FB: Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association

[ADAWGISADAWG4LIFE]

Have to say that Albion getting that road draw seems a bit off to me, only because Franklin at 8-2 with a less than impressive SOS is hosting a playoff game. I know MIAA not looked on kindly in eyes of d3football world as a strong conference but they have the win against Stevens Point and a 9-1 record with the 18th strongest SOS per NCAA, much better than Franklins 155.

MIAA for all its faults featured some strong SOS this year, I dont think it can really be pinned as an issue. MIAA had three teams in top 20 for SOS Albion at 18, Adrian at 10, Trine at 3, the only team outside the top 100 was Olivet. Conversely, the three best teams in HCAC were Franklin at 155 and Rose-Hulman at 195, and Mount St Joseph at 205. Id have though that might have played a bigger role in the equation, but Im not privy to all the ins and outs. Then again drawing ONU at home isnt exactly a gift either I suppose.


The Albion Wabash matchup should be interesting. Albion with the elite offense vs Wabash with an elite defense, itll be interesting to see which side wins out in the end.

[IoTriumphe]

Have to say that Albion getting that road draw seems a bit off to me,

It's my understanding that even if Albion suited up the '85 Bears they still would not ever be allowed to host a play off game until the press box is upgraded. As of now the NCAA does not deem Sprankle Sprandle worthy (cue Wayne and Garth).

[ADAWGISADAWG4LIFE]

I guess I can see that being an issue, its pretty well behind acceptable standards in this day and age. I didnt even factor the idea of facilities into the equation, but that would make some sense I suppose.

[sac]

Have to say that Albion getting that road draw seems a bit off to me,

It's my understanding that even if Albion suited up the '85 Bears they still would not ever be allowed to host a play off game until the press box is upgraded. As of now the NCAA does not deem Sprankle Sprandle worthy (cue Wayne and Garth).

20 years on, this seems to make me smile a bit   (vague I know, think basketball, Holland Civic Center etc etc)

[GRIZ_BACKER]

I guess I can see that being an issue, its pretty well behind acceptable standards in this day and age. I didnt even factor the idea of facilities into the equation, but that would make some sense I suppose.

It is my understanding that to HOST there is a application process and specific requirements.  In some cases, teams either dont apply (at the time you may have to apply, making the playoff wasnt realistic.  First time or infrequent playoff schools may not be fully aware.  I am not expert on the process or requirements but I do knmow there is a process to apply in advance.  Franklin applies each season as the they generally make the show every year.

[IoTriumphe]

Have to say that Albion getting that road draw seems a bit off to me,

It's my understanding that even if Albion suited up the '85 Bears they still would not ever be allowed to host a play off game until the press box is upgraded. As of now the NCAA does not deem Sprankle Sprandle worthy (cue Wayne and Garth).

20 years on, this seems to make me smile a bit   (vague I know, think basketball, Holland Civic Center etc etc)

I think the 2004 NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament kinda killed Albion's shot. From what I gather the administration and athletic administration understand the need. They're not about to pull an Adrian and cover it with loans, but the donor pool is a little tired and not exactly jumping at this opportunity. Albion's certainly playing catch up in regards to facilities and I think this also plays into the earlier conversation of strength of conference.

The funny part is the exact same stadium would be deemed essentially perfect in the eyes of the Track and Field committee.

[wally_wabash]

Have to say that Albion getting that road draw seems a bit off to me,

It's my understanding that even if Albion suited up the '85 Bears they still would not ever be allowed to host a play off game until the press box is upgraded. As of now the NCAA does not deem Sprankle Sprandle worthy (cue Wayne and Garth).

20 years on, this seems to make me smile a bit   (vague I know, think basketball, Holland Civic Center etc etc)

I think the 2004 NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament kinda killed Albion's shot. From what I gather the administration and athletic administration understand the need. They're not about to pull an Adrian and cover it with loans, but the donor pool is a little tired and not exactly jumping at this opportunity. Albion's certainly playing catch up in regards to facilities and I think this also plays into the earlier conversation of strength of conference.

The funny part is the exact same stadium would be deemed essentially perfect in the eyes of the Track and Field committee.

This is the second time that I've seen the basketball tournament mentioned here.  Help me understand what a decade-old basketball tournament impacts football site selection in the present? 

