MBB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[cobbernation]

CAR bounced back with a victory tonight...report i got was they struggled with the 3 ball in the first half but looked much more lively than they did on saturday

CAR did indeed beat the Cobbers tonight. 67-52. Zach Johnson pours in 24 and Tommy Drake adds 10. Jake Philips scores 5 points on 1-5 shooting?? Whats the deal with that stat. Jay Melson added 14 for the Knights as well.  The Cobbs were led by Linz and Erik Johnson each with 14 points and 8 and 9 rebounds respectively. The Knights were 10-27 from beyond the arc...while Concordia shot 48% from the field!

Watchmen,
Didn't get to see the cobber men tonight or the stats.  But how can they shoot almost 50% from the floor and score only 52 pts.  That's unbelievable! 

Cobbers need to get it together and quickly if they want a shot at a playoff run!

C Nation, don't mean to rain on your parade, but the Cobbs have zero chance of making the playoffs! They have 3 conference losses now. they have 2 games with UST, 2 with GAC and one each SJU and CAR. That is 9 losses right there. That also means they would have to run the table against the rest of the league! Not going to happen.

When it rains, it pours!  Indeed the cobbers have little/no chance to make the playoffs this year and they do have a tough schedule after the break. 

VOJ pretty much hit it on the head with not much support to Linz amazing athleticism.  Too many turnovers, no other scoring threats, and not good defense.  Especially with Citterman out!  Rumor has it that he isn't hurt, sounds like an academic situation and that's why he didn't play last night.  If he can't play for the rest of year, I see the cobbs winning no more than 4/5 games (if that many).

We will hope for the best here in Cobberland!

[abominable_snowman]

What are the chances both the Johnnies and Tommies are undefeated come 1/17/07? 

Big Test for UST on the 21st against UW-LaCrosse.  It will be at UST which helps.  This is the only serious threat I see.

They could face either St. Scholastica or North Central in the River Falls Tourney.  UST should handle either of the teams, unless I'm overlooking something.

[piperinsider]

Snow-

He was talking MIAC games only undefeated. SJU lost to St. Cloud State University already.

I would say the Johnnies will lose to someone before that. Whoever said HAM matches up with them. It's not so much matches up, but when each plays, whoever is hitting their shots wins. HAM has made their shots the past few times.

At 1-3 in the conference (having already played BET and UST), the Pipers really need to go 4-2 at least to have a legit shots at the playoffs. 5-1 would be nice, but then they would have to beat two of three against CAR, GAC and SJU.

[concordia of the north]

It absolutely blows my mind the way concordia is squandering the opportunity of having a luke linz on the roster.  true they are not crystalline basketball players, but they have many very capable athletes.  that can be enough in some situations.  they are no longer relying on the princeton offense because of this.  so, to those people blaming the turnover problems on the complexity of that offense, that is not the case.

they had the ingredients to have a very interesting year.  a couple of solid skill players in citterman and linz (and johnson? who is this kid?) and a number of physical, fast, aggressive, and stong role players.  R. Johnson, Boike, Schulz, E.J. Adams, etc. should be the make up of a nice defensive unit.

damn these turnovers.

[sumander]

What are the chances both the Johnnies and Tommies are undefeated come 1/17/07?  Johnnies only have a couple of road blocks to that happening...road trips to MAC, AUG and HAM...J's don't seem to match up well with Ham for some reason...

think the next 3 games for the J's will tell us quite a bit about them. They go on the road tomorrow to Morris. A team they beat earlier in the year and the Gusties just pounded. Should be SJU in a rout.

The 2 games in Daytona are against preseason #11 Ursinus and PSU-Behrend a team that has made post season play 9 out of the last 10 years. Are the J's mentally tough enough to take care of business in these games?

In my opinion. If the J's win the two games in Florida after Christmas they will go into the UST game undefeated in the conference. If they show a loss of focus over Christmas the same will happen somewhere along the way in the MIAC as well.

[miacwatchmen]

The Cobbers will not make the playoffs this year...they are too young and don't have enough talent surrounding Linz...sorry but those are the facts

As for Gustavus...good team, but they have some defensive problems against those that can spread the floor and have multiple scorers...see the Johnnies game for example...I thnk a second place finish would be over-achieving and a playoff championship would be hard to do seeing as how they would have to be on road for two games...

