FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[hazzben]

So you score it:

MIAC 47
WIAC 43

That'd be my utter conjecture, yes 

[bleedpurple]

Here'd be my take assuming neutral fields

UST wins 6 of 10. I really hope we get to see this one, home field probably determines the winner.
Push. BU & UWW both have good D's & offenses that have struggled. Instinct leans towards UWW just from an experience standpoint, but they seem to be on their heels right now.
Cobbers win 9 of 10. Common opponent, SJU beat UWEC on the road and lost by a lot more than the score indicated on the road to Concordia.
UWP wins 7 of 10. Augsburg has shown they can hang with good teams, but not that they can beat them.
UWL wins 6 of 10. Both teams have been inconsistent, but UWL has a nice NCC win from week 1 and the most Olaf can claim are some close losses.
SJU wins 7 of 10. You forgot SJU , who may be tied with Carleton in the standings but just demolished them 51-14. Keep in mind SJU also beat UWEC in EC.
GAC wins 8 of 10 v. UWRF. Common opponent in Simpson was a 9 point GAC win and a 9 point UWRF loss. GAC is much better than their record indicates. Not so for UWRF
Carleton v. UWRF. Push...Both teams stink
UWSP wins 10 of 10. Hamline only beats UMAC leftovers and teams unfit to compete in the MIAC.

I guess it's no surprise that I think you may be slightly optimistic regarding UST and BU? 

[bleedpurple]

Thanks WD, 02 and 413.

Based on some of the feedback I've received privately and publicly, I'd like to quickly clarify something.
The fact that I feel mistakes were made in how the QB situation was handled has no bearing whatsoever on my support for the team and especially for coach LL. I don't expect or demand perfection from anybody- and everybody makes mistakes. 
I do feel grown ups should be able to discuss different points of view with respect.  The staff certainly deserves greater benefit of the doubt that all of their decisions are well thought out.  It is possible, however, for people that aren't coaching to have valid and even educated points of view that differ from the those of the staff.
 

As importantly, it won't affect your tailgates, will it? 

[footballfan413]

Thanks WD, 02 and 413.

Based on some of the feedback I've received privately and publicly, I'd like to quickly clarify something.
The fact that I feel mistakes were made in how the QB situation was handled has no bearing whatsoever on my support for the team and especially for coach LL. I don't expect or demand perfection from anybody- and everybody makes mistakes. 
I do feel grown ups should be able to discuss different points of view with respect.  The staff certainly deserves greater benefit of the doubt that all of their decisions are well thought out.  It is possible, however, for people that aren't coaching to have valid and even educated points of view that differ from the those of the staff.
 

As importantly, it won't affect your tailgates, will it? 

Um, yes it will..................... in that we will have way less of them this season if no play offs!   

[HScoach]

Here'd be my take assuming neutral fields

UST wins 6 of 10. I really hope we get to see this one, home field probably determines the winner.
Push. BU & UWW both have good D's & offenses that have struggled. Instinct leans towards UWW just from an experience standpoint, but they seem to be on their heels right now.
Cobbers win 9 of 10. Common opponent, SJU beat UWEC on the road and lost by a lot more than the score indicated on the road to Concordia.
UWP wins 7 of 10. Augsburg has shown they can hang with good teams, but not that they can beat them.
UWL wins 6 of 10. Both teams have been inconsistent, but UWL has a nice NCC win from week 1 and the most Olaf can claim are some close losses.
SJU wins 7 of 10. You forgot SJU , who may be tied with Carleton in the standings but just demolished them 51-14. Keep in mind SJU also beat UWEC in EC.
GAC wins 8 of 10 v. UWRF. Common opponent in Simpson was a 9 point GAC win and a 9 point UWRF loss. GAC is much better than their record indicates. Not so for UWRF
Carleton v. UWRF. Push...Both teams stink
UWSP wins 10 of 10. Hamline only beats UMAC leftovers and teams unfit to compete in the MIAC.

I guess it's no surprise that I think you may be slightly optimistic regarding UST and BU? 

Maybe he should have compared the E-8 instead of the MIAC?  I have a feeling they'd show even better given the H2H results.....

Just kidding.   Couldn't resist.

[HScoach]

^  I say that simply to draw attention to the small sample size and the dangers of extrapolating the data too far out.  Upsets happen.  The better overall team doesn't always win.

