FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[02 Warhawk]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Yea, there are fluke and soft goals given up. But as far as bounces and redirects, those are actually very much part of the game. Players in front of the net spend a lot time redirecting shots in practice. It may seem like a lucky bounce, but its actually a planned play/strategy. Many defenseman purposely shoot the puck at there own players, so they can redirect it on goal. It's amazing hand-eye coordination, especially when puck is traveling 90+ MPH.

[emma17]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Yea, there are fluke and soft goals given up. But as far as bounces and redirects, those are actually very much part of the game. Players in front of the net spend a lot time redirecting shots in practice. It may seem like a lucky bounce, but its actually a planned play/strategy. Many defenseman purposely shoot the puck at there own players, so they can redirect it on goal. It's amazing hand-eye coordination, especially when puck is traveling 90+ MPH.

Good point on intentional mid-directs- that is an eye-hand coordination skill.
Even then, the guy doing the misdirecting has his back to the goal. Sure, he can assume the way the goalie is leaning, but ultimately he is blindly directing that puck and hoping there is a hole.

[badgerwarhawk]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Yea, there are fluke and soft goals given up. But as far as bounces and redirects, those are actually very much part of the game. Players in front of the net spend a lot time redirecting shots in practice. It may seem like a lucky bounce, but its actually a planned play/strategy. Many defenseman purposely shoot the puck at there own players, so they can redirect it on goal. It's amazing hand-eye coordination, especially when puck is traveling 90+ MPH.

I'm not that much into hockey but Mrs BW and I took in a recent BADGERS game and enjoyed ourselves.  It's fast and physical so it's fun to watch and I can appreciate the athleticism of the players.  They crushed an undermanned and slow Alabama-Huntington team 5-0.  I didn't even know they played hockey in Alabama. 

[oshfb]

Gannett published salary information for all Wisconsin state employees last weekend.  This includes all coaches and professors at WIAC schools, and I've compiled the football coaches below. 

Lance Leipold - UWW - $100,251
Mike Emendorfer - UWP - $76,187
Matt Walker - UWRF - $71,075
Todd Glaser - UWEC - $62,872
Joel Dettwiler - UWL - $62,302
Pat Cerroni - UWO - $59,373
Clayt Birmingham - UWS - $58,850

Info for UWSP Head Coach Tom Journell was not reported.

On another note, They were touting Nick Saban on ESPN as joining the ranks of those "Elite" Head Coaches with 4 National Championships. I guess they never heard of Larry Kehres. (Or John Gagliardi, or coming on strong Lance Leipold)

I gaurantee that's exactly it. I bet very few ESPN anchors/reporters know who Kehres, Gagliardi or Leipold are.

Except maybe Pam Ward

1. Obviously the salaries aren't aligned with school success (see Matt Walker at UWRF for example).
2. Obviously money isn't the reason these guys are college coaches. The bottom 4 could make more money teaching/coaching in High School.
3. Doesn't matter if ESPN anchors know who Kehres (or others) are. 99% of the fan base could care less about D3 athletics.

[02 Warhawk]

Gannett published salary information for all Wisconsin state employees last weekend.  This includes all coaches and professors at WIAC schools, and I've compiled the football coaches below. 

Lance Leipold - UWW - $100,251
Mike Emendorfer - UWP - $76,187
Matt Walker - UWRF - $71,075
Todd Glaser - UWEC - $62,872
Joel Dettwiler - UWL - $62,302
Pat Cerroni - UWO - $59,373
Clayt Birmingham - UWS - $58,850

Info for UWSP Head Coach Tom Journell was not reported.

On another note, They were touting Nick Saban on ESPN as joining the ranks of those "Elite" Head Coaches with 4 National Championships. I guess they never heard of Larry Kehres. (Or John Gagliardi, or coming on strong Lance Leipold)

I gaurantee that's exactly it. I bet very few ESPN anchors/reporters know who Kehres, Gagliardi or Leipold are.

Except maybe Pam Ward

1. Obviously the salaries aren't aligned with school success (see Matt Walker at UWRF for example).
2. Obviously money isn't the reason these guys are college coaches. The bottom 4 could make more money teaching/coaching in High School.
3. Doesn't matter if ESPN anchors know who Kehres (or others) are. 99% of the fan base could care less about D3 athletics.

Bingo!

