FB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[formerd3db]

Gah!!  EMU strikes again!!

My younger son's graduation will be delayed from April to either June or August, because two classes biology majors are required to take are ONLY offered at the same time.  WHY is my former employer so friggin' incompetent and user-UNfriendly?

Sorry to hear that Mr. Y.  What's wrong with those people?  I  do not doubt your son will accomplish his goal, however, it is certainly disappointing that the slight "curve" has been thrown his way.  I know what you mean.  Our oldest daughter faced the same situation when she was finishing her Masters Degree in teaching administration at Western Michigan University a couple of years ago.  She would have finished well ahead of the schedule, but her last required class was only offered some 3 months after she was to "officially graduate".  Nonetheless, she was allowed to "walk" for the official graduation ceremony with all the other Western graduates (both undergrad and grad).  She successfully completed the course and earned her degree.  Anyway, keep us posted on your son's eventual completion and I wish him all the best.

BTW, EMU is having a touch year.  The way they started out, I thought perhaps this might be the [albeit small] turning point.  I haven't heard or seen much from the Wabash people regarding what their thoughts are about CC there so far-they are busy concentrating on the great season the LG's are having this year and that is understandable!  But, it would be interesting to hear what they think, perhaps in the near future. 

Re: MIAA topics.  My prediction is that we (Hope) will win at Kalamazoo this Saturday and therefore avoid a non-win conference record.  As sac noted, that would match a very, very old record.  At the same time, Hope can't take Kazoo lightly and...it is at Kazoo's stadium.  It would be nice to have a decent crowd there, however, with both teams' records what they are, I doubt it will be large (guess is as per their usual, well <1,000).  They do have a good tailgating tradition, however. I do feel for Kazoo also as they seemed to have taken a step backward.  However, I believe Zorbo is a good coach with a good staff.  They are just hindered by the type of student-athlete they can recruit for various reasons.  But...at the same time, if Olivet can do it, I think they could too. 

And finally, this obviously has been the quietest board here this season.  I am not sure why; perhaps our posters have just been busy with important family/personal aspects.  Regardless, it has been disappointing.  Hopefully, some new people will join next year and perhaps we can get some of the past "MIAA regulars and/or frequent visitors" to return in the future.

[Raider 68]

Gah!!  EMU strikes again!!

My younger son's graduation will be delayed from April to either June or August, because two classes biology majors are required to take are ONLY offered at the same time.  WHY is my former employer so friggin' incompetent and user-UNfriendly?

Sorry to hear that Mr. Y.  What's wrong with those people?  I  do not doubt your son will accomplish his goal, however, it is certainly disappointing that the slight "curve" has been thrown his way.  I know what you mean.  Our oldest daughter faced the same situation when she was finishing her Masters Degree in teaching administration at Western Michigan University a couple of years ago.  She would have finished well ahead of the schedule, but her last required class was only offered some 3 months after she was to "officially graduate".  Nonetheless, she was allowed to "walk" for the official graduation ceremony with all the other Western graduates (both undergrad and grad).  She successfully completed the course and earned her degree.  Anyway, keep us posted on your son's eventual completion and I wish him all the best.

BTW, EMU is having a touch year.  The way they started out, I thought perhaps this might be the [albeit small] turning point.  I haven't heard or seen much from the Wabash people regarding what their thoughts are about CC there so far-they are busy concentrating on the great season the LG's are having this year and that is understandable!  But, it would be interesting to hear what they think, perhaps in the near future. 

Re: MIAA topics.  My prediction is that we (Hope) will win at Kalamazoo this Saturday and therefore avoid a non-win conference record.  As sac noted, that would match a very, very old record.  At the same time, Hope can't take Kazoo lightly and...it is at Kazoo's stadium.  It would be nice to have a decent crowd there, however, with both teams' records what they are, I doubt it will be large (guess is as per their usual, well <1,000).  They do have a good tailgating tradition, however. I do feel for Kazoo also as they seemed to have taken a step backward.  However, I believe Zorbo is a good coach with a good staff.  They are just hindered by the type of student-athlete they can recruit for various reasons.  But...at the same time, if Olivet can do it, I think they could too. 

And finally, this obviously has been the quietest board here this season.  I am not sure why; perhaps our posters have just been busy with important family/personal aspects.  Regardless, it has been disappointing.  Hopefully, some new people will join next year and perhaps we can get some of the past "MIAA regulars and/or frequent visitors" to return in the future.

formerd3db,

Hope you are well. Regarding the MIAA board, I agree that it has really been quiet. I have not posted that much this fall
on the OAC board and have been a guest on this one. Looks like Albion will represent the MIAA and has had a good year
with a lot of offense according the NCAA stats. How far will they get in the playoffs? Your alma mater has not been
as successful this fall as I thought they would.

