FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[emma17]

So now we have to devise a plan that gets UWW into the dance.

I think our best bet is to bypass the rules and formulas as it gets too complicated and somewhat depressing.  Like any good salesman, we have to appeal to the emotional side of the committee members.  These folks have the same little people in their heads as we do (how's that for a tee up?) and we need to get those little people arguing with each other.  This requires great help from the UWW offense as they must BURY every opponent and leave no doubt that the "new" UWW is like the "old" UWW- and not the recent UWW.
Like a political ad, we must remind every living being on the planet that the current UWW defense is the one that held UMU to 10 points last year and shut out St. Thomas.     

It would also help if UWO were to lose to UWL in appreciation for all the support I've given them- ingrates.   

I might send the committee a fruit basket.

UWO needs to lose twice now.

What's going to kill Whitewater's playoff hopes was that Buffalo State loss. That hurts on two fronts:

1. It's a loss. Plain and simple....not good.

2. BSU is going to struggle to finish .500. If BSU went on to win the E8, I would feel better on making the playoffs knowing that UWW lost to two very good teams. But that's not the case at all.

So BSU screwed us by beating us, and by going on to have a rough year. I know the committee mainly looks at regional games when considering playoff teams. But I think nonregional games is a secondary factor in the consideration.

I'm not going to predict whether UWW makes it or not because I think it all depends on the number of teams that ultimately end up 9-1, but it's going to be very tough.  Regardless of whether it's in the criteria or not, it's hard to ignore a loss to a very average team at home.  And calling Buff State average is being generous.  

I wasn't surprised by the loss to Oshkosh, but still can't figure out the Buff State loss.  How does anyone from the WIAC, let alone the top dog, lose to a middle of the pack E-8 team?   That would be like Otterbein or Marietta coming to Wisconsin and winning a game.  That stuff just isn't supposed to happen.

I realize it's water under the bridge, but I still think Buff State is better than average.  Records don't always tell the whole story.  No doubt their wins and losses puts them in the middle of their conference.  But in terms of their competitive level, they are a team that has the ability to give most any team a good game.  They only have one bad loss-to Alfred.  They played Salisbury tough and beat a 6-1 Cortland State.  I'm not making a case for UWW's chances, just giving props to a Buff State team that I feel plays tougher than their record might indicate. 

[emma17]

So now we have to devise a plan that gets UWW into the dance.

I think our best bet is to bypass the rules and formulas as it gets too complicated and somewhat depressing.  Like any good salesman, we have to appeal to the emotional side of the committee members.  These folks have the same little people in their heads as we do (how's that for a tee up?) and we need to get those little people arguing with each other.  This requires great help from the UWW offense as they must BURY every opponent and leave no doubt that the "new" UWW is like the "old" UWW- and not the recent UWW.
Like a political ad, we must remind every living being on the planet that the current UWW defense is the one that held UMU to 10 points last year and shut out St. Thomas.     

It would also help if UWO were to lose to UWL in appreciation for all the support I've given them- ingrates.  

I'm going to go all politically incorrect on this board and publicly say not only am I pulling for UW-O to lose the rest of their WIAC games (understandable), but will be rooting against them in every game in the playoffs (if they make it) as well. Probably parallel to blasphemy on this board, but since there is a full endorsement of open and honest dialogue among the members here, I thought I might as well put my sentiment out there.  And my reasons are purely logical, not emotional based on the UW-W loss on Saturday. 

Bleed, some times I just don't know if you're pulling our collective legs.  I'm not opposed to you rooting against the Titan, I just don't know if you're serious? 
My picture perfect scenario- UWO loses to UWL and somehow UWW gets in- and is blessed with a rematch!  Sometimes life gives second chances.   

[emma17]

Anybody listen to the coach's show through Warhawk Football?
Interesting stuff.

[cubs]

So now we have to devise a plan that gets UWW into the dance.

I think our best bet is to bypass the rules and formulas as it gets too complicated and somewhat depressing.  Like any good salesman, we have to appeal to the emotional side of the committee members.  These folks have the same little people in their heads as we do (how's that for a tee up?) and we need to get those little people arguing with each other.  This requires great help from the UWW offense as they must BURY every opponent and leave no doubt that the "new" UWW is like the "old" UWW- and not the recent UWW.
Like a political ad, we must remind every living being on the planet that the current UWW defense is the one that held UMU to 10 points last year and shut out St. Thomas.     

It would also help if UWO were to lose to UWL in appreciation for all the support I've given them- ingrates.  

