President was also dismissed.

I hope that people will recall both in better overall terms (President Spanier greatly improved PSU's academic profile, and Paterno has done many wonderful things over his career), but this was just too horrendous not to totally clean house.

[formerd3db]

Hopewatcher:
Thanks for the kind comments to all of us and allow me to return the same compliments to you.  I/we've enjoyed your participation on the board here also. In addition, congrats on moving up to the next level as a poster! I assume you will be at the game Saturday at Olivet and if so, perhaps we can meet up sometime, at least for a few minutes.  I am going to try and get to the game earlier.

ACMIAAD3, sflzman, Raider, ThunderHead:
First, welcome to the board ACMIAAD3.  Secondly, although there were rumors about Cole's status at the beginning of the season and despite this season's record, IMO, it would be a shame and absurd to fire him or force him to resign.  Leister is the AD and he has been friends/a colleague with Cole since his arrival there.  Lewis, Leister, Cole, and all the assistant coaches are all great guys and coaches; and don't get me wrong, Lewis would be a good choice also.  However, just because Alma has hit a rough patch here the past 2-3 years, IMO doesn't mean it is absolutely necessary to make a change.  If you use that line of thinking, Kreps should have been gone before this year after the 3 straight 3-7 seasons and there were certainly many who were calling for his dismissal - and that would have simply been absurd.  He and his staff persevered and pressed on and look at the result this year.  So to have let him go would have been a huge mistake.  I said it before and I'll stick to my opinion on this - while wins are important (obviously nobody likes to lose), there is a much more important reason/a higher value for having a program and Kreps emobodies that in the way he runs the program and teaches his players for something far more important in later life.  So does Jim Cole. And finally, I cant' immagine that Leister would end up firing Cole at the behest of the new president (unless Leister is given an ultimatum to keep his job by doing that - and if so, the new president at Alma is no better than Adrian's president and how Lyall's firing was handled).  I do not know this new Alma president, however, he knew nothing of Alma's program or history before coming in and IMO, to make a decision to pull the plug on Cole (unless there is some underlying behind the scenes problem - of which I find extremely hard to believe), would be wrong and it would cause me to have some less respect for Alma's president.  Furthermore, the coaches do not play the games, obviously the players do and let's be honest - for example, Hope's players simply were not playing very good the last 3 years and the overall talent has been down there and in the league; same goes for Alma.  The answer is that it takes time to change the attitudes and there is no greater example of that than Northwestern in the Big Ten - it is a comparable situation.  So the simple and true answer is that those who called for Kreps dismissal last year simply were wrong.  The same goes for Alma (unless Cole decides himself it is time for him to step down).  And that's MO.   

   

[formerd3db]

JoePa has coached his last game.  The University President was also dismissed.

I hope that people will recall both in better overall terms (President Spanier greatly improved PSU's academic profile, and Paterno has done many wonderful things over his career), but this was just too horrendous not to totally clean house.

Ditto, Mr. Ypsi.  The right decisions on this were made.  It's unfortunate, however, those people had to be held accountable.  This has kind of put the "Ohio State Story" on the backburner per se.

[ACMIAAD3]

Hopewatcher:
Thanks for the kind comments to all of us and allow me to return the same compliments to you.  I/we've enjoyed your participation on the board here also. In addition, congrats on moving up to the next level as a poster! I assume you will be at the game Saturday at Olivet and if so, perhaps we can meet up sometime, at least for a few minutes.  I am going to try and get to the game earlier.