[thrunt01]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Yea, there are fluke and soft goals given up. But as far as bounces and redirects, those are actually very much part of the game. Players in front of the net spend a lot time redirecting shots in practice. It may seem like a lucky bounce, but its actually a planned play/strategy. Many defenseman purposely shoot the puck at there own players, so they can redirect it on goal. It's amazing hand-eye coordination, especially when puck is traveling 90+ MPH.

I'm not that much into hockey but Mrs BW and I took in a recent BADGERS game and enjoyed ourselves.  It's fast and physical so it's fun to watch and I can appreciate the athleticism of the players.  They crushed an undermanned and slow Alabama-Huntington team 5-0.  I didn't even know they played hockey in Alabama.

WOOO! Badger Hockey! I had student season tickets last year and despite the teams struggles every game is just a blast. No sport has a bigger difference between in person and television viewing.

[02 Warhawk]

I know I've talked about this a few times before, but if you're looking for some "light" reading in the off season. I would recommend taking a look at Ronald Smith's dissertation on the History of the WSUC (now the WIAC). There's a ton of very interesting anecdotes on how athletics came to be in the WIAC, and the troubles they faced.

I was able to post the links to the five chapters on the right side of my blog (after you scroll down a little bit), just incase anyone is interesting in reading it.

From Normal School to State University: A History of the Wisconsin State University Conference

Enjoy!

[footballfan413]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Really?  That is the part of the sport that bothers you most?  For me, it is the, "I went to a fight and a hockey game broke out" factor.  I enjoy Olympic and college hockey very much where they do way more skating than throwing punches but the NHL is too much of a thugfest for me. 
    Hope you boys had great holidays and 2013 brings you all good health and much happiness. 

You've fallen prey to an old cliche. Since you are not a fan, you REALLY don't know how little fighting there is in the game. I guess you believe everything you read on the internet too, or on MSNBC. 

Don't give me that crap, retagent, and don't be so condescending!    You know I am a sports nut and hardly squeamish when it come to contact sports. My opinion isn't an uneducated one as I have watched many a televised NHL hockey game and attended a few as well over the years. I live in the Chicago area, for crips sake, and our best friends and one of my sons are huge Blackhawks fans and I am forced to watch quite often, actually!     I am not a fan of the NHL because I AM NOT A FAN of the NHL.  IT'S MY OPINION!  You don't get to say it's wrong or an uneducated one.  I think you know me better than that!  And many share my opinion because it is one of the least popular sports in the country.  And BTW, no I don't believe everything I see on MSNBC.  Do you believe everything you see on Fox News??   


Wow, first post back in a many weeks and retagent gets me going.  Sorry but he really pissed me off!  Geez.................

[footballfan413]

Just like WarharkDad, I too missed hockey. They couldn't have picked a better time to settle. Aside from the fact that I think all involved are idiotic, I am not one of those sanctimonious A Holes that says I won't ever watch/Go to a game or care. It's still the best spectator sport going. In a 60 minute football game, you get maybe 12 minutes of actual play. In hockey you get the whole 60. That, the speed, and the skill(s) they possess make it the fastest game on two feet.

And I was just about to say I can care less and won't ever go to a game again.
As much as I'm amazed at the skill and toughness of hockey players, the one part of the game that bothers me is the lucky break/lucky bounce factor of goal scoring. Goals made cleanly are a thing of beauty, but the other type are similar to fluke touchdowns and there are too many of them.

Yea, there are fluke and soft goals given up. But as far as bounces and redirects, those are actually very much part of the game. Players in front of the net spend a lot time redirecting shots in practice. It may seem like a lucky bounce, but its actually a planned play/strategy. Many defenseman purposely shoot the puck at there own players, so they can redirect it on goal. It's amazing hand-eye coordination, especially when puck is traveling 90+ MPH.

I'm not that much into hockey but Mrs BW and I took in a recent BADGERS game and enjoyed ourselves.  It's fast and physical so it's fun to watch and I can appreciate the athleticism of the players. They crushed an undermanned and slow Alabama-Huntington team 5-0.  I didn't even know they played hockey in Alabama.

As I said in my original post, college and Olympic hockey I enjoy much more.  They skate, play the puck and checking is used to move a skater off the puck, not just to blow a player up.   

[emma17]

You see what hockey does?  Players, fans and non fans are always at the ready to drop the gloves.
Ret you had it coming from 413- I don't understand why you don't seek first to understand before tossing explosive opinions around.

A good thing about hockey is that the game is almost always in contention- leaving the viewer with hope.