Regarding the Raiders this year, they are extremely strong and the stats bear that out. They should be in the Stagg again,
but we will see how the playoffs go for all teams. There appears to be more stronger teams this year.

[formerd3db]

Raider68:

Good to hear from you.  Doing well here, thanks.  I hope you are doing well also.

I agree with your assessments this year.  I, too, believe Mount will get back to the Stagg this years.  Yet, I also agree that it seems to be one of those years (perhaps the first in a long time) where there might be kind of a "free for all", if you will, regarding all the teams who have legit shot at getting there.  I see it as kind of similar to the FBS CFP, which there is so much more parity this year-again, perhaps more than any other year in the recent past.  It will be exciting to see who makes it.

Although I chimed in on the lack of activity on our board, I admit that I have been part of that less than zealous of posters this year as well.  Much going on for many people, and I get that.  But, that said, we have always appreciated your contributions here and visiting us.  Besides, you know our board is not a "brutal" as your OAC board!   I'm sure that is why some people don't venture over there that much!!

As far as our season, yes, it has been most disappointing and I really did not see it coming like that.  I thought we'd be 7-3 at the minimum.  Some disappointing performances by many this year and I am not sure why.  Also, once that disappointing "woe is me" type of attitude sets in among a team, it is difficult to break out of that during the season, no matter how hard the coaches try to maker that happen and encourage players.  Of course, one can assert that old saying that those who are really tough will do what it takes to "right the ship" but even those who have that ability, it is easier said than done. 

Regardless, I would like to see our MIAA rep (as you say, it appears it will be Albion) go well into the playoff rounds, however, I am not that confident it will happen.  Perhaps I might be surprised like I/we were way back in 1994 when Albion did that. 

Good luck to your team.  Remembering my trip to visit you and the playoff game-that seems like ages ago.

[sac]

Michigan State Normal College (later known as Eastern Michigan University) left the MIAA in 1926   

[DBQ1965]

I am among those who have been quiet for sometime on the MIAA board.  Without an emotional investment in either the MIAA or any of its teams ... and with Hope in closest geographical proximity but with a pretty dismal season ... I haven't had much enthusiasm generated here. 

But with my alma mater having clinched at least a tie for first place in the IIAC and having clinched a spot in the playoffs, all has not been lost.  Four years ago when Dubuque made the playoffs for the first time in 20+ years, I was all set for a Dubuque - Monmouth first-round match up.  Alas, the Spartans got paired with North Central and their play off run was short lived.  This time around, I'm thinking we get to travel to Wheaton for the first round.  If that materializes, at least it is a reasonable drive from Grand Rapids.  So ... GO BLUE ... and I don't mean that "M" team.

[Raider 68]

I am among those who have been quiet for sometime on the MIAA board.  Without an emotional investment in either the MIAA or any of its teams ... and with Hope in closest geographical proximity but with a pretty dismal season ... I haven't had much enthusiasm generated here. 

But with my alma mater having clinched at least a tie for first place in the IIAC and having clinched a spot in the playoffs, all has not been lost.  Four years ago when Dubuque made the playoffs for the first time in 20+ years, I was all set for a Dubuque - Monmouth first-round match up.  Alas, the Spartans got paired with North Central and their play off run was short lived.  This time around, I'm thinking we get to travel to Wheaton for the first round.  If that materializes, at least it is a reasonable drive from Grand Rapids.  So ... GO BLUE ... and I don't mean that "M" team.

So the real question is: why is there so little interest in D3 football in Michigan? This is based upon the low attendance
and almost non-existent posting on this board. Is it based upon an MIAA conference winner not advancing in the playoffs,
or the lack of interest since there are some top D2 schools and the big D1 schools who draw the fans and interest?

[DBQ1965]

I am among those who have been quiet for sometime on the MIAA board.  Without an emotional investment in either the MIAA or any of its teams ... and with Hope in closest geographical proximity but with a pretty dismal season ... I haven't had much enthusiasm generated here. 

