FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[desertcat1]

I've been mulling over this back and forth and decided that it is an example of how different people look at the same situation and come away with different conclusions. I'm not sure that we're that far apart, but are just emphasizing different aspects of the total picture. We may even come to the similar conclusions about who we think are better teams, given the entire picture. I have tried to be concise, and have, maybe, come off as too doctrinaire about what I am trying to get you to consider. I don't necessarily disagree with your points as something to be taken into consideration when ranking teams. I just think that there are other things that must also be considered.

I just think that teams can change over the course of the season either improving, or getting worse. Sometimes it's not clear as to how a team has changed. Looking at games early in the season is valid, but those games have to be put into perspective. Even game-to-game can be tricky. UWW beats Platteville by 19, then Stevens Point by 10. They also beat Wash U by ten. They score as many points against Platteville as they do against Stevens Point and Wash U combined. How do you rank those opponents? In order to do so, other factors come into play. If UWW plays Wash U today, they might win by 30. You never know.

Let's leave it there, since it would take longer than a couple paragraphs to come to some sort ofunderstanding of how we, with our internal biases, and different world views, to understand where we both are coming from. I have no problem with your "system" since it is yours, and as I said before, I don't see anythinginherently invalid with it. Just trying to get you to grasp the nuances I take into consideration.

My previous point was to show that there were specifics in where I'm coming from.

you lost me at hello 

[stoutguy]

I've been mulling over this back and forth and decided that it is an example of how different people look at the same situation and come away with different conclusions. I'm not sure that we're that far apart, but are just emphasizing different aspects of the total picture. We may even come to the similar conclusions about who we think are better teams, given the entire picture. I have tried to be concise, and have, maybe, come off as too doctrinaire about what I am trying to get you to consider. I don't necessarily disagree with your points as something to be taken into consideration when ranking teams. I just think that there are other things that must also be considered.

I just think that teams can change over the course of the season either improving, or getting worse. Sometimes it's not clear as to how a team has changed. Looking at games early in the season is valid, but those games have to be put into perspective. Even game-to-game can be tricky. UWW beats Platteville by 19, then Stevens Point by 10. They also beat Wash U by ten. They score as many points against Platteville as they do against Stevens Point and Wash U combined. How do you rank those opponents? In order to do so, other factors come into play. If UWW plays Wash U today, they might win by 30. You never know.

Let's leave it there, since it would take longer than a couple paragraphs to come to some sort ofunderstanding of how we, with our internal biases, and different world views, to understand where we both are coming from. I have no problem with your "system" since it is yours, and as I said before, I don't see anythinginherently invalid with it. Just trying to get you to grasp the nuances I take into consideration.

My previous point was to show that there were specifics in where I'm coming from.

Yes, I get it, retagent.  You are obviously very bright and perhaps are trying to make sure all of us folks realize this fact.  But here's the deal.  We are talking about a fricking d3 football game.  Lighten up, Francis.

[MacQuiz]

I've been mulling over this back and forth and decided that it is an example of how different people look at the same situation and come away with different conclusions. I'm not sure that we're that far apart, but are just emphasizing different aspects of the total picture. We may even come to the similar conclusions about who we think are better teams, given the entire picture. I have tried to be concise, and have, maybe, come off as too doctrinaire about what I am trying to get you to consider. I don't necessarily disagree with your points as something to be taken into consideration when ranking teams. I just think that there are other things that must also be considered.

I just think that teams can change over the course of the season either improving, or getting worse. Sometimes it's not clear as to how a team has changed. Looking at games early in the season is valid, but those games have to be put into perspective. Even game-to-game can be tricky. UWW beats Platteville by 19, then Stevens Point by 10. They also beat Wash U by ten. They score as many points against Platteville as they do against Stevens Point and Wash U combined. How do you rank those opponents? In order to do so, other factors come into play. If UWW plays Wash U today, they might win by 30. You never know.

Let's leave it there, since it would take longer than a couple paragraphs to come to some sort ofunderstanding of how we, with our internal biases, and different world views, to understand where we both are coming from. I have no problem with your "system" since it is yours, and as I said before, I don't see anythinginherently invalid with it. Just trying to get you to grasp the nuances I take into consideration.

My previous point was to show that there were specifics in where I'm coming from.

Yes, I get it, retagent.  You are obviously very bright and perhaps are trying to make sure all of us folks realize this fact.  But here's the deal.  We are talking about a fricking d3 football game.  Lighten up, Francis.

Ahhhhhh...Some Clarity

[02 Warhawk]

I've been mulling over this back and forth and decided that it is an example of how different people look at the same situation and come away with different conclusions. I'm not sure that we're that far apart, but are just emphasizing different aspects of the total picture. We may even come to the similar conclusions about who we think are better teams, given the entire picture. I have tried to be concise, and have, maybe, come off as too doctrinaire about what I am trying to get you to consider. I don't necessarily disagree with your points as something to be taken into consideration when ranking teams. I just think that there are other things that must also be considered.

I just think that teams can change over the course of the season either improving, or getting worse. Sometimes it's not clear as to how a team has changed. Looking at games early in the season is valid, but those games have to be put into perspective. Even game-to-game can be tricky. UWW beats Platteville by 19, then Stevens Point by 10. They also beat Wash U by ten. They score as many points against Platteville as they do against Stevens Point and Wash U combined. How do you rank those opponents? In order to do so, other factors come into play. If UWW plays Wash U today, they might win by 30. You never know.

Let's leave it there, since it would take longer than a couple paragraphs to come to some sort ofunderstanding of how we, with our internal biases, and different world views, to understand where we both are coming from. I have no problem with your "system" since it is yours, and as I said before, I don't see anythinginherently invalid with it. Just trying to get you to grasp the nuances I take into consideration.