I'm going to go all politically incorrect on this board and publicly say not only am I pulling for UW-O to lose the rest of their WIAC games (understandable), but will be rooting against them in every game in the playoffs (if they make it) as well. Probably parallel to blasphemy on this board, but since there is a full endorsement of open and honest dialogue among the members here, I thought I might as well put my sentiment out there.  And my reasons are purely logical, not emotional based on the UW-W loss on Saturday. 

Bleed, some times I just don't know if you're pulling our collective legs.  I'm not opposed to you rooting against the Titan, I just don't know if you're serious? 
My picture perfect scenario- UWO loses to UWL and somehow UWW gets in- and is blessed with a rematch!  Sometimes life gives second chances.   

Excuse me if this is a stupid question, but how does a UWO loss to LAX help Whitewater?  Wouldn't UWO need to lose twice since UWO has the tie-breaker for the WIAC Championship?

[Pat Coleman]

Cubs,

It's hard for UWO to lose two without losing one first.

[bleedpurple]

Cubs,

It's hard for UWO to lose two without losing one first.

Very succinct. Why can't I ever be succinct? 

[bleedpurple]

So now we have to devise a plan that gets UWW into the dance.

I think our best bet is to bypass the rules and formulas as it gets too complicated and somewhat depressing.  Like any good salesman, we have to appeal to the emotional side of the committee members.  These folks have the same little people in their heads as we do (how's that for a tee up?) and we need to get those little people arguing with each other.  This requires great help from the UWW offense as they must BURY every opponent and leave no doubt that the "new" UWW is like the "old" UWW- and not the recent UWW.
Like a political ad, we must remind every living being on the planet that the current UWW defense is the one that held UMU to 10 points last year and shut out St. Thomas.     

It would also help if UWO were to lose to UWL in appreciation for all the support I've given them- ingrates.  

I'm going to go all politically incorrect on this board and publicly say not only am I pulling for UW-O to lose the rest of their WIAC games (understandable), but will be rooting against them in every game in the playoffs (if they make it) as well. Probably parallel to blasphemy on this board, but since there is a full endorsement of open and honest dialogue among the members here, I thought I might as well put my sentiment out there.  And my reasons are purely logical, not emotional based on the UW-W loss on Saturday. 

Bleed, some times I just don't know if you're pulling our collective legs.  I'm not opposed to you rooting against the Titan, I just don't know if you're serious? 
My picture perfect scenario- UWO loses to UWL and somehow UWW gets in- and is blessed with a rematch! Sometimes life gives second chances.   

Now THAT is something to root for!  I think Pat said the most likely route to the playoffs is actually UW-O losing two games and UW-W winning out.  I know a lot has to happen out there in D3 land. The "Pool C" section under general football on these boards is a great place to find out information on all this.

There are definitely times I pull your collective legs a bit. Other times, I like throwing stuff out there for discussion.  I'll stay mysterious on this one a bit longer. I probably posted my playoff thoughts a bit early, given there are three weeks to go. I guess it was a case of premature epostulation. 

[02 Warhawk]

This weekend's WIAC Matchups report.

[02 Warhawk]

What sucks is I really thought this would be the year the WIAC gets two teams into the playoffs. But those greedy UWO jerks had to win last weekend   

[emma17]

So now we have to devise a plan that gets UWW into the dance.

I think our best bet is to bypass the rules and formulas as it gets too complicated and somewhat depressing.  Like any good salesman, we have to appeal to the emotional side of the committee members.  These folks have the same little people in their heads as we do (how's that for a tee up?) and we need to get those little people arguing with each other.  This requires great help from the UWW offense as they must BURY every opponent and leave no doubt that the "new" UWW is like the "old" UWW- and not the recent UWW.
Like a political ad, we must remind every living being on the planet that the current UWW defense is the one that held UMU to 10 points last year and shut out St. Thomas.     

It would also help if UWO were to lose to UWL in appreciation for all the support I've given them- ingrates.  

I'm going to go all politically incorrect on this board and publicly say not only am I pulling for UW-O to lose the rest of their WIAC games (understandable), but will be rooting against them in every game in the playoffs (if they make it) as well. Probably parallel to blasphemy on this board, but since there is a full endorsement of open and honest dialogue among the members here, I thought I might as well put my sentiment out there.  And my reasons are purely logical, not emotional based on the UW-W loss on Saturday. 

Bleed, some times I just don't know if you're pulling our collective legs.  I'm not opposed to you rooting against the Titan, I just don't know if you're serious? 
My picture perfect scenario- UWO loses to UWL and somehow UWW gets in- and is blessed with a rematch! Sometimes life gives second chances.   