But with my alma mater having clinched at least a tie for first place in the IIAC and having clinched a spot in the playoffs, all has not been lost.  Four years ago when Dubuque made the playoffs for the first time in 20+ years, I was all set for a Dubuque - Monmouth first-round match up.  Alas, the Spartans got paired with North Central and their play off run was short lived.  This time around, I'm thinking we get to travel to Wheaton for the first round.  If that materializes, at least it is a reasonable drive from Grand Rapids.  So ... GO BLUE ... and I don't mean that "M" team.

So the real question is: why is there so little interest in D3 football in Michigan? This is based upon the low attendance
and almost non-existent posting on this board. Is it based upon an MIAA conference winner not advancing in the playoffs,
or the lack of interest since there are some top D2 schools and the big D1 schools who draw the fans and interest?

. 

I can't really speak to the "big picture" on the questions you asked, but I can speak from my own perspective.  As for MIAA, I usually attend 5 or 6 games a season between Hope, Olivet, and Kalamazoo.  I love D3 football and really enjoy the atmosphere at those games ... even the bad hot dogs.  Its more fun with competitive games, but you can't always have that.  Attendance is better in the MIAA when you have a successful team but there is some pretty good loyalty whatever the record.  A couple of years back it appeared Olivet was on the rise along with Kzoo, and then there was the Hope, Trine, Adrian, and Albion mix.  The MIAA could be a good conference with some consistency ... the lack of that is why no team ever seems to get beyond the first round of the playoffs.

It does hurt attendance to have a lot of D2 schools in Michigan, although I stopped going to Grand Valley State games when they went to all night games.  One of the best football programs in the area was at Grand Rapids Community College ... wide open, exciting offense and good solid defense.  The program was eliminated a couple of years ago for $$$ reasons and the coach went to Ferris State ... now ranked 2nd nationally in D2.  Add to that the MAC schools along with the two "big" programs, and there is a lot of competition for the football fan.

In Iowa the situation is much the same.  You have the IIAC with pretty good attendance I think, 3 to 4 strong conference teams year to year.  But then there are a number of NAIA teams which have their own following plus the big 3 ... Iowa, Iowa State, and Northern Iowa.  I almost forgot about Drake.

I'm not familiar with the situation in Ohio but it seems to be pretty healthy there.  Even with the OSU, and handful of good MAC schools, the D3 programs in Ohio seem strong.  But I'm an outside looking in.

So that's my take from here.  Right now I'm caught up in high school playoff hysteria.  We have some outstanding programs in west Michigan and there is nothing like the "go big or stay home" atmosphere of high school playoff time.

There's my 2-cents worth.

[USee]

Sorry if Missed this somewhere but if everybody wins Saturday do we know definitively who gets the AQ? Albion I assume?

[Pat Coleman]

Yes, Albion.
http://www.d3football.com/playoffs/2015/automatic-bids

[USee]

Useful. Thanks

[formerd3db]

USee:
Pat is spot on (as usual,  ).  If Alma beats Olivet and Trine wins @ Adrian, then there will be a two way tie for the MIAA title between Trine and Albion.  Trine would then get the AQ by virtue of having beat Albion 55-51 earlier this year.  However, if Olivet and Trine both win, Albion gets the AQ.  If the latter scenario, the summary of the H-T-H competition between the 3 is:

Trine beat Albion 55-51      +4
Trine lost to Olivet 49-24  -25
                                          -21

Olivet lost to Albion 49-21         -28
Olivet beat Trine      49-24   +25
                                                -3 

Albion beat Olivet  49-21         +28
Albion lost to Trine  55-51         -4
                                                  +24     
                               
A wild year it has been in our MIAA, although it has often happened that the league title has come down to the very end over the years.  However, I think that many of us believe this has also been one of the strangest, at least in part, since a couple of weeks ago there was talk of the improbable chance there might be a 5 way tie.  Wierd (sp intended ).

[formerd3db]

DBQ1965:

Congrats to your Dubuque for this season.  Last month I had to make a trip to Colorado Springs for a conference and had the opportunity to stop by the Dubuque (and Loras) campuses mid-week since I drove and made a "blast trip" out and back.  Very nice stadium at your alma mater, which they just had a new dedication this September to the former long-time coach in the earlier days.  Loras Rock Bowl also nice.  Both nice campuses.

Once again, you and I did not hook up for a visit at one of the Hope games this year-no fault of either of us.  Crudy weather at the last 3 Hope home games as you know.  I will be helping at the Kalamazoo game this weekend, so if by chance you are there, perhaps we can visit at the half or after.

