FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Mr. Ypsi]

Comparing opponents' national ranks

                                     NCC                  Wesley 
Rushing Defense             5th                    3rd
Passing Defense             40th                  15th
Defense                           3rd                     1st

Rushing Offense              21st                  33rd
Passing Offense              109th                19th
Offense                            29th                   8th

Could it be possible we're going to face an even tougher D next weekend?

Or might NCC have played a much tougher schedule than Wesley?

(I don't know the answer to my question, but ranks can be highly misleading when schools play such different schedules.)

[02 Warhawk]

Comparing opponents' national ranks

                                     NCC                  Wesley 
Rushing Defense             5th                    3rd
Passing Defense             40th                  15th
Defense                           3rd                     1st

Rushing Offense              21st                  33rd
Passing Offense              109th                19th
Offense                            29th                   8th

Could it be possible we're going to face an even tougher D next weekend?

Or might NCC have played a much tougher schedule than Wesley?

(I don't know the answer to my question, but ranks can be highly misleading when schools play such different schedules.)

Wesley's SOS 4th 

[Warhawk 96]

Wow.  96, you're a real xxxxxx.

Really???
You created a new account as "ncc1seed" AFTER you lost as the 1 seed in the quarterfinals. Hilarious.

If you clicked on it you'd see the account was created Nov. 15. (Can you guys see those things or do only I get to?)

Pat, we can see that stuff.

To tell you the truth, I didn't even check. I just looked at his stats and commented.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Comparing opponents' national ranks

                                     NCC                  Wesley 
Rushing Defense             5th                    3rd
Passing Defense             40th                  15th
Defense                           3rd                     1st

Rushing Offense              21st                  33rd
Passing Offense              109th                19th
Offense                            29th                   8th

Could it be possible we're going to face an even tougher D next weekend?

Or might NCC have played a much tougher schedule than Wesley?

(I don't know the answer to my question, but ranks can be highly misleading when schools play such different schedules.)

Wesley's SOS 4th 

Since that extremely flawed metric is what got UWW its #2 seed, are you sure you want to bring up SOS?!

[bleedpurple]

02- I know you realize there are 3 phases to the game. The NCC defense played as well as advertised but it was the warhawk defense that forced 3 2nd half turnovers resulting in short fields and an NCC loss. The cardinal defense was good enough to move on to Dover but their offense wasn't, which is what most were saying before the game so no surprise.   

I agree with this, to a point.  NCC has a very good defense (especially #40). In a broad sense, NCC has a defense, that with the right offense, could move on to the semi-final.  However, as we went into the game, most people did know, as you pointed out, that for the NCC to win, the defense would have to carry the day.  They played well.  But, they didn't dominate the game (through turnovers or shutting down the UW-W offense) the way the UW-W defense did. There were three very good units out there Saturday. While two of them slugged it out (the UW-W offense and the NCC defense) the third, (the UW-W defense) dominated a merely "decent" unit. So I guess I agree with both of you. It depends on what you mean by "good enough to move on". 

[footballfan413]

Congrat to the Warhawks and staff on a great win in Naperville!  Very tough opponent and we are the better for facing them down. Their defense and #40 were the real deal but we are the team that moves on!   Had a great time tailgating with a very fun group even if we did have to shovel our own parking lot.  I especially loved when the plower showed up, plowed the spaces just on the other side of us and then left, leaving us to clear our own spots.   But you gotta love playing in December!  On to the Wolverines!  

[Mr. Ypsi]

02- I know you realize there are 3 phases to the game. The NCC defense played as well as advertised but it was the warhawk defense that forced 3 2nd half turnovers resulting in short fields and an NCC loss. The cardinal defense was good enough to move on to Dover but their offense wasn't, which is what most were saying before the game so no surprise.   

