FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[badgerwarhawk]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

[Toby Taff]

WW- Do you feel people are "failures" if they don't accomplish a goal? This is a serious question, not trying to be snarky.

If my daughter sets her goal for the lead role in a play or my son sets his goal as a certain score on his LSAT, are both failures if they come up short?

I don't. That's my point. Besides, a D3 football team should have a lot of goals, including many that have little to do with what they do on the field.

WW, I really do try to understand you. I'm missing your point and I'm sorry if I'm slow on the uptake.

My position is simple. I believe it is good for the UWW administration to publicly declare their goal is to win the national championship- AND I'm also saying if the team falls short of that goal, neither the program nor the players are failures.

Yes, the program can have lots of goals.

I think we're on 2 of 3 possible same pages. But I don't think administration needs to go there, nor should it. Football program people? Hell yeah. And they do.

By the way, administration is in the news plenty lately, for those who think the media ignores Whitewater

At first I was reluctant to include administration, but I think there are important reasons to include it. Without administration support, big team/program goals will be hard to achieve.
Here's another reason administration may want to get on board (I have no proof there is causation), from the Gazette:

Last year, UW-W saw its first enrollment drop after years of increases. Before the start of the 2017-18 school year, UW-W had seen record enrollment seven times in the previous eight years.

Now, the campus in Whitewater has seen two consecutive years of lower enrollment.

I'm an alumnus of UMHB and the father of 2 UMHB students. During the parent side of freshman orientation we were told a few things to bank on. 1) tuition would go up every year (not my favorite thing to hear) 2.80% of students would receive significant financial aid 3. athletics would be taken seriously. The goal in starting football program wasn't to have a money pit. If we were going to participate, we were going whole hog. The same goes for all sports. Coaches are hired and students recruited for the purpose of putting their best foot forward and winning. The school has other goals of course, but the intent for excellence is stated from very top of the administration.

[emma17]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

[bleedpurple]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

I never thought I would believe it is possible to overstate the importance of the football program at UW-W, but... I think to suggest the attendance of a school of UW-W's enrollment would rise and fall based on Stagg Bowl victories is a huge stretch. I'm guessing virtually none of the non-football player students between 07 and 14 chose UW-W because of how many Stagg Bowls we won.

[badgerwarhawk]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

My point is that to my knowledge our administration has never publicly stated the football program's goal was a national championship and I don't believe that has anything to do with the drop in enrollment. Particularly when the problem is system wide. Also our retention rate of 2016-17 freshman was a record high so they weren't fleeing because we didn't even make the playoffs let alone the Stagg Bowl. 

[emma17]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

I never thought I would believe it is possible to overstate the importance of the football program at UW-W, but... I think to suggest the attendance of a school of UW-W's enrollment would rise and fall based on Stagg Bowl victories is a huge stretch. I'm guessing virtually none of the non-football player students between 07 and 14 chose UW-W because of how many Stagg Bowls we won.

And if I had $1 billion I would bet you every last cent that your guess is 100% wrong. You Bleed, are wrong to think UWW's national football success did not lead to the enrollment of at least some non football playing students. 

[emma17]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

My point is that to my knowledge our administration has never publicly stated the football program's goal was a national championship and I don't believe that has anything to do with the drop in enrollment. Particularly when the problem is system wide. Also our retention rate of 2016-17 freshman was a record high so they weren't fleeing because we didn't even make the playoffs let alone the Stagg Bowl.

BW- you're arguing points I'm not making. Not only that you're ignoring the statistics the article you posted presents.

I'll summarize it this way, if it's your belief general enrollment doesn't benefit from national success in athletics, we can agree to disagree. 

If your belief is enrollment doesn't benefit from an administration's public commitment to national excellence in any aspect of the university, we can agree to disagree.

[bleedpurple]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

I never thought I would believe it is possible to overstate the importance of the football program at UW-W, but... I think to suggest the attendance of a school of UW-W's enrollment would rise and fall based on Stagg Bowl victories is a huge stretch. I'm guessing virtually none of the non-football player students between 07 and 14 chose UW-W because of how many Stagg Bowls we won.

And if I had $1 billion I would bet you every last cent that your guess is 100% wrong. You Bleed, are wrong to think UWW's national football success did not lead to the enrollment of at least some non football playing students.

You are arguing against a point I am not making. I didn't say that "National football success" did not lead to the enrollment of at least some non football paying students." I said the number of Stagg Bowls we won wasn't a criteria for virtually any of the students. If it had been three instead of six, I don't believe that hurts the enrollment to the point that overall enrollment rises or falls.

I do believe UW-W's well established standard of excellence in athletics and other programs greatly enhances enrollment numbers. Specific number of Stagg Bowl wins, not so much. Disagree all you want. But don't change the argument from number of Stagg Bowl victories to "National football success" and then say I'm wrong. And going from alluding to macro shifts like overall enrollment being up or down to "at least some non-football playing students" is quite a shift also. In the context of 10,000 to 12,000 students, I stand by my statement. But my statement is different than the one you attributed to me. So knock it off.

