FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Pat Coleman]

Indeed, and Eau Claire to the national semifinals in 1998, the last year of the 16-team playoffs.

However, the NWC and the ASC belong to the modern (D3football.com/Pools) era of the sport.

Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004.

[wildcat11]

Indeed, and Eau Claire to the national semifinals in 1998, the last year of the 16-team playoffs.

However, the NWC and the ASC belong to the modern (D3football.com/Pools) era of the sport.

Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004.

2004?  You sure about that? 

[bulk19]

So, from 1999-2006, the WIAC has had a history of bad performances and might be remembered for choking in the championship race, I guess...

2006 - Whitewater loses to Mount Union for the title...
2005 - Whitewater loses to Mount Union for the title...
2004 - La Crosse loses to Linfield in Round 2, as Linfield goes on to win the title...
2003 - La Crosse loses to Mount Union in Round 2; Mount Union finishes as runner-up to St. John's...
2002 - La Crosse loses to Coe in the first round...
2001 - Stevens Point loses to St. John's in round 2
2000 - Stout loses to St. John's in the first round, as St. John's finishes as runner up for the title...
19998- La Crosse lost to Central and Point loses to St. John's, both in round 1...

So, given that history, you can call say it is choking, I guess. But I'm certainly not going to say the conference teams should be remembered for choking, considering who those teams played and how they finished those years...

Saying WIAC teams choked is being disrespectful to the opponents who beat those WIAC teams along the way in the playoffs, considering there are a few schools in there with some mighty good football programs - Mount Union, St. John's and Linfield being three of them....

Using that logic, you be the one to tell the Whitewater guys who finished second the last two years that the will be remembered for choking... And you can tell Mount Union, St. John's and Linfield that they didn't earn their titles, either, since it was just a case of WIAC schools choking against them... But I certainly am not going to do that...

[Pat Coleman]

Indeed, and Eau Claire to the national semifinals in 1998, the last year of the 16-team playoffs.

However, the NWC and the ASC belong to the modern (D3football.com/Pools) era of the sport.

Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004.

2004?  You sure about that? 

Yes. I am positive that losing at Linfield, to a higher seeded team, is not considered a bad loss.

[Pat Coleman]

So, from 1999-2006, the WIAC has had a history of bad performances and might be remembered for choking in the championship race, I guess...

2006 - Whitewater loses to Mount Union for the title...
2005 - Whitewater loses to Mount Union for the title...
2004 - La Crosse loses to Linfield in Round 2, as Linfield goes on to win the title...
2003 - La Crosse loses to Mount Union in Round 2; Mount Union finishes as runner-up to St. John's...
2002 - La Crosse loses to Coe in the first round...
2001 - Stevens Point loses to St. John's in round 2
2000 - Stout loses to St. John's in the first round, as St. John's finishes as runner up for the title...
19998- La Crosse lost to Central and Point loses to St. John's, both in round 1...

So, given that history, you can call say it is choking, I guess. But I'm certainly not going to say the conference teams should be remembered for choking, considering who those teams played and how they finished those years...

Saying WIAC teams choked is being disrespectful to the opponents who beat those WIAC teams along the way in the playoffs, considering there are a few schools in there with some mighty good football programs - Mount Union, St. John's and Linfield being three of them....

Using that logic, you be the one to tell the Whitewater guys who finished second the last two years that the will be remembered for choking... And you can tell Mount Union, St. John's and Linfield that they didn't earn their titles, either, since it was just a case of WIAC schools choking against them... But I certainly am not going to do that...

Using your logic, which is not at ALL related to what I said, is it? Let's stick to what I actually said and not what you are trying to say I said.

Nor is it related to what I wrote during UWW's first run to Salem.

http://www.d3football.com/notables/2005/12/02/Whitewater+carries+weight+of+Wisconsin

[bulk19]

Here's what you've said:

"Before the last two years, what was the postseason reputation of the WIAC?
If there's some jealousy on the part of the rest of the conference, I think it might be worth remembering that the conference was pretty much known as playoff chokers from 1999-Nov. 2005."

And:

"Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004."

How have I twisted your words? You were the one who called labeled the defeats from 1999-2004 as bad loses... And I never said you specifically called the WIAC teams chokers; I repeated that you said the conference is known as being playoff chokers... Then I said you can go ahead and call those teams chokers if you want to, but I won't...

[DuffMan]

Indeed, and Eau Claire to the national semifinals in 1998, the last year of the 16-team playoffs.

However, the NWC and the ASC belong to the modern (D3football.com/Pools) era of the sport.

Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004.

2004?  You sure about that? 

Yes. I am positive that losing at Linfield, to a higher seeded team, is not considered a bad loss.

Depends what you consider a bad loss

[Pat Coleman]

Here's what you've said:

"Before the last two years, what was the postseason reputation of the WIAC?
If there's some jealousy on the part of the rest of the conference, I think it might be worth remembering that the conference was pretty much known as playoff chokers from 1999-Nov. 2005."

And:

"Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004."

How have I twisted your words? You were the one who called labeled the defeats from 1999-2004 as bad loses... And I never said you specifically called the WIAC teams chokers; I repeated that you said the conference is known as being playoff chokers... Then I said you can go ahead and call those teams chokers if you want to, but I won't...

