FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[NewHawk]

When I went to college and lived off campus I paid $415 a quarter in tuition, that same school is more than 15 times that now.  Its the University of Georgia by the way.  Prices are ridiculous no matter where you go.  And no I am not 100 these were the prices in the 80's

[badgerwarhawk]

You are correct Palum.  Coach Z did graduate from UW-River Falls as an eight time letter winner (4 football, 4 baseball).  His daughter Shannon was the track All-American at RF. 

[bleedpurple]

You are correct Palum.  Coach Z did graduate from UW-River Falls as an eight time letter winner (4 football, 4 baseball).  His daughter Shannon was the track All-American at RF.

Stan's other daughter Saree was one of my son's teachers in seventh grade. She was a great teacher and one of his favorites.  She moved to San Diego and taught there for awhile.   She now owns her own business, "Girls on Target",  which emphasizes fitness and wellness for girls of all ages. 

[bleedpurple]

"How Do You Follow a Lance Leipold?"

www.warhawkfootball.com

[MasterJedi]

*If UW-W has so much more money available than privates, why is UW-W bussing to Jackson, MS (an 11 hour 28 minute drive without traffic per Google Maps) while Wesley College is flying to Chicago (an 11 hour 32 minute driver without traffic per Google Maps)?

Ha, I think the answer, or at least a big portion of the answer, to that question night be found here:

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2015/08/12/scott_walker_s_basketball_stadium_finance_bill_the_wisconsin_governor_just.html

The arena part at least actually has nothing to do with it since that funding (only about $80 million after interest) comes from bonding (future funds) not present funding that was cut. But the "cut school funding and gave it to a basketball team" storyline is better for more people's agendas then the actual facts.

As far as actual facts Master, its true that only $80 million from state funds will go to the new Bucks arena, but that doesn't change the fact that $250 million was cut from the U of Wisconsin system, which of course includes the state schools not located in Mad City. The Wisconsin governor is no friend higher public education.

Yes, I'm not disputing that. I will however, always dispute the factually false assumption that education was cut to fund the Bucks. They're two separate issues.

[Pat Coleman]

Yes, I'm not disputing that. I will however, always dispute the factually false assumption that education was cut to fund the Bucks. They're two separate issues.

Regardless, even as two separate issues, don't they show what the priorities are for the Wisconsin state government? Even if the plan wasn't "cut education to give tax breaks for an arena" they still cut education and gave tax breaks for an arena. Even if they aren't connected in intent, they are both priorities of the administration. Kinda doesn't matter if the intent was to connect them or not.

[Gregory Sager]

(ducking the inevitable barrage of cheese curds being hurled my way)

Cheese curds are way to tasty and valuable to throw at anyone.

[MasterJedi]

Yes, I'm not disputing that. I will however, always dispute the factually false assumption that education was cut to fund the Bucks. They're two separate issues.

Regardless, even as two separate issues, don't they show what the priorities are for the Wisconsin state government? Even if the plan wasn't "cut education to give tax breaks for an arena" they still cut education and gave tax breaks for an arena. Even if they aren't connected in intent, they are both priorities of the administration. Kinda doesn't matter if the intent was to connect them or not.

That's how the national media is playing it too since they haven't fact checked anything. No matter how you feel about the cuts to education the arena deal is a slam dunk. For just the arena itself it's $250 million private + $250 public (combined with state, city and county) where the Bucks play any overruns in construction. Then, on their own with other developers and with no public funds they're going to be building another $500 million ancilliary development in the Park East. It also fully fills up the Park East that's county owned that has sat vacant for 13 years looking like a moonscape and doing no good and looking VERY blighted.

It also ignores that if the Bucks left the state would lose more money in the long run due to the "jock tax" so it would lead to more cuts in other areas with the current political environment. As both sides have said, looking at the facts it's a good deal.

[ExTartanPlayer]

It also ignores that if the Bucks left the state would lose more money in the long run due to the "jock tax" so it would lead to more cuts in other areas with the current political environment. As both sides have said, looking at the facts it's a good deal.

Really?  What's the state income tax in Wisconsin?  If my quick Google search that says it's between 4 and 7.65% is correct, and we'll assume that the Bucks' payroll is $80ish million this year climbing to $100 million over the next couple years as the NBA cap increases, I don't see how Wisconsin gets more than $10 million annually in jock tax from having an NBA team (My understanding of this is a little fuzzy, but I believe that players on road trips may pay taxes on their salary for games in Wisconsin...but even if that's the case, that's a wash because then presumably Bucks players would not pay taxes on their own road games).

I don't doubt that you have done some research into this, but pretty much everything that I've ever read suggests that every one of the sounds-good-in-the-press arguments in favor of publicly-funded stadiums (creating jobs, serving as economic drivers in revitalizing areas by bringing people in, providing substantial tax income, etc) is bunk.  So if you can better explain to me how the jock tax alone will come CLOSE to offsetting $250 million, I would be fascinated to hear it.

The whole idea that a stadium is a good investment because more people will come into town and spend money there is just silly.  People still need to be entertained.  If (Pro Sports Team X) leaves, the main difference is that instead of 20,000 local residents paying the NBA franchise $75-500 for a ticket 41 nights a year, those people might go out and see a movie, or go bowling, or eat at a local restaurant, or spend their money somewhere else in the community.  It's not like the money that gets spent by people going to games just evaporates if the team leaves.

[bulk19]

Yes, I'm not disputing that. I will however, always dispute the factually false assumption that education was cut to fund the Bucks. They're two separate issues.

Regardless, even as two separate issues, don't they show what the priorities are for the Wisconsin state government? Even if the plan wasn't "cut education to give tax breaks for an arena" they still cut education and gave tax breaks for an arena. Even if they aren't connected in intent, they are both priorities of the administration. Kinda doesn't matter if the intent was to connect them or not.