[hazzben]

Here'd be my take assuming neutral fields

UST wins 6 of 10. I really hope we get to see this one, home field probably determines the winner.
Push. BU & UWW both have good D's & offenses that have struggled. Instinct leans towards UWW just from an experience standpoint, but they seem to be on their heels right now.
Cobbers win 9 of 10. Common opponent, SJU beat UWEC on the road and lost by a lot more than the score indicated on the road to Concordia.
UWP wins 7 of 10. Augsburg has shown they can hang with good teams, but not that they can beat them.
UWL wins 6 of 10. Both teams have been inconsistent, but UWL has a nice NCC win from week 1 and the most Olaf can claim are some close losses.
SJU wins 7 of 10. You forgot SJU , who may be tied with Carleton in the standings but just demolished them 51-14. Keep in mind SJU also beat UWEC in EC.
GAC wins 8 of 10 v. UWRF. Common opponent in Simpson was a 9 point GAC win and a 9 point UWRF loss. GAC is much better than their record indicates. Not so for UWRF
Carleton v. UWRF. Push...Both teams stink
UWSP wins 10 of 10. Hamline only beats UMAC leftovers and teams unfit to compete in the MIAC.

I guess it's no surprise that I think you may be slightly optimistic regarding UST and BU? 

Not a chance, I have utterly no bias 

[thrunt01]

So i have a question for any Whitewater or Oshkosh fan, or anyone who has seen these two teams play this year. I'm just wondering how this Oshkosh team compares to the Whitewater teams of the past few years that have been so dominant. I know Oshkosh is a good team, but are they the type of team that will keep the WIAC in the stagg bowl? Are they good, or elite?

Not sure about past years but I do believe this UWO team is top 4 in the country this year.

My initial reaction in reading this post was "don't be silly".  Upon further review, however, don't be silly. 
Ha, just kidding.  Looking at # 2, 3 and 4- MHB is more balanced on offense this year, but they certainly give up their share of points.  Linfield- they give up their share of points.  St. Thomas- are they really the 4th best team?  It seems to me UWO has a strong enough D and certainly the playmakers on offense to be in the game vs. these teams.   

If Wara stays healthy I believe UWO has the skilled players (excellent receivers) on offense and a strong enough D to do very well in the playoffs.  I will caution though that once UWW decided to get serious on offense, some chinks in the UWO defense were exposed.

You got me. I basically think UWO is better than UST making them exactly number 4. As for the defense being exposed, UWW made changes at both QB and RB to different types of players. Both more mobile. It took UWO about a quarter to make the adjustments and get the victory. So yes if future teams decide to switch their pocket passing and power backs to a mobile QB and a scat back mid stream UWO would have to make some adjustments again.

[bleedpurple]

So i have a question for any Whitewater or Oshkosh fan, or anyone who has seen these two teams play this year. I'm just wondering how this Oshkosh team compares to the Whitewater teams of the past few years that have been so dominant. I know Oshkosh is a good team, but are they the type of team that will keep the WIAC in the stagg bowl? Are they good, or elite?

Not sure about past years but I do believe this UWO team is top 4 in the country this year.

My initial reaction in reading this post was "don't be silly".  Upon further review, however, don't be silly. 
Ha, just kidding.  Looking at # 2, 3 and 4- MHB is more balanced on offense this year, but they certainly give up their share of points.  Linfield- they give up their share of points.  St. Thomas- are they really the 4th best team?  It seems to me UWO has a strong enough D and certainly the playmakers on offense to be in the game vs. these teams.   

If Wara stays healthy I believe UWO has the skilled players (excellent receivers) on offense and a strong enough D to do very well in the playoffs.  I will caution though that once UWW decided to get serious on offense, some chinks in the UWO defense were exposed.

You got me. I basically think UWO is better than UST making them exactly number 4. As for the defense being exposed, UWW made changes at both QB and RB to different types of players. Both more mobile. It took UWO about a quarter to make the adjustments and get the victory. So yes if future teams decide to switch their pocket passing and power backs to a mobile QB and a scat back mid stream UWO would have to make some adjustments again.

I'd be curious as to what adjustments you believe UW-O made? After the two 3rd quarter UW-W TD drives to close the score to 21-13, the rest of the UW-W drives in the game were as follows:

UW-W drives from their own 41 to the UW-O 7. They lost the ball when UW-W fumbled on 4th and 1.
UW-W drives from their own 48 to the UW-O 28. They missed a FG.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 6. On second down a wide receiver drops a pass without defensive contact at the 13. At worst, UW-W would have been left with a manageable 3rd and 3.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 20. On first down, UW-W had a procedure penalty. On 3rd and 15, a wide open receiver drops a pass at the UW-W 48.
UW-W drives from their own 34 to the UW-O 8 before 4 straight incomplete passes ended the drive. 

Other than possibly putting a foreign substance on the ball, what did the UW-O defense do to adjust to what UW-W was doing to them in the second half?

