FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[HansenRatings]

In 1992, after Superior had dropped football, we paid Livingstone College (NC)  to come to WHITEWATER and fill our schedule.  We won the game 9-0.

Yes. But Livingstone College is actually a thing. It's a real college, with a campus. That is a far cry from the University of Faith. Take a look at the school website.

http://universityoffaithfl.org/

I'm sure Harvard and Yale probably use a free website from Wix.com as well...

I use Wix for my site, and actually, having a URL without "wix.com" at the end means they're not using the free version, buuuuuuuuut the fact that they have the wix ads means they're only paying like $9 a month or something.

These College/University or Faith (there's a bunch of interconnected teams all run by the same organization) schools aren't even your typical for-profit degree factories, because as far as I know they don't offer any sort of degree, and they're definitely not accredited. They're set up specifically to prey on kids who will do anything to keep playing sports and get exposure.

[wally_wabash]

I get that it's hard for UWO to find games, but man...how many "no's" do you have to get before you make the call to University of Faith?  And then pay them for it?  Wouldn't you rather find a D2 or an FCS that might pay you for the game?  I know they've been down that road previously and have been burned by it, but playing one of those games isn't the same as playing three of them.  I don't know.  This is all weird, up to and including the strange commentary about 10 games and playoffs. 

I also have no idea how to fix this for the very good WIAC schools.  I don't blame any other team regional team with playoff aspirations for steering clear.  I don't blame private lib arts schools for preferring games with schools that look more like themselves (and thusly avoiding the WIACs).  I don't blame schools for not wanting to travel all the way up to Oshkosh.  Those are all totally fine reasons for saying no thanks to a home and home with UWO.  Tough situation for sure and there's just not an easy or obvious fix. 

[Bombers798891]

I get that it's hard for UWO to find games, but man...how many "no's" do you have to get before you make the call to University of Faith?  And then pay them for it?  Wouldn't you rather find a D2 or an FCS that might pay you for the game?  I know they've been down that road previously and have been burned by it, but playing one of those games isn't the same as playing three of them.  I don't know.  This is all weird, up to and including the strange commentary about 10 games and playoffs. 

These games are sad. There's simply no other way to describe it. Wesley played a College of Faith in 2014. COF had 8 turnovers, 11 total fumbles, and -45 yards of offense. You will never convince me for a second that any player got anything of value from that game. Given injury risk, I firmly believe these games should not be played under any circumstances.

[wildcat11]

#WhyD3

http://nypost.com/2015/11/29/the-shady-college-football-team-that-gets-paid-to-lose-games/

[wildcat11]

https://advancetitan.com/sports/2017/05/04/eagles-visit-uw-oshkosh

According to an email from Assistant Chancellor and Chief Communications Officer Jamie Ceman, in order for a team to become playoff-eligible in the ranks of Division III football, there must be a minimum of 10 games per season on the docket.

Linfield's reaction in reading that:

[02 Warhawk]

https://advancetitan.com/sports/2017/05/04/eagles-visit-uw-oshkosh

According to an email from Assistant Chancellor and Chief Communications Officer Jamie Ceman, in order for a team to become playoff-eligible in the ranks of Division III football, there must be a minimum of 10 games per season on the docket.

Linfield's reaction in reading that:

In other news..... 

[Bombers798891]

The only possible way that statement makes any sense is if it's somehow it got telephoned from "If you want to qualify for the playoffs as a Pool C bid, you're going to need 10 games to impress the committee"

I mean, even then it's a stretch, but that's the only plausible way I can think of it happening. I mean, the inclusion of "minimum" makes the statement even more odd. Like there are D-III teams out there with 11- or 12-game schedules.

[emma17]

No doubt there is much more to this story. I certainly give UWO the benefit of the doubt.
Coach Cerroni knows how uncertain playoff selections can be. With JCU first up and no other games before UWW game 4 (as I understand it), he may believe UWO would be at a great disadvantage.

I'm anxious to hear the whole story.

[badgerwarhawk]

I get that it's hard for UWO to find games, but man...how many "no's" do you have to get before you make the call to University of Faith?  And then pay them for it?  Wouldn't you rather find a D2 or an FCS that might pay you for the game?  I know they've been down that road previously and have been burned by it, but playing one of those games isn't the same as playing three of them.  I don't know.  This is all weird, up to and including the strange commentary about 10 games and playoffs. 

These games are sad. There's simply no other way to describe it. Wesley played a College of Faith in 2014. COF had 8 turnovers, 11 total fumbles, and -45 yards of offense. You will never convince me for a second that any player got anything of value from that game. Given injury risk, I firmly believe these games should not be played under any circumstances.

The only "gain" I can think of is that you'd get to play your entire roster and most likely nonstarters, probably end of the roster types, would get significant playing time.  Reps are reps regardless of who's on the other side of the ball. 

[wally_wabash]

The only possible way that statement makes any sense is if it's somehow it got telephoned from "If you want to qualify for the playoffs as a Pool C bid, you're going to need 10 games to impress the committee"

I mean, even then it's a stretch, but that's the only plausible way I can think of it happening. I mean, the inclusion of "minimum" makes the statement even more odd. Like there are D-III teams out there with 11- or 12-game schedules.