ACMIAAD3, sflzman, Raider, ThunderHead:
First, welcome to the board ACMIAAD3.  Secondly, although there were rumors about Cole's status at the beginning of the season and despite this season's record, IMO, it would be a shame and absurd to fire him or force him to resign.  Leister is the AD and he has been friends/a colleague with Cole since his arrival there.  Lewis, Leister, Cole, and all the assistant coaches are all great guys and coaches; and don't get me wrong, Lewis would be a good choice also.  However, just because Alma has hit a rough patch here the past 2-3 years, IMO doesn't mean it is absolutely necessary to make a change.  If you use that line of thinking, Kreps should have been gone before this year after the 3 straight 3-7 seasons and there were certainly many who were calling for his dismissal - and that would have simply been absurd.  He and his staff persevered and pressed on and look at the result this year.  So to have let him go would have been a huge mistake.  I said it before and I'll stick to my opinion on this - while wins are important (obviously nobody likes to lose), there is a much more important reason/a higher value for having a program and Kreps emobodies that in the way he runs the program and teaches his players for something far more important in later life.  So does Jim Cole. And finally, I cant' immagine that Leister would end up firing Cole at the behest of the new president (unless Leister is given an ultimatum to keep his job by doing that - and if so, the new president at Alma is no better than Adrian's president and how Lyall's firing was handled).  I do not know this new Alma president, however, he knew nothing of Alma's program or history before coming in and IMO, to make a decision to pull the plug on Cole (unless there is some underlying behind the scenes problem - of which I find extremely hard to believe), would be wrong and it would cause me to have some less respect for Alma's president.  Furthermore, the coaches do not play the games, obviously the players do and let's be honest - for example, Hope's players simply were not playing very good the last 3 years and the overall talent has been down there and in the league; same goes for Alma.  The answer is that it takes time to change the attitudes and there is no greater example of that than Northwestern in the Big Ten - it is a comparable situation.  So the simple and true answer is that those who called for Kreps dismissal last year simply were wrong.  The same goes for Alma (unless Cole decides himself it is time for him to step down).  And that's MO.   

I appreciate the input as I have only been around Alma for a short time. I was impressed with Coach Cole and his character. However in light of some of the teams problems that are public and some that have not come to light, my respect for him has waivered a bit. I wonder how some other colleges deal with these inhouse incidents. Like I said I was impressed when I first met Coach Cole and I respect all that he has done, but these past few season have had to play hard on a dedicated Coach like him. I would not be surprised he he decided to step down on his own now that his son is going to be finished playing. I wish him and all the Scots the best and hope if it is Coach Coles last game they go out with a BANG.

[Mr. Ypsi]

JoePa has coached his last game.  The University President was also dismissed.

I hope that people will recall both in better overall terms (President Spanier greatly improved PSU's academic profile, and Paterno has done many wonderful things over his career), but this was just too horrendous not to totally clean house.

Ditto, Mr. Ypsi.  The right decisions on this were made.  It's unfortunate, however, those people had to be held accountable.  This has kind of put the "Ohio State Story" on the backburner per se.

Yeah free tattoos (and extra practices under RichRod) certainly pale beside letting a pedophile have an extra decade of victims.   In the stories I've seen so far, I haven't seen anything about the fate of McQueary (the former QB, then grad assistant, now an assistant coach) who made the initial report to Paterno.  Like Paterno, he is legally off the hook (he did the minimum required by law), but come on - he was 28 (not the 22-year-old I initially envisioned when they said 'grad assistant').  Why the he!! didn't he call the cops?  PSU needs a FULL house cleaning.

[formerd3db]

ACMIAAD3:
So what are these other alleged "in house" problems?  I have not heard anything about these.  If there are some issues that have occurred that perhaps come into play regarding "mis-doings", then perhaps, just perhaps, that might be a consideration for a chance.  On the other hand, if these "issues" are in regards to disagreements with "in house" policies, then that is "hogwash" and comes down to personality conflicts.  Alma has always had a conflict in many issues between the administration and the athletic department for many years since the late Robert Swanson and the late Oscar Remmick were presidents, so that is nothing new and wouldn't surprise me in being the underyling root of the problem.  Now, admittedly, I know nothing a which you speak so am obviously only speculating here.  Yet, if there are "issues", seems to me those should be out in the forefront for everyone to ponder.  Having aspects that are kept from appropriate awareness both withing the College community and its alumni is not a good management practice - just ask those at Penn State - and that is not meant to be a joke.   Obviously, we'll see what happens.  Regardless, like you, I wish Coach Cole and his staff and the team all the best in their final game of this season this Saturday.  I'm sure it will be a "bittersweet" day anyway because of it being Coach Cole's son's last game of his career.