[Pat Coleman]

USee:
Pat is spot on (as usual,  ).  If Alma beats Olivet and Trine wins @ Adrian, then there will be a two way tie for the MIAA title between Trine and Albion.  Trine would then get the AQ by virtue of having beat Albion 55-51 earlier this year.  However, if Olivet and Trine both win, Albion gets the AQ.  If the latter scenario, the summary of the H-T-H competition between the 3 is:

Trine beat Albion 55-51      +4
Trine lost to Olivet 49-24  -25
                                          -21

Olivet lost to Albion 49-21         -28
Olivet beat Trine      49-24   +25
                                                -3 

Albion beat Olivet  49-21         +28
Albion lost to Trine  55-51         -4
                                                  +24     
                               
A wild year it has been in our MIAA, although it has often happened that the league title has come down to the very end over the years.  However, I think that many of us believe this has also been one of the strangest, at least in part, since a couple of weeks ago there was talk of the improbable chance there might be a 5 way tie.  Wierd (sp intended ).

Didn't check your math, but the MIAA doesn't use the comparative scores tiebreaker. Albion wins because of overall record. Trine would drop out of the three-way tie based on its overall record and then it reverts to the Albion-Olivet head-to-head result.

[formerd3db]

USee:
Pat is spot on (as usual,  ).  If Alma beats Olivet and Trine wins @ Adrian, then there will be a two way tie for the MIAA title between Trine and Albion.  Trine would then get the AQ by virtue of having beat Albion 55-51 earlier this year.  However, if Olivet and Trine both win, Albion gets the AQ.  If the latter scenario, the summary of the H-T-H competition between the 3 is:

Trine beat Albion 55-51      +4
Trine lost to Olivet 49-24  -25
                                          -21

Olivet lost to Albion 49-21         -28
Olivet beat Trine      49-24   +25
                                                -3 

Albion beat Olivet  49-21         +28
Albion lost to Trine  55-51         -4
                                                  +24     
                               
A wild year it has been in our MIAA, although it has often happened that the league title has come down to the very end over the years.  However, I think that many of us believe this has also been one of the strangest, at least in part, since a couple of weeks ago there was talk of the improbable chance there might be a 5 way tie.  Wierd (sp intended ).

Didn't check your math, but the MIAA doesn't use the comparative scores tiebreaker. Albion wins because of overall record. Trine would drop out of the three-way tie based on its overall record and then it reverts to the Albion-Olivet head-to-head result.

That's okay, Pat.  I am probably wrong and would have to check on this, but I thought the MIAA used the culmulative scores head-to-head some years ago.  Nonetheless, if that would have been the criteria at present as opposed to the overall record (or perhaps if all three teams tied with the same overall record), that score tally would have warrented Albion going anyway.

BTW, you already mentioned this in your article posting i.e. that Albion could fail to win the MIAA if those other scenarios play out, but potentially get an at-large bid even though they have a lower SOS compared to others. I'm interested to hear what is your own opinion as to Albion's real chances for getting an AL if that occurs?  Thanks.

[IoTriumphe]

Greetings! I'm a long time lurker, Albion alumnus, and large DIII supporter.

After seeing this forum slow down and become riddled with the Dutch, I figured I'd come in and start to diversify the posting.

It's been quite a year for the MIAA. I think Albion's lone blemish to Trine is showing some headway to growth as a league and the wins over Lakeland and Oshkosh I think are better than they look on paper. At least for morale. I know a lot of Britons were hoping to run the table and host the first round of the play offs, but from what I understand after the 2004-2005 basketball season, Albion will most likely not be hosting play off games again (at least not until their new athletic project is completed and even then I believe Albion could only host a postseason Track and Field meet). Hopefully Albion is rewarded by not having to play a powerhouse in the first round, but I'm not holding my breath.

I too have wondered why the MIAA doesn't gain a little more traction in the state. With the history and strong academics, especially from the GLCA schools, it really should have a small following. Is it the rise of the GLIAC over the last 10+ years? A growing NAIA league? Is it the superiority complex this state seems to have when it comes to the natural order of NCAA football teams? Would a Calvin team help build a fanbase in Grand Rapids which could help push the MIAA the same way GVSU has done to for the GLIAC?

I think 20 years ago everyone in the state new of the MIAA for academics and respected the athletic accomplishments, but the rise of "my kid earned a scholarship to a GLIAC school" when a parent doesn't understand nor care about an academic institution has led to some word of mouth issues. Dave Neilson did a great job as commissioner but I don't think he really understood how important athletics would be to admission numbers on MIAA schools and how important increasing awareness of the MIAA would be beneficial for all. I don't really know the answer - but I'd love to see a push.