That's how the national media is playing it too since they haven't fact checked anything. No matter how you feel about the cuts to education the arena deal is a slam dunk. For just the arena itself it's $250 million private + $250 public (combined with state, city and county) where the Bucks play any overruns in construction. Then, on their own with other developers and with no public funds they're going to be building another $500 million ancilliary development in the Park East. It also fully fills up the Park East that's county owned that has sat vacant for 13 years looking like a moonscape and doing no good and looking VERY blighted.

It also ignores that if the Bucks left the state would lose more money in the long run due to the "jock tax" so it would lead to more cuts in other areas with the current political environment. As both sides have said, looking at the facts it's a good deal.

Master Jedi -
I can see you've done your research, and I agree with  your points, because I've done mine, too...
Since this is steering towards a political argument, I'll throw my two cents in, too...

1) There are many who are ignorant about the economic impact the new stadium will have in the downtown area and the trickledown affect throughout the state...
2) There are many who have no clue about the UW System's bloated budget...
3) There are many who are using the UW System Budget cuts and the Bucks new arena to take shots at Walker, since they don't agree with his policies...

Here's a pretty good summary of where I'm coming from on this issue:

http://da.radio.cbssports.com/2015/07/08/bill-michaels-uneducated-masses-of-media-have-presented-bucks-arena-situation-poorly/

[MasterJedi]

It also ignores that if the Bucks left the state would lose more money in the long run due to the "jock tax" so it would lead to more cuts in other areas with the current political environment. As both sides have said, looking at the facts it's a good deal.

Really?  What's the state income tax in Wisconsin?  If my quick Google search that says it's between 4 and 7.65% is correct, and we'll assume that the Bucks' payroll is $80ish million this year climbing to $100 million over the next couple years as the NBA cap increases, I don't see how Wisconsin gets more than $10 million annually in jock tax from having an NBA team (My understanding of this is a little fuzzy, but I believe that players on road trips may pay taxes on their salary for games in Wisconsin...but even if that's the case, that's a wash because then presumably Bucks players would not pay taxes on their own road games).

I don't doubt that you have done some research into this, but pretty much everything that I've ever read suggests that every one of the sounds-good-in-the-press arguments in favor of publicly-funded stadiums (creating jobs, serving as economic drivers in revitalizing areas by bringing people in, providing substantial tax income, etc) is bunk.  So if you can better explain to me how the jock tax alone will come CLOSE to offsetting $250 million, I would be fascinated to hear it.

The whole idea that a stadium is a good investment because more people will come into town and spend money there is just silly.  People still need to be entertained.  If (Pro Sports Team X) leaves, the main difference is that instead of 20,000 local residents paying the NBA franchise $75-500 for a ticket 41 nights a year, those people might go out and see a movie, or go bowling, or eat at a local restaurant, or spend their money somewhere else in the community.  It's not like the money that gets spent by people going to games just evaporates if the team leaves.

Every time an NBA player plays a game in Wisconsin they have to pay income tax too, so they're not just earning that tax money from the Bucks but every team that plays. So no matter what if the Bucks leave it's a net negative for the entire state. It's also not just the stadium, they're going to spend $500 million MORE than the stadium and build a hotel, residential, retail, entertainment and others. They're also investing with Marquette to build a state of the art sports medicine building and a new practice facility on the new land too.

So yes, it's spending a lot of public money, but there will actually be the benefits this time around. The plans have been released, it's not just a pie in the sky thing. It's also filling in vacant land that has sat there for 13 years untouched and unwanted do to crazy costs. The Bucks have agreed to the cities requests for minority hiring and other requests for construction.

If you're against it on principal that's one thing but the fight is over now and it's helping reinvent Milwaukee. We have 833 E Michigan almost done, NM's new building is on the way up. The Couture, the start of the streetcar system, the arena and it's entertainment district, NM's new rumored pretty large mixed-use building, Block 9 by Mandel, the lakefront gateway project and new park, JCI's tallest tower in the state by a lot. It's all coming together and it's past the point of no return on the arena thank God.

[NewHawk]

Let's see if he will also go halvsies on the Warhawk locker room redo.

[ExTartanPlayer]

Every time an NBA player plays a game in Wisconsin they have to pay income tax too, so they're not just earning that tax money from the Bucks but every team that plays.

I see you cleverly ignored my built-in rebuttal to this piece of your post.  Yes, every time an NBA player participates in a game in Wisconsin, they pay taxes for that.  However, with that being the case, the Bucks players do not pay Wisconsin taxes on games they play in other states, correct?  So taxes for NBA salaries are paid by the Bucks' players for their 41 home games and the respective visiting teams for each of those 41 home games.  It still comes out to 82 games' worth of salaries for one NBA roster (or 41 games' worth of Bucks player salaries and 41 games' worth of visiting team player salaries).  The point is, the "jock tax" is not exactly a statewide revenue driver!  At most, that's $10 million in annual tax revenue from jock taxes.

I also have no desire to turn this into a political debate, but I at least want to get this piece of the story straight.  The tax revenue generated by the jock tax is NOT a large amount of money (relative to the overall pool of state tax revenue).

[bleedpurple]

I can't wait until camp opens so we can talk football instead of politics. Oh that's right it already has!

How about we ease back onto the gridiron with some highlights of Conor Simpson, Whitewater's transfer WR from Washington State University.

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1856712/highlights/66142375/v2

[bulk19]

I can't wait until camp opens so we can talk football instead of politics. Oh that's right it already has!

How about we ease back onto the gridiron with some highlights of Conor Simpson, Whitewater's transfer WR from Washington State University.

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1856712/highlights/66142375/v2

Let's have another discussion about WW recruiting and public/private schools, then, OK?