"pretty much" does not equate to "every game in every playoffs was a choke job" -- that's probably where you've gone off the track.

Not every loss was a "bad loss" -- that's why I wrote the words I wrote. You jumped to a conclusion you wanted to hear.

[wildcat11]

Indeed, and Eau Claire to the national semifinals in 1998, the last year of the 16-team playoffs.

However, the NWC and the ASC belong to the modern (D3football.com/Pools) era of the sport.

Right. Though none of them was responsible for the bad losses that the WIAC had from 1999-2004.

2004?  You sure about that? 

Yes. I am positive that losing at Linfield, to a higher seeded team, is not considered a bad loss.

Depends what you consider a bad loss

Ha!  Well I just didn't think that losing by 38 points would be considered a good loss but that was the number 1 west region team of the d3.com era * LAX lost to...so I guess it was a good loss. 

edit: * as ranked by Wildcat11.

[WIAC_NoTalentHack]

Talk about BIG BUCKS, who said coaching football doesn't pay!!!!  Here is a list I got from Jsonline this morning for Wisconsin Badger Assistant Coaches.  The first column is the pay raise, and the second column is the total salary.

Coach Title Raise New base salary

Paul Chryst offensive coordinator         $83,333.33        $283,333.33 
Bob Bolstad tight ends coach               $32,000             $135,000
Kerry Cooks secondary coach               $20,000             $130,000
Henry Mason receivers coach                $20,000             $150,000
Dave Doeren co-defensive coordinator $17,500             $192,500
Randall McCray defensive line coach     $13,000             $116,000
John Settle running backs coach           $8,000               $112,000
Mike Hankwitz defensive coordinator     $7,500              $192,500
Bob Palcic offensive line coach               $7,500               $182,500

[DuffMan]

...the number 1 west region team of the d3.com era *...

edit: * as ranked by Wildcat11.

Oh puh-lease! 

[bulk19]

Oops... I neglected to list the UWL bad performance this year in the playoffs, when they choked against Whitewater....

So Pat, out of the 10 WIAC playoff appearances since 1999, which games were "bad losses?"

You say: "I think it might be worth remembering that the conference was pretty much known as playoff chokers from 1999-Nov. 2005."

"Pretty much" suggests that at least 50 percent of those games were bad... So, pick them out for me; which ones of the 10 are bad losses???

Which teams - if not by you, but by others, as you suggest - are considered chokers in that bunch?

[Pat Coleman]

So Pat, out of the 10 WIAC playoff appearances since 1999, which games were "bad losses?"

Bulk: If you read the link I provided it states quite clearly.

[bulk19]

Your link proves my point - you list what you consider to be only two "bad losses" out of the 7 teams the WIAC had in the playoffs at that point... Add on Whitewater's run in 2005 and 2006, and La Crosse's "bad loss" to Whitewater in 2006, and that would still only leave you with three bad losses out of 10... 

I hardly think that "three bad apples spoils the whole barrel" mentality should fairly be construed into labeling the conference teams as "pretty much known as playoff chokers from 1999-Nov. 2005," which are your words...

Now, if you beleive that statement, then I once again ask you to name the chokers in the list of 10 teams....

It seems you are making your argument about chokers based on what you perceive others to think about this conference - but that isn't your opinion, right -which is why I provided the results, for those who may not be aware of what the WIAC has done since 1999, and the teams they have lost to... I don't perceive that to be choking...

I also think that football in this conference did exist before 1999 playoff expansion, and before Whitewater's consecutive runners-up teams in 2005 and 2006... Whitewater isn't the one who put the WIAC/WSUC and Wisconsin on the map. I think UWL did that with its three National Championships... Oh, and I do believe UWSP won a title, too, although it was stripped from the school, due to player ineligibility...

[badgerwarhawk]

Talk about BIG BUCKS, who said coaching football doesn't pay!!!!  Here is a list I got from Jsonline this morning for Wisconsin Badger Assistant Coaches.  The first column is the pay raise, and the second column is the total salary.

Coach Title Raise New base salary

Paul Chryst offensive coordinator         $83,333.33        $283,333.33 
Bob Bolstad tight ends coach               $32,000             $135,000
Kerry Cooks secondary coach               $20,000             $130,000
Henry Mason receivers coach                $20,000             $150,000
Dave Doeren co-defensive coordinator $17,500             $192,500
Randall McCray defensive line coach     $13,000             $116,000
John Settle running backs coach           $8,000               $112,000
Mike Hankwitz defensive coordinator     $7,500              $192,500
Bob Palcic offensive line coach               $7,500               $182,500

IMO Paul Chryst is the best thing to happen to BADGER FOOTBALL since the hiring of Barry Alvarez.  I'd even rank it higher than the hiring of Bilema which I happen to think was a pretty good move.   Chryst has revolutionized the BADGER offense.  He's worth every penny and then some.


I don't much like the word "choke" to describe the WIAC's post season performance in years past but I wouldn't argue that, for the most part, since LaCrosse's run it hasn't been as successfull as any of us WIAC fans had hoped.   While we are consistantly considered one of the best leagues in the nation from top to bottom it doesn't mean we consistantly have the best team.   The only game that makes me feel as if we've underachieved is the loss to Coe.   Otherwise we've lost to some very good programs and I don't see that as choking.