Now THAT is something to root for!  I think Pat said the most likely route to the playoffs is actually UW-O losing two games and UW-W winning out.  I know a lot has to happen out there in D3 land. The "Pool C" section under general football on these boards is a great place to find out information on all this.

There are definitely times I pull your collective legs a bit. Other times, I like throwing stuff out there for discussion.  I'll stay mysterious on this one a bit longer. I probably posted my playoff thoughts a bit early, given there are three weeks to go. I guess it was a case of premature epostulation. 

You just made me blush

[emma17]

Anybody listen to the coach's show through Warhawk Football?
Interesting stuff.

Here is the link to the show- sorry i should have included last night http://940wfaw.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=6090171

[footballfan413]

Great article and interview on the front page with Cerroni about this rebuilding of the Titans program.  This quote I found particularly interesting in light of the way they seem to have been following Whitewater's template for national success.  From scheduling Mount Union for big game experience, to hiring our former strength and conditioning coach, to bringing in a talented and motivated AD.   

"We just weren't very good," Cerroni said. "We didn't recruit guys that wanted to be champions, we recruited guys that wanted to build a program and beat champions. Those are the kinds of kids we've got here right now. They didn't come here thinking they were going to win championships; they came here to knock people off."

In light of 17's comment a few days ago, mentioning that we needed to, "recognize that there are 99 other kids on the team, all of whom came to UWW to win playoff games," it got me thinking.  Is it possible that we could become a victim of our own success when it comes to recruiting?  I have said before that it is much easier to decide to play for a national championship program than it is to help create one.  Hunger is a powerful motivator and winning championships, in my opinion, can not be the focus of a team and staff.  Playing football just for the headlines and accolades will not do it.  The players need to play this sport with heart and a fire in their bellies and want to knock heads every practice, every game, week in and week out.  It is those kinds of players that we need to recruit year in and year out.  Teams have to have a, "refuse to lose, " attitude and need to build the kind of chemistry that was at the core of the 05-07 teams who started this run.  They knew they had to earn it and winning was not a foregone conclusion.  I am just speaking in generalities here, just wondering if this could be a natural pitfall or letdown for a program with this level of recent success over time.   Where Oshkosh is right now, just takes me back to 05 and the feelings of watching something special and seeing a team's desire to prove doubters wrong at every turn. If they can keep playing with a balanced offense, it will be interesting to see how far they can go.   

[emma17]

Great article and interview on the front page with Cerroni about this rebuilding of the Titans program.  This quote I found particularly interesting in light of the way they seem to have been following Whitewater's template for national success.  From scheduling Mount Union for big game experience, to hiring our former strength and conditioning coach, to bringing in a talented and motivated AD.   

"We just weren't very good," Cerroni said. "We didn't recruit guys that wanted to be champions, we recruited guys that wanted to build a program and beat champions. Those are the kinds of kids we've got here right now. They didn't come here thinking they were going to win championships; they came here to knock people off."

In light of 17's comment a few days ago, mentioning that we needed to, "recognize that there are 99 other kids on the team, all of whom came to UWW to win playoff games," it got me thinking.  Is it possible that we could become a victim of our own success when it comes to recruiting?  I have said before that it is much easier to decide to play for a national championship program than it is to help create one.  Hunger is a powerful motivator and winning championships, in my opinion, can not be the focus of a team and staff.  Playing football just for the headlines and accolades will not do it.  The players need to play this sport with heart and a fire in their bellies and want to knock heads every practice, every game, week in and week out.  It is those kinds of players that we need to recruit year in and year out.  Teams have to have a, "refuse to lose, " attitude and need to build the kind of chemistry that was at the core of the 05-07 teams who started this run.  They knew they had to earn it and winning was not a foregone conclusion.  I am just speaking in generalities here, just wondering if this could be a natural pitfall or letdown for a program with this level of recent success over time.   Where Oshkosh is right now, just takes me back to 05 and the feelings of watching something special and seeing a team's desire to prove doubters wrong at every turn. If they can keep playing with a balanced offense, it will be interesting to see how far they can go.

Interesting thoughts 413.  I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I imagine you weren't only impressed with the words of Cerroni.  In every article I've read, the quoted UWO player was extremely impressive in their single-minded focus. 

As for the bigger question of the type of players getting recruited.  Very intriguing for sure.  Is it possible that over five years Cerroni has found the mix of talent and desire/unique single-minded attitude it takes to dethrone a champion and become one?  Is it possible some UWW recruits are top of the line athletes, but don't have that same sort of fire?  Maybe it's like business.  Sometimes a start up company gets the right mix of talent and desire- and they overtake the established company that has the same talent- and probably more, but doesn't have the same fire.  I know coach LL talks about the importance of competition within the team-I'm sure for the purpose of stoking that fire.  Good thought provoker.         

