MBB: Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference

[Pat Coleman]

Not to be picky, but you're only in the Top 25 poll when you're in the top 25. There is no ranking below 25, just others receiving votes.

[AndOne]

Not to be picky, but you're only in the Top 25 poll when you're in the top 25. There is no ranking below 25, just others receiving votes.

Perhaps the poster picked up the idea of referring to a team ranked below #25 after reading several D3Hoops posts identifying teams included in the 'others receiving votes'
by their "ranking" relative to how many votes they got in the poll. Its a fairly frequent occurrence.

School web sites also frequently refer to their teams "ranking" in this manner. For one, Carthage of the CCIW often mentions the "35th ranked Redmen" according to how many votes the team received in the latest poll.

[dc_has_been]

Regardless, it is nice to see DC getting some votes while Anderson climbed to 18th.  Hopefully DC can continue their streak till January 27th (my daughter's first bday!!! ), when DC and AC meet again.  I would like to see AC continue to climb the pulls, but DC needs them to drop at least one and beat them on the 27th to hopefully even things up in the HCAC standings.  DC of course would still need to win out all of their games.

Pat, you can be picky all you want.  None of this would be possible if you didn't get the ball rolling.  Plus it would be boring if people didn't speak up and counter other people's posts.

[Buzz]

Pat -  I definitely wasn't trying to speak out of line and I do understand a significant difference between just getting votes and actually being in the top 25. However, it is certainly noteworthy for a team to get votes and something that should be mentioned, as it is good for this poll, the institution and the conference. I will be more careful in the future to avoid any misleading comments.

[Pat Coleman]

School web sites also frequently refer to their teams "ranking" in this manner. For one, Carthage of the CCIW often mentions the "35th ranked Redmen" according to how many votes the team received in the latest poll.

That doesn't mean it's right.

DC -- no worries, just figured I need to set the record straight once in a while. Definitely want people to mention they are receiving votes.

[Mr. Ypsi]

FWIW, personally, my 'compromise' solution is to put any 'ranking' below 25th in brackets - clearly separating it from 'top 25', yet still allowing that [#26] is much 'better' than [#38].

[dc_has_been]

Wow, well done by all!  I've noticed that things go much smoother with less arguing on the bball boards vs. the fball boards.   

[Jackets Backer]

Important game tonight at the Beck Center. The league schedule is a bit heavy at the beginning for the Jackets ... at Anderson, at Hanover, at Transy, at MSJ. All four are really good this year. The good news for DC is they're getting some rather rough road trips out of the way early, let's hope they don't dig too deep a hole to climb out of. Another concern is all the traveling with them just coming back from a 10-hour bus ride from Virginia, now back on the road to Lexington and back on 75 on Saturday at the Mount. Couple Ws this week and then I think we can start talking about a spot in the Top 25 being 13-2.

Transy has been tough to figure out this year. Head scratcher losing to Rose and then they turn around and beat Wash. U        DC has fared very poorly down there over the years and my only memory of DC coming back home with a W from Lexington was two years ago when the Jackets blitzed TU by like 30 and I think some crazy things happened that day. I'd say flip a coin for tonight's game. The Weaner Center would be a zoo if both DC and AU are ranked for their game later this month.

[cave2bens]

Best of luck to the Jackets this evening in bluegrass country - post game "Hot Browns all 'round" though some Hall's fried banana peppers might ward of chill more effectively.    Sledding down 75 again, Saturday?  Give the Delphi oracle and the Lions something to remember, guys!  Snow showers for ATL tomorrow 

[Jackets Backer]

Best of luck to the Jackets this evening in bluegrass country - post game "Hot Browns all 'round" though some Hall's fried banana peppers might ward of chill more effectively.    Sledding down 75 again, Saturday?  Give the Delphi oracle and the Lions something to remember, guys!  Snow showers for ATL tomorrow 

Robert, what's been going on man? Enjoy the fluffy stuff in Hot-Lanta.