[footballfan413]

So i have a question for any Whitewater or Oshkosh fan, or anyone who has seen these two teams play this year. I'm just wondering how this Oshkosh team compares to the Whitewater teams of the past few years that have been so dominant. I know Oshkosh is a good team, but are they the type of team that will keep the WIAC in the stagg bowl? Are they good, or elite?

Not sure about past years but I do believe this UWO team is top 4 in the country this year.

My initial reaction in reading this post was "don't be silly".  Upon further review, however, don't be silly. 
Ha, just kidding.  Looking at # 2, 3 and 4- MHB is more balanced on offense this year, but they certainly give up their share of points.  Linfield- they give up their share of points.  St. Thomas- are they really the 4th best team?  It seems to me UWO has a strong enough D and certainly the playmakers on offense to be in the game vs. these teams.   

If Wara stays healthy I believe UWO has the skilled players (excellent receivers) on offense and a strong enough D to do very well in the playoffs.  I will caution though that once UWW decided to get serious on offense, some chinks in the UWO defense were exposed.

You got me. I basically think UWO is better than UST making them exactly number 4. As for the defense being exposed, UWW made changes at both QB and RB to different types of players. Both more mobile. It took UWO about a quarter to make the adjustments and get the victory. So yes if future teams decide to switch their pocket passing and power backs to a mobile QB and a scat back mid stream UWO would have to make some adjustments again.

I'd be curious as to what adjustments you believe UW-O made? After the two 3rd quarter UW-W TD drives to close the score to 21-13, the rest of the UW-W drives in the game were as follows:

UW-W drives from their own 41 to the UW-O 7. They lost the ball when UW-W fumbled on 4th and 1.
UW-W drives from their own 48 to the UW-O 28. They missed a FG.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 6. On second down a wide receiver drops a pass without defensive contact at the 13. At worst, UW-W would have been left with a manageable 3rd and 3.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 20. On first down, UW-W had a procedure penalty. On 3rd and 15, a wide open receiver drops a pass at the UW-W 48.
UW-W drives from their own 34 to the UW-O 8 before 4 straight incomplete passes ended the drive.

Other than possibly putting a foreign substance on the ball, what did the UW-O defense do to adjust to what UW-W was doing to them in the second half?

And let's not forget the choice, to not kick a field goal on 4th down, that would have brought us to within 5 points of the Titans near the beginning of the 4th quarter.  Thanks for the recap, BP, but, man, that is just depressing......................

But, let's not forget that a great defense usually has a lot to do with fumbles, incomplete passes, etc. 

[WarhawkDad]

You have raised a valid point.   What I do not get why is why some posters on this board don't except constructive poster input and questioning as just that.  It is a valid discussion question.   I think Pat Coleman probably hit the nail on the head when he talked about handling the snap, the rush and that experience is important.   I believe that is why the coaches made the decision.   With that said, it is entirely possible and probable that Eric's accuracy has suffered because of that.   The other reason is weather and wind.   

It is going to be interesting to see what happens at Stevens Point on Saturday, I believe we could see significant changes in personnel, especially if we get an early lead.   Some will probably happen sooner than that.

Oh, I totally support and except his, "constructive poster input and questioning."    I can't help it if I had a good answer for him.  Isn't that the discussion part?     

you know 413, you always have a good answer!  And a good bloody mary! 

[WarhawkDad]

Thanks WD, 02 and 413.

Based on some of the feedback I've received privately and publicly, I'd like to quickly clarify something.
The fact that I feel mistakes were made in how the QB situation was handled has no bearing whatsoever on my support for the team and especially for coach LL.  I don't expect or demand perfection from anybody- and everybody makes mistakes. 
I do feel grown ups should be able to discuss different points of view with respect.  The staff certainly deserves greater benefit of the doubt that all of their decisions are well thought out.  It is possible, however, for people that aren't coaching to have valid and even educated points of view that differ from the those of the staff.
 

         

Sometimes when you are very close to something, like coaches of a team, it is harder to step back and take a real critical look at what is occuring.  I am not saying that is what happened in this instance, but it does happen.   On the other hand, I also believe that we as UWW fans are somewhat spoiled and at times hyper-analytical on things that do occur.   

Anyone making the trip to Stevens Point?   Looks like a beautiful sunny day of 40 degrees.   