Also, I'm interested in what you mean by "winning championships cannot be the focus of a team and staff"- can you explain? 

[bleedpurple]

Very interesting discussion 413 and 17! I think all those thoughts should be/will be part of the evaluation process LL will be going through as he evaluates this year.  If there is any shade of complacency (just a word to describe what you guys are talking about, not meaning anyone is truly complacent), I'm confident it will be dealt with.  Although I do believe the evaluation will occur, I'm doubting much will be found.  My thoughts on why UW-W is where they are right now.

1. UW-O (it just seems like they have to be put here to give credit where credit is due).
2. Performance. I think certain areas of the team have not performed up to the level of previous years.
3. Injuries.  The reality is that UW-W is playing some kids that would normally simply be getting stronger and experienced in the program, rather than playing if not for a host of injuries. Positions affected: projected/probable starter at right tackle (out for the year in training camp), starting right guard (out for the year as of a few weeks ago), running back (#2 behind Des Ward, but expected to be a change of pace/big play RB), Pre-season All-American Wide Receiver, another receiver (likely starter) we just got back 2 weeks ago after missing the entire season up to that point, preseason All -American CB, various other CB's missing games.  I'm sure I am missing some.

I do think this is a good discussion point and an interesting point brought up by 413.  I also think it's reasonable to expect UW-W to lose a couple games every now and then just cuz, not because something undesirable has crept into the program. 

[footballfan413]

Great article and interview on the front page with Cerroni about this rebuilding of the Titans program.  This quote I found particularly interesting in light of the way they seem to have been following Whitewater's template for national success.  From scheduling Mount Union for big game experience, to hiring our former strength and conditioning coach, to bringing in a talented and motivated AD.   

"We just weren't very good," Cerroni said. "We didn't recruit guys that wanted to be champions, we recruited guys that wanted to build a program and beat champions. Those are the kinds of kids we've got here right now. They didn't come here thinking they were going to win championships; they came here to knock people off."

In light of 17's comment a few days ago, mentioning that we needed to, "recognize that there are 99 other kids on the team, all of whom came to UWW to win playoff games," it got me thinking.  Is it possible that we could become a victim of our own success when it comes to recruiting?  I have said before that it is much easier to decide to play for a national championship program than it is to help create one.  Hunger is a powerful motivator and winning championships, in my opinion, can not be the focus of a team and staff.  Playing football just for the headlines and accolades will not do it.  The players need to play this sport with heart and a fire in their bellies and want to knock heads every practice, every game, week in and week out.  It is those kinds of players that we need to recruit year in and year out.  Teams have to have a, "refuse to lose, " attitude and need to build the kind of chemistry that was at the core of the 05-07 teams who started this run.  They knew they had to earn it and winning was not a foregone conclusion.  I am just speaking in generalities here, just wondering if this could be a natural pitfall or letdown for a program with this level of recent success over time.   Where Oshkosh is right now, just takes me back to 05 and the feelings of watching something special and seeing a team's desire to prove doubters wrong at every turn. If they can keep playing with a balanced offense, it will be interesting to see how far they can go.

Interesting thoughts 413.  I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I imagine you weren't only impressed with the words of Cerroni.  In every article I've read, the quoted UWO player was extremely impressive in their single-minded focus. 

As for the bigger question of the type of players getting recruited.  Very intriguing for sure.  Is it possible that over five years Cerroni has found the mix of talent and desire/unique single-minded attitude it takes to dethrone a champion and become one?  Is it possible some UWW recruits are top of the line athletes, but don't have that same sort of fire?  Maybe it's like business.  Sometimes a start up company gets the right mix of talent and desire- and they overtake the established company that has the same talent- and probably more, but doesn't have the same fire.  I know coach LL talks about the importance of competition within the team-I'm sure for the purpose of stoking that fire.  Good thought provoker.         

Also, I'm interested in what you mean by "winning championships cannot be the focus of a team and staff"- can you explain?

I probably should have used the word, "only."  The focus should not be about, "only," winning championships but about putting the pieces in place to put you in the best position to win, period.  Do that and the Championships will come. Does that make sense?  Of course, winning a championship has to be the final goal for every sports team.  You gotta believe it to achieve it but it starts with every game and I know Coach L has been really great about fostering that attitude in all his teams.  One game at a time! 
Please don't take any of my thoughts to be a reflection on our team this season.  Like I said before, expectations are pretty ridiculous these days and going 8-2 in the WIAC is a tremendous achievement for any team if we can win out.  Just wondering aloud if our success is now working against the program more than it is working for them.