My previous point was to show that there were specifics in where I'm coming from.

Yes, I get it, retagent.  You are obviously very bright and perhaps are trying to make sure all of us folks realize this fact.  But here's the deal.  We are talking about a fricking d3 football game.  Lighten up, Francis.

+K

[retagent]

And, I guess, my mother wears combat boots, and I'm ugly too. OOOOH, you're so mean.

[D O.C.]

Lighten up, Francis  +k

[bleedpurple]

The same could be said in many different situations. That's what I'm trying to get the WIACcentric followers to note. Things change during a season. St John's for example, has a very young team. (I know that UWW is also in this situation, so it holds for both, if you need that for me to make my point) As the season went on, SJU had some very close calls, but came through positively. They also have had some significant injuries, which, some might argue, make them not as good as when they played UWRF. A case can be made from that. The fact remains, you are the team your record says you are. There may be teams in the MIAC, middle of the pack group, that could play conference champions in other conferences at least even. There is no way to prove or disprove that, but past performance by MIAC (as well as WIAC) teams in recent playoff games is one thing that points in that direction. Top MIAC teams are hurt SOS-wise by playing these teams too. Life's tough - get a helmet.

I bolded some of my generalities.

I don't even know what point you're trying to make anymore.

Let me just ask you a question. Today, with all you know, what team do you think would be a tougher challenge for Bethel, UWRF or St Olaf?

I've been mulling over this back and forth and decided that it is an example of how different people look at the same situation and come away with different conclusions. I'm not sure that we're that far apart, but are just emphasizing different aspects of the total picture. We may even come to the similar conclusions about who we think are better teams, given the entire picture. I have tried to be concise, and have, maybe, come off as too doctrinaire about what I am trying to get you to consider. I don't necessarily disagree with your points as something to be taken into consideration when ranking teams. I just think that there are other things that must also be considered.

I just think that teams can change over the course of the season either improving, or getting worse. Sometimes it's not clear as to how a team has changed. Looking at games early in the season is valid, but those games have to be put into perspective. Even game-to-game can be tricky. UWW beats Platteville by 19, then Stevens Point by 10. They also beat Wash U by ten. They score as many points against Platteville as they do against Stevens Point and Wash U combined. How do you rank those opponents? In order to do so, other factors come into play. If UWW plays Wash U today, they might win by 30. You never know.

Let's leave it there, since it would take longer than a couple paragraphs to come to some sort ofunderstanding of how we, with our internal biases, and different world views, to understand where we both are coming from. I have no problem with your "system" since it is yours, and as I said before, I don't see anythinginherently invalid with it. Just trying to get you to grasp the nuances I take into consideration.

My previous point was to show that there were specifics in where I'm coming from.

I think this is Retagent's way of saying: "River Falls"

[fredfalcon]

How fired up can WW get for this game? How much pride/fight do the Falcons still have? These two questions may determine the winner. I'm goin way out on the limb for this one:RF wins.

[desertcat1]

How fired up can WW get for this game? How much pride/fight do the Falcons still have? These two questions may determine the winner. I'm goin way out on the limb for this one:RF wins.

[/b]


hey fredddieee  ,   I don't see and leaves on that tree..

[hazzben]

Here's a data point no one (not even Retagent  ) is discussing.

Who would win between St. Olaf and Waldorf. UWW needs to be thankful that 1-9 record isn't tabulated in SoS. It would give Bethel a marked advantage and is the worst opponent on either teams' schedule.

I'd rank them

1. UWRF
2. St. Olaf
   ... chasm of ineptitude...
3. Waldorf

I realize UWW is just trying to fill out their schedule with that game. Not knocking them for it, but also pointing out their SoS isn't being knocked for it either. 

[MasterJedi]

How fired up can WW get for this game? How much pride/fight do the Falcons still have? These two questions may determine the winner. I'm goin way out on the limb for this one:RF wins.

From what I've heard UWW doesn't want to share a title. They want it, and I don't think River Falls have the team to win. They will be fired up, and the game will be closer then normal because of that but UWW will pull away and should win by about 28 or so.

[hazzben]

How fired up can WW get for this game? How much pride/fight do the Falcons still have? These two questions may determine the winner. I'm goin way out on the limb for this one:RF wins.

That is one long, thin, lonely limb my friend. I think UWRF gets routed. If, however, they even keep it close, something tells me retagent might have a thing or two to say 

[voice]

Will Whitewater stay in the West or be moved to the North when the NCAA Division III Playoff brackets are announced on Sunday?  UWW made it to the Stagg Bowl out of the West Region in 2005, 2006, and 2008. They were "moved" to the North Region in 2007, 2009, 2010, and 2011.

The Warhawks four D3 Titles all were all while representing the North Region.

Not sure if the stat has any real significance??

NOTE: Game at a time attitude and a lot is riding on UWW to beat RF on Saturday ie: undisputed WIAC Championship and #1 seed. No time to take the Falcons for granted!!

[02 Warhawk]

Will Whitewater stay in the West or be moved to the North when the NCAA Division III Playoff brackets are announced on Sunday?  UWW made it to the Stagg Bowl out of the West Region in 2005, 2006, and 2008. They were "moved" to the North Region in 2007, 2009, 2010, and 2011.

The Warhawks four D3 Titles all were all while representing the North Region.

Interesting...I didn't know all their titles came when they went through the North.

[KitchenSink]

Wow.  I didn't know that either.  Well, I'm already on record saying Bethel/Linfield will headline the "West" bracket and UWW will join NCC in a Midwestish "North" bracket.  I see Concordia WI coming to the Perk on 11/23.