[bleedpurple]

Here's a list of the top ten factors (from most to least important) that influenced over 200 thousand college freshman in choosing their schools*

    "College has very good academic reputation"
    "This college's graduates get good jobs"
    "I was offered financial assistance"
    "The cost of attending this college"
    "A visit to this campus"
    "College has a good reputation for its social activities"
    "Wanted to go to a college about this size"
    "College's grads get into top grad/professional schools"
    "The percentage of students that graduate from this college"
    "I wanted to live near home"

*According to US News and World Report and the Princeton Review.
   

[OzJohnnie]

Here's a list of the top ten factors (from most to least important) that influenced over 200 thousand college freshman in choosing their schools*

    "College has very good academic reputation"
    "This college's graduates get good jobs"
    "I was offered financial assistance"
    "The cost of attending this college"
    "A visit to this campus"
    "College has a good reputation for its social activities"
    "Wanted to go to a college about this size"
    "College's grads get into top grad/professional schools"
    "The percentage of students that graduate from this college"
    "I wanted to live near home"

*According to US News and World Report and the Princeton Review.
   

Does not include "free cheese" meaning no Wisconsin students were surveyed.  A useless survey in this argument.

[bleedpurple]

Here's a list of the top ten factors (from most to least important) that influenced over 200 thousand college freshman in choosing their schools*

    "College has very good academic reputation"
    "This college's graduates get good jobs"
    "I was offered financial assistance"
    "The cost of attending this college"
    "A visit to this campus"
    "College has a good reputation for its social activities"
    "Wanted to go to a college about this size"
    "College's grads get into top grad/professional schools"
    "The percentage of students that graduate from this college"
    "I wanted to live near home"

*According to US News and World Report and the Princeton Review.
   

Does not include "free cheese" meaning no Wisconsin students were surveyed.  A useless survey in this argument.

I think in Wisconsin, free cheese is assumed in "I was offered financial assistance".  Optimal cash/cheese ratio is about 70/30. And we don't really tell the out of state kids until they arrive, but all work study is paid in cheese.

[OzJohnnie]

Ah, dairy secrets of the brotherhood.  You'll be expelled with prejudice if you keep revealing confidential knowledge.

[bleedpurple]

Ah, dairy secrets of the brotherhood.  You'll be expelled with prejudice if you keep revealing confidential knowledge.

Hey, where did you get that picture?? In case the Cheesemaster is monitoring, I completely deny that the rock we pound is actually a block of cheese!

[badgerwarhawk]

Last year enrollment in the 13 Wisconsin university system schools dropped 22.3%.  Enrollment has been declining since 2010 so the fact WHITEWATER was actually able to grow during that period is the exception, not the rule.  This is part due to changing demographics and a lower birth rate.  But I seriously doubt any of it is due to the administration publicly declaring a national championship as the goal.

https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/education/2017/10/06/challenging-demographics-senenrollment-falls-several-uw-system-campuses-fall-challenging-demographic/734596001/

BW, One way to read your post is: Despite declining enrollment for Wisconsin Universities since 2010, UWW was the exception to the rule as they increased enrollment 7 times in 8 years prior to 2017. The period of increased enrollment for UWW happens to coincide with the years UWW athletic teams (and primarily football), were winning national championships.

My point is that to my knowledge our administration has never publicly stated the football program's goal was a national championship and I don't believe that has anything to do with the drop in enrollment. Particularly when the problem is system wide. Also our retention rate of 2016-17 freshman was a record high so they weren't fleeing because we didn't even make the playoffs let alone the Stagg Bowl.

BW- you’re arguing points I’m not making. Not only that you’re ignoring the statistics the article you posted presents.

I’ll summarize it this way, if it’s your belief general enrollment doesn’t benefit from national success in athletics, we can agree to disagree. 

If your belief is enrollment doesn’t benefit from an administration’s public commitment to national excellence in any aspect of the university, we can agree to disagree.

I didn't say enrollment doesn't benefit from athletic excellence.  I said I don't believe it benefits from the administration publically announcing the goal is a national championship.   There's a difference. 

[MUC57]

Hey you Wisconsin cheese guys (and gals, if applicable)

Several years ago, there was an international contest to judge Swiss cheese. There was a little over 1900 entrants from all over the world. The winner - Guggisberg Cheese, located in Millersburg, Ohio, in Holmes County, in the heart of Amish country. If you don't know, the Amish forego modern conveniences. Horse and buggy, no electricity, etc.
They make quality products, notably furniture and cheese, because of their work ethic. So maybe, for potential students from Ohio, Wisconsin cheese offerings could, I say "could", make them look elsewhere.
Now, I have lots of friends on this board but, hey gang, face reality. Yes, we still think of Wisconsin as the "cheese state", but.................
Hope all you cheese heads, and football fanatics, have a very Merry Christmas. Enjoy family and all loved ones!