I know a lot of us here spend an unhealthy amount of time dissecting the minutiae around DIII playoff selection and seeding criteria (guilty), so much so that we take for granted that there are people out there who might not know how the whole thing works.  At this point, I'm wondering if the most logical explanation here is that there are people at UWO dishing out quotes on this process that honestly just don't know how it works.  Going one step further, I think we would all be shocked at how many D-III coaches/ADs/administrators don't know the criteria. 

[Bombers798891]

I know a lot of us here spend an unhealthy amount of time dissecting the minutiae around DIII playoff selection and seeding criteria (guilty)

This is, usually, a fair assessment. But knowing that you're not required to play a "minimum of 10 games" a season to qualify for the playoffs is not what I would call minutiae. I mean, I can't possibly believe that the athletic department would go through the process of adding a team to the schedule because they erroneously believe you need to play 10 games to make the playoffs (YMMV).

I was watching the movie Lucky Number Slevin, and there was an exchange that reminds me of this scenario.

Slevin: I'm not the guy you're looking for. I don't live here.
Sloe: Yeah, well you look like the guy who lives here.
Slevin: Then you don't know what the guy who lives here looks like.

If the paper asked this person why this game was scheduled, and that was the response, then the most logical conclusion I can come to is that this person doesn't know why the game was scheduled. Which, might be fine, although I'd wonder then why they'd comment in the first place.

[emma17]

It seems there are two issues at play. Why did UWO (specifically Coach Cerroni) schedule them in the first place and why was the explanation in the article so inaccurate?

Continuing the possible explanations.
Assuming Coach C scheduled them because he feels there is greater benefit in playing "any" team than no team, he must have had to get approval or at least explain to admin.

I certainly think it's possible Coach C gave a very logical and clear explanation to admin, yet as often happens, the admin rep (Ceman) did a poor job of relating Coach C's explanation. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Asst Chancellor was entirely unfamiliar w D3 playoff selection criteria. He may have heard Coach C say he believes it's important to play the maximum games allowable (10) and that the selection committee considers all sorts of criteria and when it comes to choosing between very similar teams, equal winning % between a 9 game schedule and 10 game schedule would favor the 10 game schedule.

Just one of 1,128,024 different possibilities.

[jknezek]

Very likely a game of telephone like Emma said and the real reason just got lost in translation. However, that doesn't excuse the fact that this "game" should not be played. Besides costing 25K or whatever UWO is paying, it provides legitimacy to a business, and it is a business, not a school, that shouldn't be getting it. It puts players at risk on both sides, though at least in UWO's case they will have insurance, training staff, and procedures to handle injuries. For University of Faith players, an injury could be a much bigger problem. Again, just another reason this should not be happening and no NCAA team should be playing these businesses.

[Bombers798891]

It seems there are two issues at play. Why did UWO (specifically Coach Cerroni) schedule them in the first place and why was the explanation in the article so inaccurate?

Continuing the possible explanations.
Assuming Coach C scheduled them because he feels there is greater benefit in playing "any" team than no team, he must have had to get approval or at least explain to admin.

I certainly think it's possible Coach C gave a very logical and clear explanation to admin, yet as often happens, the admin rep (Ceman) did a poor job of relating Coach C's explanation. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Asst Chancellor was entirely unfamiliar w D3 playoff selection criteria. He may have heard Coach C say he believes it's important to play the maximum games allowable (10) and that the selection committee considers all sorts of criteria and when it comes to choosing between very similar teams, equal winning % between a 9 game schedule and 10 game schedule would favor the 10 game schedule.

Just one of 1,128,024 different possibilities.

I think part of it is, the article seemed to focus on the financials of the situation, so they relied on a non-athletic department spokesperson to handle the issue. Okay, makes sense. But this statement wasn't made on camera, or even in person. It was sent out via email. So, even if Ceman was the official spokesperson on the issue—because of questions about budgets and what not—it seems odd that he wouldn't run the part he isn't sure about by someone who is before sending said email. The telephone-type mixups are a lot more common when you haven't had a chance to get on the same page and someone is speaking off the cuff.

There's also this possibility: That the people making the statement know the statement isn't true, but they don't want to be criticized for spending $25,000 on a game of this caliber, so they come up with the explanation that makes them look the best (We had to do it) and they are banking on the possibility that no one on the paper (or who reads the paper) will say, "Hey, that's not true." Which, as Wally alluded to, might be a good bet

[emma17]

Very likely a game of telephone like Emma said and the real reason just got lost in translation. However, that doesn't excuse the fact that this "game" should not be played. Besides costing 25K or whatever UWO is paying, it provides legitimacy to a business, and it is a business, not a school, that shouldn't be getting it. It puts players at risk on both sides, though at least in UWO's case they will have insurance, training staff, and procedures to handle injuries. For University of Faith players, an injury could be a much bigger problem. Again, just another reason this should not be happening and no NCAA team should be playing these businesses.

This is an interesting point. I wonder if there are common indemnification/risk management agreements between NCAA schools that wouldn't apply in this case.