Also- I don't think Albion was really in play for a home game, whether they applied or not, whether they had adequate facilities or not.  When you're in that 5-ish spot in the regional rankings, you're kind of on the borderline when it comes to getting a home game or not and when they got drawn into a pod with Wabash, TMC, and W&L, Albion wasn't going to host any of those teams. 

[IoTriumphe]

This is the second time that I've seen the basketball tournament mentioned here.  Help me understand what a decade-old basketball tournament impacts football site selection in the present? 

Also- I don't think Albion was really in play for a home game, whether they applied or not, whether they had adequate facilities or not.  When you're in that 5-ish spot in the regional rankings, you're kind of on the borderline when it comes to getting a home game or not and when they got drawn into a pod with Wabash, TMC, and W&L, Albion wasn't going to host any of those teams.

At the end of the day, you're right, I doubt the 2004-05 tournament actually had an impact on this game. But it may have as it opened the NCAA's eyes to the facilities that Albion has.

Albion's facilities are historic. While quaint it really does hamper the College's ability to host post season events. Albion's basketball arena, Kresge Gymnasium (same Kresge as K-Mart), is older than Butler's Hinkle and at one time housed the pool, basketball and locker rooms for all sports. Football used to change at Kresge and walk the 400ish meters down the train tracks to the football stadium. It's great, it's wonderful, it needs an upgrade.

In 2004-05 Albion had a very good basketball team and won the right to host the second round game against College of Wooster and the sectionals. Kresge only holds 1000 people and the bleachers were over flowing onto the floor and with in arms length of the court. It was a great atmosphere, a lot of fun, but did not sit well with the NCAA. Especially due to Calvin being in the same sectional, just down the road and with a large fan base. Calvin ended up beating Albion in the Elite Eight and as the low seed and had a larger and better facility in Grand Rapids. The rumor is as soon as the NCAA arrived at Albion they told the then Athletic Director "If I knew what your facility looked like you never would have been allowed to host". I would love to see the box score and attendance numbers, but I doubt it exists.

Was Albion in play for a game. I don't know, but you're probably right. If Albion wouldn't have tripped up and lost to Trine I would think one could make an argument. But Albion was told that until the press box is fixed (the assistant coaches literally sit on top of the box, in the elements, at crappy tables and folding chairs) they're not hosting a post season game. Now, I'd argue that this is D-III and part of the experience - but apparently 2015 D-III is changing too.

[wally_wabash]

Got it.  Albion's tiny gym surely isn't affecting football's ability to host a game.  If the coach's box situation is rickety and unsafe, that might.  I was at the Wabash-Albion game at Sprankle-Sprandel in 1997 and I don't remember anything about the facility in general that would disqualify them from hosting.  19-year old me didn't take special note of the press box, so I'll take your word for it.  Otherwise, my recollection is that the venue is fine. 

[IoTriumphe]

Got it.  Albion's tiny gym surely isn't affecting football's ability to host a game.  If the coach's box situation is rickety and unsafe, that might.  I was at the Wabash-Albion game at Sprankle-Sprandel in 1997 and I don't remember anything about the facility in general that would disqualify them from hosting.  19-year old me didn't take special note of the press box, so I'll take your word for it.  Otherwise, my recollection is that the venue is fine.

Is a school required to have a locker room for away players? Most of the time the away teams meet in the end zones before the halftime orange slices are passed around.

[wally_wabash]

Got it.  Albion's tiny gym surely isn't affecting football's ability to host a game.  If the coach's box situation is rickety and unsafe, that might.  I was at the Wabash-Albion game at Sprankle-Sprandel in 1997 and I don't remember anything about the facility in general that would disqualify them from hosting.  19-year old me didn't take special note of the press box, so I'll take your word for it.  Otherwise, my recollection is that the venue is fine.

Is a school required to have a locker room for away players? Most of the time the away teams meet in the end zones before the halftime orange slices are passed around.

I'm going to guess that that's a dealbreaker.  Where do visiting teams dress? 

[sac]

There are two basketball references here, one IO addressed.  The other was 20 years ago Hope's home basketball court was deemed inadequate the year they were unbeaten forcing them to move to an even more 'inadequate' on campus facility.  Even though Hope had hosted tournament games on the same court and even hosted a women's Final Four only 3 years earlier.