[retagent]

It's just a fact that there is less fighting NOW than there was, say 15 - 20 years ago. To quote that old cannard about "I went to a fight and a hockey game broke out" is not accurate. You can have your opinions, I was just trying to inject some reality. I can totally understand not liking the fighting. I am not a fan of the "Staged" fight myself. I think it's silly and just interupts play. If 413 had said that, I would have had no problem. I'm just tired of non-fans (sorry I mis identified you as such 413) saying things like that when they haven't seen a hockey game in many years, if ever. When people hear that, they marginalize the sport, and discourage new fans. Not something I want to do.

There is a difference between that and a little humbug brought on by some marginal, dirty, or dangerous act. It happens in football, basketball, lacrosse and baseball as well as hockey.

I am a Washington Capitals fan, and think that watching highly skilled players like they have is a treat. Was never  a fan of thuggery (Broad Street Bullies, e.g.). Forgive me for being passionate about what I love. I never meant to be an A$$ HO(e - this time.

[footballfan413]

OK, fair enough.  Look, no one appreciates passion for a sport more than I do.  But, you make it sound like the sport has cleaned up a lot in the last decade or two. I will have to take your word for it as I did not watch any hockey before about 1995. But to me, that is a little like saying, compared to Sandy, Katrina wasn't much of a hurricane.  I didn't mention before that my older son played hockey for several years on  HS teams as well as club.  I was appalled at the behavior I saw displayed by some players as well as some fans and parents on many occasions.  On one occasion, a very large and particularly dirty teammate of his threatened the ref that he would be waiting for him by his car after the game after being thrown out of the game for his brutal play.  Once, an older brother of an opposing player spent the entire game pacing along the glass screaming at some of our players that they should come off the ice so he could kick their a$$'s.  When one of our mom's told him to knock it off, he called her a f%@ing b@#$#.  Had to threaten to call 911 to shut that lovely incident down. And the constant verbal exchanges in the stands between fans, don't get me started.  Oops, tooo late, you already did.    Believe me, I could go on and on with the stories but I think I have made my point. Between having two sons and a daughter who were all jocks and played just about every sport at one time or another,  I have never witnessed, in any other sport, the kind of bad behavior on and off the field, arena or court, as I saw in hockey.  Where does that come from? I would contend it is because it permeates the sport. Crap runs down hill and those 13-18 year olds are just following their role modeling NHL counterparts.  And it continues because the sport refuses to police itself because the truth is, there is a very large part of the limited fan base that want it that way, IMHO.  The fighting IS part of the sport. If you are right, that it is way less than it use to be, I'll take your word for it but considering my experiences with the sport, that's not saying much.  My very small comment about not enjoying the thuggery at the pro level has turned into a full on rant and bashing of the sport.  I am sorry for that but it was a reflex response to you questioning that I was expressing an opinion that was based on limited knowledge about the subject.  You should have known better, retegent.  You may not agree with my opinion's but I try very had t make sure, they never come from an uneducated place.

[retagent]

I understand where you come from now.

I also disagree with the larger point  though. I can't undo what has turned you off on hockey, since it is your personal experience, which is about the most valid basis for anyone's opinion.

However, my experience is that pro hockey players are about the best professional athletes one can emulate. There appears to be less misconduct off the ice by them than by other professional athletes. By that, I mean fewer of them are involved in criminal activity or other scandalous behavior. If you watch post game interviews, it seems that they are better subjects than in other sports. My belief is that when they are young, they travel with families to tournaments, and are more closely monitored by the families of the players, rather than turned over to coaches who, for better or worse, shape their outlooks .I coached in an Inline league for a number of years, and saw some of what you spoke of, but the majority of my experience, both with players, and parents was positive. Like anything else, it all depends.......

[emma17]

413 and Ret, I find your discussion to be very interesting and informative, thanks. You both have significant personal experiences that form your opinions.

Keeping the general hockey discussion going, besides the deflected goal issue I raised previously, I struggle with the notion that some hockey fans believe NHL players are great or even the greatest athletes. Don't get me wrong as I know they are extremely skilled and very athletic, but from the perspective of what I call the "talent funnel" they had to pass through to be a pro, I don't see it.

[02 Warhawk]

I think football players are far worse than hockey players...ESPECIALLY off the field. It's apparent when looking at just the criminal stories over the past 5-10 years in the NFL. Guns, drugs, bounty program, players constantly getting arrested, etc...It's no comparison. The NFL is the worst when it comes to thuggery and criminal activity in professional sports.

Yes, each sport has their fair share of bad apples at just about any level of competition. But it seems to be more abundant in football.