What are the chances both the Johnnies and Tommies are undefeated come 1/17/07?  Johnnies only have a couple of road blocks to that happening...road trips to MAC, AUG and HAM...J's don't seem to match up well with Ham for some reason...

I think the Johnnies have a chip on their shoulder from last years playoffs as far as Hamline goes. HAM came into Collegeville and played a great game in the second half! The Johnnies will have trouble with Bethel I think.  They seemed to have trouble their first game back from the Christmas trip last year.  (MIACmaniac and LBow know what I'm talking about)     

With that being said I think it is realistic that the Johnnies coul dbe undefeated when Jan/ 17 comes around. The Johnnies would need to win 5 games to set up the undefeated tilt with UST.

[columbianmaffia]

What are the chances both the Johnnies and Tommies are undefeated come 1/17/07? 

Big Test for UST on the 21st against UW-LaCrosse.  It will be at UST which helps.  This is the only serious threat I see.

i think CAR plays UW-LX tomarrow night down at CAR...that should be interesting to see what happens in that game

[Drake Palmer]

What are the chances both the Johnnies and Tommies are undefeated come 1/17/07? 

Big Test for UST on the 21st against UW-LaCrosse.  It will be at UST which helps.  This is the only serious threat I see. ...

Playing 21st ranked UW-LAX will be a huge test for not only UST, but Carleton as well.  The Knights play them this Wednesday.  Many of the WIAC experts are picking LAX's 6-7 250lb center Joe Werner to earn POY this season.  All scouting reports I've heard is that he is an athletic, physical player as is the rest of the Lax team.  This will be a good benchmark to see where the Tommies & Knights are at this point in the season.

Enlighten us –Concordia of the North.  So why are the Cobbs turning the ball over so much?    In the few minutes I saw them play last night, two TOs were on bounce passes on would be backdoor cuts to a wing (Looked like a Princeton offense to me) & another TO was on a fast break when the numbers weren't there.

SUM- I'm not familiar with Ursinius.  Are they an NAIA or D3 school?

[abominable_snowman]

Snow-

He was talking MIAC games only undefeated.

My bad...

Then I'm in line with the genral consensus.  It's possible.  Respecting/not overlooking Augsburg is key for SJU to remain undefeated.  Then Hamline could be a thorn in their side, I think that comes down to what sort of momentum Hamline is having. I would love to see two undefeated teams in the MIAC on the 17th.

[Drake Palmer]

FYI - For those of you who try to follow D3 hoops on a national level, David Collinge, a D3hoops.com "Hall of Fame" poster does a nice weekly post/column on the Top 25 teams.   You can find his column in the Basketball Multi-regional Topics category, Top 25  message board.

quote author=David Collinge link=topic=4097.msg636162#msg636162 date=1165943730]
Top 25 News and Notes, Vol. VIII, Issue 112

It looks like the settling process may have begun.  After three weeks of near-record level participation in the top 25 voting, the poll returned to a semblance of normality this week.  About 17% of the teams that received votes last week fell off the table this week.  Four new squads were added to the voting, but they nabbed only a collective 18 votes, about two-tenths of one percent of the available votes.  At the other end of the scale, nine of last week's top ten teams remained in that august group, despite two of them losing games this week.  Seven of those nine teams saw their voting support increased, further consolidating the top of the poll, and helping to establish a mini-break between the #8 (Whitworth, 420) and #9 (Lawrence, 355) positions.

Wooster maintained their hold on the #1 spot in the poll, nabbing one first-place vote from #2 Amherst.  Wooster defeated #6 Wittenberg at Springfield, marking the first time in that rivalry-within-a-rivalry that the team ranked #1 going into the game won the game.  Oddly, each time the #1 team has been involved in that game, the visiting team has come out on top.  Despite the loss, the Tigers maintaind their position as the #6 team in the poll, due in part to the drop of #7 Ohio Northern, 17-point losers at home to unranked Baldwin-Wallace.  Wittenberg and Ohio Northern square off in Ada next Tuesday (12/19.)

Debutantes:
Congratulations to the Guilford College Quakers, who for the first time ever received votes in this week's poll. 