I agree with this, to a point.  NCC has a very good defense (especially #40). In a broad sense, NCC has a defense, that with the right offense, could move on to the semi-final.  However, as we went into the game, most people did know, as you pointed out, that for the NCC to win, the defense would have to carry the day.  They played well.  But, they didn't dominate the game (through turnovers or shutting down the UW-W offense) the way the UW-W defense did. There were three very good units out there Saturday. While two of them slugged it out (the UW-W offense and the NCC defense) the third, (the UW-W defense) dominated a merely "decent" unit. So I guess I agree with both of you. It depends on what you mean by "good enough to move on". 

Um, bp, did you happen to notice that UWW gained fewer yards and had fewer first downs than NCC?

NCC's defense was fully worthy of the Stagg.  The short fields they had to defend in the fourth quarter were the difference.  I try to distinguish between turnovers and takeaways (the former are flat-out drops or fumbles on 'routine' tackles, mistaken reads where the pass goes straight to a defender, etc.; the latter are strips due to sheer overpowering of the ballhandler, great defensive reads that the qb could not reasonably foresee, etc.).  While the distinction is not by any means clear cut (especially with tipped passes), the commentaries (despite many attempts, I never could get the video feed) suggest at least two of the three (and perhaps all three) were takeaways.  I will credit the UWW defense more than fault the NCC offense; in that aspect of 'big' plays, the UWW defense was superior.  But since I suspect the UWW offense was in general superior to the NCC offense, overall I've gotta give the nod to the NCC defense.

And, bear in mind, I'm an IWU guy - most of the season I despise the Cardinals!

[voice]

I was told today that WCCO Radio in the Twin Cities broadcast yesterday's St. Thomas-Bethel Division III quarterfinal game.  WCCO is to Minneapolis-St. Paul that WTMJ is to Milwaukee, WGN is to Chicago and WFAW/KOOL 106.5 is to Whitewater.

[Barber Greene]

Hasn't been confirmed yet, but it looks like Jerry Kill of NIU will be the next head coach of Minnesota. Since Kill takes his entire staff with him when he changes positions, that would mean former Warhawk OC Jim Zebrowski would be going with him. Reunited with Andy Harris  

http://www.ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=467942

[bleedpurple]

02- I know you realize there are 3 phases to the game. The NCC defense played as well as advertised but it was the warhawk defense that forced 3 2nd half turnovers resulting in short fields and an NCC loss. The cardinal defense was good enough to move on to Dover but their offense wasn't, which is what most were saying before the game so no surprise.  

I agree with this, to a point.  NCC has a very good defense (especially #40). In a broad sense, NCC has a defense, that with the right offense, could move on to the semi-final.  However, as we went into the game, most people did know, as you pointed out, that for the NCC to win, the defense would have to carry the day.  They played well.  But, they didn't dominate the game (through turnovers or shutting down the UW-W offense) the way the UW-W defense did. There were three very good units out there Saturday. While two of them slugged it out (the UW-W offense and the NCC defense) the third, (the UW-W defense) dominated a merely "decent" unit. So I guess I agree with both of you. It depends on what you mean by "good enough to move on".  

Um, bp, did you happen to notice that UWW gained fewer yards and had fewer first downs than NCC?

NCC's defense was fully worthy of the Stagg.  The short fields they had to defend in the fourth quarter were the difference.  I try to distinguish between turnovers and takeaways (the former are flat-out drops or fumbles on 'routine' tackles, mistaken reads where the pass goes straight to a defender, etc.; the latter are strips due to sheer overpowering of the ballhandler, great defensive reads that the qb could not reasonably foresee, etc.).  While the distinction is not by any means clear cut (especially with tipped passes), the commentaries (despite many attempts, I never could get the video feed) suggest at least two of the three (and perhaps all three) were takeaways.  I will credit the UWW defense more than fault the NCC offense; in that aspect of 'big' plays, the UWW defense was superior. But since I suspect the UWW offense was in general superior to the NCC offense, overall I've gotta give the nod to the NCC defense.

And, bear in mind, I'm an IWU guy - most of the season I despise the Cardinals!