Mr. Ypsi:
Once again, I agree with you.  Calling this a tragedy seems pale - not sure there are any other worse words to describe it.  I'm simply flabbergasted. 

Also, with regard to your reference to the remainder of the coaching staff, we are not sure what those people knew if anything.  One of the current full time assistants is Ron Vanderlinden, former 4 time ALL-MIAA football player at Albion College in our MIAA, former assistant coach at Albion, Bowling Green, Colorado, defensive coordinator at Northwestern and former head coach at Maryland.  He is a a top notch man all the way around, inducted into Albion's Athletic Hall of Fame last year and I find it more than difficult to lump him in with this disastrous situation.  Also, as much as there are some very wrong things with college football and basketball, I can't agree with those who call for the immediate discontinuance of the season for Penn State.  Those current players had nothing to do with this whatsoever and, while one might make the argument that that happens with sanctions also when NCAA violations occur and, for example, the death penalty at SMU in the 1980's, and while this is without question worse than those situations - the worst ever - I think that this needs to, at least for now, be dealt with by the legal system as it is, those people involved being held accountable as they are now being done so, and then evaluate in the immediate off-season as to what further to do with the program.  But immediately firing the rest of the staff (with the exception of McCleary) unless there is knowledge that the others on the staff knew about this, IMO, serves no purpose.  And where are the families of the alleged victims and/or other victimes themselves?  It is a terrible and embarrassing aspect for them without question, however, they need to come forward to help if they want justice done - and it should be, for what that is worth as far as how much it will be of help/comfort to them for the rest of their lives (which, unfortunately, is probably not much).  Anyway, again, just MO on this.  No doubt some others will disagree with me or perhaps have a different slant/perspective.  But, without question, this has to be one of or perhaps the most horrendous day for college football in its history.

[adidas28]

JoePa has coached his last game.  The University President was also dismissed.

I hope that people will recall both in better overall terms (President Spanier greatly improved PSU's academic profile, and Paterno has done many wonderful things over his career), but this was just too horrendous not to totally clean house.

I believe that "this" is going to be Paterno's legacy. Not with the true blue Penn St. fan that is tipping over vans and rioting on campus - but the tradition, records, and everything else that Paterno built over the last 50 years will forever be a secondary thought to the reasons that he left.

Can you imagine if this had happened 9 months ago? I believe that Tre$$el would still be coaching at O$U, because in comparison a free tattoo, or for that matter a new car seems to pale in comparison to the tragedies that took place on the Penn St. campus over the last decade. in my opinion anybody that knew any part of what had been going on should be gone immediately. Some may have done nothing wrong legally but morally these people failed those kids.

Alright, I 'll step down off my soap box now.

Go Thunder!

[sac]

Let's remember what Tressel did for a second before people start dismissing his little problem as not significant  (by comparison obvious).  He LIED to the NCAA 3 times about players eligibility, he didn't even go to his AD when he learned of a problem, he clearly and flagrantly violated NCAA rules.  He didn't get fired because some dudes were getting free ink.  He was fired (sorry allowed to honorably retire  ) because he lied to his employer and the NCAA.  It took OSU 6 months of doing the happy bear dance around the issue to finally come to the conclusion they do something other than nothing. 

Either way, the way the higher ups at these two institutions have handled both situations has been embarrassing for everyone.


In the bad analogies department, a homicide is still a homicide even if the person didn't kill as many as the serial killer down the block. 

[sac]

Also there is this, very timely......

http://www.buckeyextra.com/content/stories/2011/11/10/ohio-state-ncaa.html

organizations that have something to hide release bad news on days it will likely be burried.  "Failure to monitor" is one step from of "lack of institutional control".

All along OSU has played the 'rogue element' theory, here the NCAA is basically saying we don't buy it, try again.