It so happened Albion's coach, Mike Turner, was the head of the Great Lakes Regional committee that year.  He wrongly took some flak from those in Holland for the whole deal, it was the NCAA's decision.

Anyway, its just a little amusing to me.



For the record Albion's Kresge Gym holds 1,500 when full, though I've suspected that number is closer to 1,200.    The manual on hosting NCAA events is thick and filled with 100's of inane things that make you roll your eyes sometimes. 

[IoTriumphe]

There are two basketball references here, one IO addressed.  The other was 20 years ago Hope's home basketball court was deemed inadequate the year they were unbeaten forcing them to move to an even more 'inadequate' on campus facility.  Even though Hope had hosted tournament games on the same court and even hosted a women's Final Four only 3 years earlier.


It so happened Albion's coach, Mike Turner, was the head of the Great Lakes Regional committee that year.  He wrongly took some flak from those in Holland for the whole deal, it was the NCAA's decision.

Anyway, its just a little amusing to me.



For the record Albion's Kresge Gym holds 1,500 when full, though I've suspected that number is closer to 1,200.    The manual on hosting NCAA events is thick and filled with 100's of inane things that make you roll your eyes sometimes.

It wouldn't surprise me if the NCAA refused to allow Hope to host a Men's Tournament game during the same season the Women's Final Four is in Holland. It's that funky some time. I think Turner is a fairly middle of the road guy, he had his issues (and does) but he wouldn't screw over Hope. A few other Albion coaches on the other hand...

I think 1,300 is being generous for Kresge. I think 1,100 is comfortable before it become standing room only. Although, I have't seen more than a couple hundred in Kresge in the past 10 years.

[Mr. Ypsi]

There are two basketball references here, one IO addressed.  The other was 20 years ago Hope's home basketball court was deemed inadequate the year they were unbeaten forcing them to move to an even more 'inadequate' on campus facility.  Even though Hope had hosted tournament games on the same court and even hosted a women's Final Four only 3 years earlier.


It so happened Albion's coach, Mike Turner, was the head of the Great Lakes Regional committee that year.  He wrongly took some flak from those in Holland for the whole deal, it was the NCAA's decision.

Anyway, its just a little amusing to me.



For the record Albion's Kresge Gym holds 1,500 when full, though I've suspected that number is closer to 1,200.    The manual on hosting NCAA events is thick and filled with 100's of inane things that make you roll your eyes sometimes.

Does the manual specify condiments?  (Or is that joke only known on the bball board?)

[formerd3db]

Gentlemen:

A great discussion and very relevant.  I agree with Wally regarding the most probable reason why Albion not hosting.  However, I also believe that had that even been a possible consideration, most likely, it would not have happened due to, yes, the press box.  Some of you may recall that was the main reason why Carthage (WI) was not allowed to host a playoff game just a few years ago, until their press box was enlarged/renovated. 

I love Sprankle-Sprandle Stadium-the historic/traditional college atmosphere is awesome, including the old concrete walls.  That field has been used since 1900, and the old football field in the decade before that is where the home stands and building is now. I truly believe that if Albion renovates their press box (and the really need to-I know from my own visiting coaching experience there as DAWG pointed out ), there would be no "points against them" for eventually hosting a playoff game in some future year.  The facilities as they are now, with that renovation, would be more than adequate.

With regard to the basketball facility, I, too, like the historic aspect of Kresge.  I hope that it would be possible that Albion would renovate that and continue to use it for basketball.  I can see where they (the administration) might potentially desire to build an entire new facility (either on that site or perhaps over where the athletic complex is already) in "keeping up with the Jones'" in the MIAA i.e. all the other MIAA schools new bb facilities.  However, realistically, as some of you point out (and I do not intend this in a disrespectful way whatsoever-even though Albion is my/our heated rivalry,  )), Albion is never going to draw the attendance figures for basketball like Hope or Calvin does, so they really do not need a huge seating facility.  And let's be honest (even thought the NCAA is, perhaps, a bit shady on that side at times I think we all agree-I could share with you some behind-the-scenes stories that I know of in the past, but will pass on that for legit reasons)-a great number of the early host team facilities for the bb tournaments do not have huge seating capacities i.e. are very much like Albion and you do not draw huge crowds for those early games-period.

So, IMO, I think that a very nicely renovated Kresge at Albion would be a great and more than adequate facility.  Thanks to all of you for a really great and fun discussion.