It's obvious you weren't at the game.  And you missed my point, Y. My point is that on one hand the NCC defense IS good enough to move on (which you reiterated). On the other hand it is not because they are not.  You can cite all the stats you want, but takeaways WIN GAMES. UW-W got them NCC did not. Period.  

So to challenge your thinking, did the UW-W offense win this game (AGAINST the NCC defense), or did the UW-W defense win this game (something the NCC defense failed to do)?  

[Mr. Ypsi]

(I'm assuming both your 'with' in the last sentence were actually 'win'.)

I'm not disagreeing with you, and, dang!, I wish I could have seen the game .  To me, it comes down to turnovers vs. takeaways.  Did the UWW defense win the game or did the NCC offense lose the game?  In either case, the NCC defense may not have done quite enough to win, but I think we agree they certainly didn't lose it.

[BoBo]

I try to distinguish between turnovers and takeaways (the former are flat-out drops or fumbles on 'routine' tackles, mistaken reads where the pass goes straight to a defender, etc.; the latter are strips due to sheer overpowering of the ballhandler, great defensive reads that the qb could not reasonably foresee, etc.).  While the distinction is not by any means clear cut (especially with tipped passes), the commentaries (despite many attempts, I never could get the video feed) suggest at least two of the three (and perhaps all three) were takeaways.  I will credit the UWW defense more than fault the NCC offense; in that aspect of 'big' plays, the UWW defense was superior.  But since I suspect the UWW offense was in general superior to the NCC offense, overall I've gotta give the nod to the NCC defense.

With the end result begin the same, who gives a $%^& if the QB threw it into the arms of the defense or the ball carrier dropped the ball or a defender stripped it out with a great hit? Look at the stat sheet, there is no distinction between turnovers and takeaways. How you distinguish it makes no difference.

[BoBo]

Hasn't been confirmed yet, but it looks like Jerry Kill of NIU will be the next head coach of Minnesota. Since Kill takes his entire staff with him when he changes positions, that would mean former Warhawk OC Jim Zebrowski would be going with him. Reunited with Andy Harris  

http://www.ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=467942

If you can't beat them, invite them to join you!!

"kill" them then join them?

I like that response of armour248 - "Promote Zebrowski to HC "
Is that your handle on that blog Barber?

[Barber Greene]

Hasn't been confirmed yet, but it looks like Jerry Kill of NIU will be the next head coach of Minnesota. Since Kill takes his entire staff with him when he changes positions, that would mean former Warhawk OC Jim Zebrowski would be going with him. Reunited with Andy Harris  

http://www.ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=467942

If you can't beat them, invite them to join you!!

I like that response of armour248 - "Promote Zebrowski to HC "
Is that your handle on that blog Barber?

No, I'm Barber Greene over there also. I actually get BG from Dekalb...I lived in a house on that street while attending NIU.

Z gets a lot a respect on the NIU board.  They had a big offensive turnaround this year and a lot of posters give Z a lot of credit for that (whether deserved or not). They had been pretty mediocre on offense the previous two years.

[Kira & Jaxon's Dad]

Hasn't been confirmed yet, but it looks like Jerry Kill of NIU will be the next head coach of Minnesota. Since Kill takes his entire staff with him when he changes positions, that would mean former Warhawk OC Jim Zebrowski would be going with him. Reunited with Andy Harris  

http://www.ncaabbs.com/showthread.php?tid=467942

If you can't beat them, invite them to join you!!

I like that response of armour248 - "Promote Zebrowski to HC "
Is that your handle on that blog Barber?

No, I'm Barber Greene over there also. I actually get BG from Dekalb...I lived in a house on that street while attending NIU.

Z gets a lot a respect on the NIU board.  They had a big offensive turnaround this year and a lot of posters give Z a lot of credit for that (whether deserved or not). They had been pretty mediocre on offense the previous two years.

Barber Greene Road isn't very close to the University.  Why did you live way on the East side of DeKalb?