MBB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[d3bballfollower]

continuing on down the line for the best 3/ small forwards in the league...

Tyler Westman
Trevor Wittwer
Charles Meadowcroft
Tony Thrasher
Zach Johnson

my rankings...

1. Meadowcroft
2. Thrasher
3. Johnson
4. Westman
5. Wittwer

[sumander]

best 2 guard in the league has to be broken down into a couple different catergories i think

best shooter- schnettler...followed by liddell and then citterman and lieser

best scorer- derock (25.3)...followed by lieser (22.5) then madson(17.8) and schnettler (18.3)

best overall- derock...followed by lieser then madson and citterman

D3
Repsectfully disagree with your shooting order Lieser based on 2 games is definetely a better shooter than Citterman!

[UST_LBOW]

Schnettler is the best 2 guard in the league, scoring, shooting and overall

You won't find a kid that works harder and is more obsessed with hoops than that kid.  Stats don't tell everything.  If Bryan didn't have the Ike and Mike on his team his stats would be bigger.  Bryan has worked hard to add an all-around game and not simply be a shooter.

DeRock is good, but not as good as Bryan.




I think Meadowcraft would be considered a 4 wouldn't he?

[d3bballfollower]

sumander- i can see where you are coming from about lieser, i haven't really seen him play and i've seen citterman multiple times so i guess i was a little biased

LBOW- you are right that if schnettler didn't have ike and mike on the team that his stats would be higher...unfortunately we'll never know about that...i haven't had a chance to see UST play this year so I haven't seen Schnettler play, I just remember watching him the last couple years and seeing how he shot mostly off screens and off passes...the reason I ranked derock lieser and madson ahead of schnettler is because i consider a scorer to be someone who can score in all ways (shooting, driving, mid range, etc)...and as far as best overall i agree with your arguement that schnettler is probably overall better than citterman and madson...but i would still take derock and lieser over schnettler...although i'm definitely willing to change my opinion once i see brian play after christmas...and as far as meadowcroft i would consider him a 3 because he is 6'5" and over half of his shots (27/ 50) this year have been from 3 point range, and he is also good and driving the ball to the hoop...most 4's aren't like that...I would consider Moberg, Conboy and Linz 4's...but again that is up to debate and personal opinion

[Drake Palmer]

I detect an ever so slight Bethel bias here D3BO. 

I'll save the 3/small forward debate for another post, but regarding the best shooter I think you got it.  However, I'd follow Schnettler with Lieser, Liddell & then Citterman. Citterman's far too streaky of a shooter.  Check his stats out from last year.  And from what I've heard, Citterman didn't put in a lot of extra work on his shot this off-season.

Best scorer - Right again with the exception of Madson. He certainly has the talent & potential, but he's basically an unproven performer waiting to earn his cred this year.  Schnettler on the other hand has proven himself, & has gotten better on both sides of the ball each and every year.  And, he will take take you to the rack.  He's not as nasty as DeRock, but if you take away the J, he will drive on you, or drive & dish.

Best overall I think you might be right - but there's no way any coach would say that Schnettler is not on this list.  If he's not 1A he's #1, with Lieser 3rd.   IMO, DeRock might have more natural ability but you will not find anyone who will out work Schnettler - during games, practice & the off season.  Granted, if he keeps working, by the time DeRock's career is finished, I think he could end up in the rarified stratosphere of Mr. Mark Buri.  Cat was bad!!

And, while I'm speaking my mind,  until Bethel & Madson start playing better defense, Madson's name doesn't belong here nor does Citterman's.  Lets' revisit this at the end of the season. 

[d3bballfollower]

drake- if you're right about the work ethics of guys like schnettler and citterman than i would definitely have to agree with you about taking schnettler ahead of citterman...as far as the bethle bias goes you are correct, i grew up 5 minutes from the school and will have bethel and mac at the top of my list forever...as far as citterman goes i have not seen him play this year, nor have i seen anyone really play this year so i am going off things i have seen in the past...and i agree with the comment about the defense...if BU doesn't play D they won't beat the better teams and won't go very far and it won't matter if madson scores 25 a game...i just hope these guys all play well and represent minnesota basketball as best as possible

[d3bballfollower]

top 4's in the league-

1. Keating- scores, rebounds, dishes...at 6'6" being able to go inside and out is tough match up for other 4's in the league...and makes everyone around him better
2. Conboy- double double guy on a mediocre team
3. Linz- 20ppg isn't bad, especially coming off of injury
4. Moberg- will probably make a move upward, no doubting his talent, just have to see how his first year in the league goes

[abominable_snowman]

to weigh in on schnettler's behalf....

yes like all players, he's affected when he's not hitting, but that won't keep him from releasing.

and on top of that he thrives in challenges, I've seen him shoot right through hands in the face more times than I can count. And when the game is on the line, I'd put the bball in his hands any day of the week. He's ideal for game winners.  

I'm sure the above statements could be argued for the other players, but I will argue that Bryan is the number one man you want shooting the rock to get the W.

[d3bballfollower]

snowman- great point about dependability...even though i argue that derock is the best 2 in the league...i would have to agree with you that when it comes to consistency and dependibility Schnettler would be the 1 guy in the league that you could consistenly count on...i didnd't even think about that when making my rankings earlier...if you factor that in i would change my ranking and put schnettler right up there with derock because guys like lieser, madson and citterman don't have that dependability...great point again

that brings up another great question...after schnettler, who in the miac would be the one to trust to take a game winning shot after schnettler? i would say liddell or lieser

[TommieHoops4Life]

PI,

I've been out of commission the last few days with an extremely nasty cold, and my winter sports preview is due on Monday, so that would explain my absence from the board.

Schnettler is the best 2-guard in the league, and it's not even worth a debate. He's deadly from three-range, but he's not a pure shooter. He can drive, pass shoot and create looks for everyone else. He'll even try to crash the boards every once in a while. Like AS said, if I could choose one guy to take a shot with the game on the line, it'd be Schnettler.

Have not seen the Knights or Oles yet, but I might check out the Carleton/St. John's game Monday night. Should have a little more perspective after that.

[d3bballfollower]

who does everyone think is the most underrated player in the MIAC?

[d3bballfollower]

tommiehoops- you say Schnettler isn't a pure shooter...are you referring to pure as only being able to shoot, because i usually associate the term pure shooter with someone who has a great stroke and is a consistenly great shooter, which if that is the case there is probably no arguement that schnettler is one of the best pure shooters in the region and probably the country

[Nites]

Best 2 guard:  Schnettler hands down.  I'll let him take the shot at the end of the game.  DeRock is very good with loads of potential to be even better.  He had a great freshman year, but that was one year and he had his good moments as well as his bad.  There were times when he was very erratic.  Three nonconference games do not a season make so I say let's see what he can do once the conference season gets hot and heavy.

As to who after Schnettler I would want to take the shot, I respectfully disagree with the choice of Leiser or Liddell because I'm pounding the ball inside for the high percentage shot or the foul.  Since Ike is the reigning MVP, that's where I'm going.

If I have to put the ball in someone's hands for an outside shot (other than Schnettler), I would be comfortable giving it to Phillips as he is an excellent 3-point shooter.

[TommieHoops4Life]

D3BB,

By pure shooter I was referring to the three-ball as it being his only threat. He obviously has a great stroke, and is consistent. I was only saying the three ball isn't his only threat, although it is his biggest.

[piperinsider]

who does everyone think is the most underrated player in the MIAC?

Kyle Foster.

Schnettler is in my mind, the second best player in the MIAC behind teammate Ike, so I'd put him atop the 2's in this league.