Streakers:
The record streaks are all still intact:

• #1 Wooster, with 112 straight poll appearances and 42 straight weeks in the top 10, and
• #2 Amherst , with 67 consecutive top 25 placements.
• #21 UW-La Crosse attracted voter interest for the 10th straight week.
• Illinois Wesleyan saw their consecutive voting streak snapped at 39 straight weeks.
  

High-Water Marks:
#4 St. Thomas achieved its highest-ever rank this week, as did #15 Averett, #16 Bates, #19 Aurora, and #21 UW-La Crosse.  #8 Whitworth tied their highest-ever mark for the third straight week.  La Crosse re-enters the top 25 for just the second time ever, having been absent since early 2002.  Congratulations to all these teams!

Milestones:

• #4 St. Thomas and #10 Augustana are each in the top 10 for the tenth time;
• This week marks #6 Wittenberg's seventy-fifth appearance in the top 25;
• Calvin received votes for the 80th time.
• #24 DePauw and Occidental are vote-getters for the 40th time each, and North Central attracted the voters' attention for the 20th time.

It bears occasional mention that all of the records in this category are held by #1 Wooster, who has been in the top 10 eighty-two times, in the top twenty-five 104 times, and in the list of vote-getters a perect 112 times.

Congratulations to all of these outstanding programs! 
[/quote]

[concordia of the north]

I would guess that the answer is simple.  i would think that the turnover problem is woven into the fabric of their gameplay.

concordia has a lot of players who feel themselves to be "creators."  i would bet that leads to poor off the ball movement.  people are probably standing and watching.  think of the teams you've played on or seen that have had a decent (albeit flashy) playmaker.  Many nights you can expect a somewhat significant amount of turnovers from this person.  it's part of the deal.  someone who is whirling into the lane, jumping before a pass is evident, trying to dance with a defender, etc. is going to occassionally lose the ball.  now imagine you have 4 of those players.  now imagine you have 4 of those players and essentially three posts.

there is your recipe for the dreadful 21+ turnovers per game i can imagine concordia has right now.

[cobbernation]

I would guess that the answer is simple.  i would think that the turnover problem is woven into the fabric of their gameplay.

concordia has a lot of players who feel themselves to be "creators."  i would bet that leads to poor off the ball movement.  people are probably standing and watching.  think of the teams you've played on or seen that have had a decent (albeit flashy) playmaker.  Many nights you can expect a somewhat significant amount of turnovers from this person.  it's part of the deal.  someone who is whirling into the lane, jumping before a pass is evident, trying to dance with a defender, etc. is going to occassionally lose the ball.  now imagine you have 4 of those players.  now imagine you have 4 of those players and essentially three posts.

there is your recipe for the dreadful 21+ turnovers per game i can imagine concordia has right now.

I wouldn't say as much as the cobbs being "creators" because of lately it looks like the guard play has taken a turn to "individualism."  Some of the players try to fake a player out like dancing or trying to impress the fans with between the leg dribbles and behind the back passes.  That kind of play belongs on the AND1 mixtape tour, not in the MIAC.  If you want to win in the MIAC, you have to take care of the ball at all times and play defense!

Here are some stats from last night's game against Carelton:
Cobbs                                Knights                                   
22 TO                                  5  TO
8  assists                            14 assists
2  steals                             11 steals
36 reb.                                22 reb.

[concordia of the north]

exactly. that's what i was trying to gently imply.

any college basketball court requires focus and direct play.  you can't fancy yourself around the court trying to break ankles and make circus shots. throw a fake, find a hole and go hard.  too much lace right now and not enough lead it seems.

have you seen them play cobbernation?  i'm excited to get my first look when they come to the twin cities.

i bet coaches siverson and whartnaby are pulling their hair out.

[concordia of the north]

Turnover Margin
11.Concordia College...  7   162  23.1   93  13.3  -9.86


Assist/TO Ratio
11.Concordia College...  7    96  13.7  162  23.1   0.59

It seems to me that rectifying these two problems puts the cobbers at .500 at least.  it would be difficult for a team of st. thomas' talent to surmount a -10 turnover margin.  -10!!

Off of the concordia beat, i am very surprised by SJU's perfomance.  I didn't think they'd be such a true contender this year.  i think the schaeffers are their keys.  it doesn't seem to be this leiser character.

[sumander]

Drake the stroy on Ursinus' preseason ranking is here ! It looks like it might have been a Mid Atlantic regional ranking. The men's BB webpage has more information about them.