[Jackets Backer]

More disappointment on the road for DC      I know they've played at three really tough venues, but the great ones find a way and for whatever reason, they're not getting it done. Not being able to hold a 12-point lead is also frustrating. Two turnovers, during a span of 15 seconds, in the final minute were killers with DC leading. Tonight was a great chance to steal one on the road with a 12-point second half lead. Being 2-3 in the league is not exactly a great start with another one coming up at the Mount on Saturday. Certainly are going to have to win out to have any chance of winning the regular season crown. That's a tall task with the parity in the league this season.

Transy continues to impress year after year. I thought they'd maybe be down this year losing the HCAC player of the year, but beating the No. 1 team in the nation and a 4-1 start in the league pretty much puts the kibosh on my preseason thought. Brian Lane's program has been the class of the HCAC and maybe it'll stay that way this year.

[cave2bens]

More disappointment on the road for DC      I know they've played at three really tough venues, but the great ones find a way and for whatever reason, they're not getting it done. Not being able to hold a 12-point lead is also frustrating. Two turnovers, during a span of 15 seconds, in the final minute were killers with DC leading. 

Concentration on paper training and fetch with the new canine may be less frustrating, JB.    On the other hand, maybe threat of a rolled up newspaper and milkbone rewards might be an optional, motivational tool for closing out the games? 

"You know, in the old days, when a young man was a strong man;
All the people- - They stepped back, when a young man walked by." 
                                                                  - Mose Allison

[dc_has_been]

Man!  8 free throws, 18 turnovers and terrible shooting.  It always hard to determine what really went wrong when you are not at the game, but to have a 12 point lead and to put up stats like DC and lose. I know Transy shot poorly too, but they have 20 free throws, 14 of them in the second.  I looks to me one team was more aggressive than the other and that was the difference.  Again I didn't see the game but 3 free throws (DC) to 14 (TC) in the second tells me one coach told his team to take the ball to the hole while the other said keep shooting and hopefully well start making them IMO.  I also do know that DC had more points in the paint.

[John Gleich]

FWIW, personally, my 'compromise' solution is to put any 'ranking' below 25th in brackets - clearly separating it from 'top 25', yet still allowing that [#26] is much 'better' than [#38].

That's not necessarily the case, though.  #26 is going to have rec'd lots of votes from many voters, so that isn't the best example... and probably, the 26th team rec'ing votes is better but let's say [#38] and [#40].  Does this mean that #38 is better than #40?  I'm not sure that's 100% accurate.

In this most recent poll, Defiance is [#38] with 7 poll points and William Patterson is [#40] with 5.  Likely, these teams were slotted at the very botton (#24 or #25) of voters' ballots.  But just because 7 said Defiance was #25 and only 5 said Willy Pat was #25 doesn't mean that one is better than the other.  There's a possibility that the other 18 voters have Defiance at, say, 35th or 40th, and the other 20 voters have Willy Pat at 26th.

That's the problem with ascribing place value to teams that have just rec'd votes... we don't have the full cadre of voters' opinion on each of these teams.

Now, to be sure, each of the top vote-getting teams do not receive votes from each voter... (that's how we even have "ORV" teams).  But short of having each voter rank teams until the 25 top vote-getting teams all received votes from each voter, this is the simplest way to go.

[Buzz]

Yes the FT disparity is glaring on the box score but several of those FT's came in the final minute when DC kept turning the ball over and having to foul to prevent a layup and/or to stop the clock. I will say that there were definitely moments during the game that DC's offense was very 'stand still' and there just wasn't much movement. Transy really did a nice job breaking the press and controlling the tempo by limiting DC's transition offense. The Jackets have plenty of weapons to play a half court game and succeed, it just didn't work last night with all the turnovers in crucial spots. DC also had some very poor shot selection. Not going to name names there but hopefully that can be addressed.

On a side note - TU's Brandon Rash didn't get to play much due to fouls, but he looks like he could be a very special talent in the HCAC. Maybe it was just a good game for him? But just based on 15-20 minutes, he looks like a keeper.