[WarhawkDad]

Here'd be my take assuming neutral fields

UST wins 6 of 10. I really hope we get to see this one, home field probably determines the winner.
Push. BU & UWW both have good D's & offenses that have struggled. Instinct leans towards UWW just from an experience standpoint, but they seem to be on their heels right now.
Cobbers win 9 of 10. Common opponent, SJU beat UWEC on the road and lost by a lot more than the score indicated on the road to Concordia.
UWP wins 7 of 10. Augsburg has shown they can hang with good teams, but not that they can beat them.
UWL wins 6 of 10. Both teams have been inconsistent, but UWL has a nice NCC win from week 1 and the most Olaf can claim are some close losses.
SJU wins 7 of 10. You forgot SJU , who may be tied with Carleton in the standings but just demolished them 51-14. Keep in mind SJU also beat UWEC in EC.
GAC wins 8 of 10 v. UWRF. Common opponent in Simpson was a 9 point GAC win and a 9 point UWRF loss. GAC is much better than their record indicates. Not so for UWRF
Carleton v. UWRF. Push...Both teams stink
UWSP wins 10 of 10. Hamline only beats UMAC leftovers and teams unfit to compete in the MIAC.

I guess it's no surprise that I think you may be slightly optimistic regarding UST and BU? 

Maybe he should have compared the E-8 instead of the MIAC?  I have a feeling they'd show even better given the H2H results.....

Just kidding.   Couldn't resist.

  Ouch!  That hurt!   

[bleedpurple]

So i have a question for any Whitewater or Oshkosh fan, or anyone who has seen these two teams play this year. I'm just wondering how this Oshkosh team compares to the Whitewater teams of the past few years that have been so dominant. I know Oshkosh is a good team, but are they the type of team that will keep the WIAC in the stagg bowl? Are they good, or elite?

Not sure about past years but I do believe this UWO team is top 4 in the country this year.

My initial reaction in reading this post was "don't be silly".  Upon further review, however, don't be silly. 
Ha, just kidding.  Looking at # 2, 3 and 4- MHB is more balanced on offense this year, but they certainly give up their share of points.  Linfield- they give up their share of points.  St. Thomas- are they really the 4th best team?  It seems to me UWO has a strong enough D and certainly the playmakers on offense to be in the game vs. these teams.   

If Wara stays healthy I believe UWO has the skilled players (excellent receivers) on offense and a strong enough D to do very well in the playoffs.  I will caution though that once UWW decided to get serious on offense, some chinks in the UWO defense were exposed.

You got me. I basically think UWO is better than UST making them exactly number 4. As for the defense being exposed, UWW made changes at both QB and RB to different types of players. Both more mobile. It took UWO about a quarter to make the adjustments and get the victory. So yes if future teams decide to switch their pocket passing and power backs to a mobile QB and a scat back mid stream UWO would have to make some adjustments again.

I'd be curious as to what adjustments you believe UW-O made? After the two 3rd quarter UW-W TD drives to close the score to 21-13, the rest of the UW-W drives in the game were as follows:

UW-W drives from their own 41 to the UW-O 7. They lost the ball when UW-W fumbled on 4th and 1.
UW-W drives from their own 48 to the UW-O 28. They missed a FG.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 6. On second down a wide receiver drops a pass without defensive contact at the 13. At worst, UW-W would have been left with a manageable 3rd and 3.
UW-W gaines no yards from their own 20. On first down, UW-W had a procedure penalty. On 3rd and 15, a wide open receiver drops a pass at the UW-W 48.
UW-W drives from their own 34 to the UW-O 8 before 4 straight incomplete passes ended the drive.

Other than possibly putting a foreign substance on the ball, what did the UW-O defense do to adjust to what UW-W was doing to them in the second half?

And let's not forget the choice, to not kick a field goal on 4th down, that would have brought us to within 5 points of the Titans near the beginning of the 4th quarter.  Thanks for the recap, BP, but, man, that is just depressing......................

But, let's not forget that a great defense usually has a lot to do with fumbles, incomplete passes, etc.

I agree with this as a general principle.  However, great defense has nothing to do with the two incompletions I cited. The receivers were wide open and Behrendt got them the ball. Both catches were easy catches that were dropped. 

And Dez did take a good shot on his fumble. I give UW-O credit for that, but I'm not sure that was a result of any UW-O "adjustment".  I am not saying UW-O doesn't have a good defense. I just didn't see where they were able to adjust to what UW-W was doing.  I think Emma's point is a valid one.  I am questioning the response that said "It took UW-O about a quarter to make the adjustments and get the victory."  So i ask again, what adjustments?

I didn't see UW-O adjustments. What I saw was UW-O dominate the first half and (looking back) won the game then when UW-W posed no threat to hurt them with the pass.  The 21 point halftime lead was obviously not insurmountable because UW-W was within 8 and had the ball on the UW-O 7 yard line on the last play of the 3rd quarter. However, when you fall behind by 21 at halftime, you are not leaving yourself enough margin for the mistakes UW-W made in the second half. 

[badgerwarhawk]

Anyone making the trip to Stevens Point?   Looks like a beautiful sunny day of 40 degrees.   

GBMan and I will be there.

I hope nothing I've said implied that I questioned emma's support of the program.  That has never been my intention.