FB: Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[BoBo]

It has been a reality for several years now that the top of the WIAC has had trouble finding D-3 non-conference opponents even before the Hawks success but I bet that sure won't help the situation.  Started first with UWLC. Do you think it is a coincidence that Platteville and River Falls book teams from the CCIW and MIAC but UWW and UWLC have had to look to NAIA, D-II and D-I opponents to fill out their schedule?  Heck, ask yourself why your own Johnnies play River Falls instead of LaCrosse.     And regarding scheduling, there may be some conflicts but it is not like the AD is sitting on his hands every year until everyone in D-III's schedules are booked and then decides to go looking.

Boy, you guys sure have a high opinion of yourselves these days. Everyone is quaking in their boots  now that UWW has won a National Championship. I'm sure THAT'S the reason. Or could it just be that most teams are already booked up for this year, as well as next, and don't have any open dates. "Come on down" to reality for a sec.

New Year...same issue for the top WIAC schools.  This is not a flash in the pan problem for these schools, it's a repetitive issue over the recent past and probably continue into the future. Simply reading PP over the past 3 or 4 years will point that out clearly.  However, I'm not sure the National Championship can make it more difficult to schedule DIII's within a bus driving distance (how can it get more difficult than not having a game?), but it certainly will not make it easier.  The "...all booked up..." argument has been used for years and doesn't hold water anymore now than it did in the past - schools just west of the Mississippi refuse to schedule the top WIAC schools.  The way I see it, if I was an Iowa or Minnesota school, I wouldn't schedule a top shelf WIAC school either; force them to play non-DIII's and severely cripple their ability to get a playoff bid if they don't win the conference.  It's an effective way to eliminate a potential playoff loss without having to play them.  No one would admit to such, but I'm sure that thought has crossed the mind of a least a few AD's and Coaches over there.  Now that Whitewater has won the big prize, maybe it's time for a few schools in the area to step up and prove it on the field today and not simply boast about past success on paper.

[janesvilleflash]

Boy, you guys sure have a high opinion of yourselves these days. Everyone is quaking in their boots  now that UWW has won a National Championship. I'm sure THAT'S the reason. Or could it just be that most teams are already booked up for this year, as well as next, and don't have any open dates. "Come on down" to reality for a sec.

I agree with you most of the time, but not on this. It's been well documented how difficult it is to schedule games year after year.

[badgerwarhawk]

Boy, you guys sure have a high opinion of yourselves these days. Everyone is quaking in their boots  now that UWW has won a National Championship. I'm sure THAT'S the reason. Or could it just be that most teams are already booked up for this year, as well as next, and don't have any open dates. "Come on down" to reality for a sec.

No, not at all.  Getting a full schedule has always been a problem for us.  It's only worsened in the recent past and with the the success we've enjoyed.   It's a problem to some degree for all the WIAC programs.  LaCrosse, despite scheduling D2 programs, hasn't played a full schedule in a few years.   Oshkosh and River Falls played each other in nonconference games a few seasons ago as well. 

[oshfb]

That doesnt make any sense...do you mean Oshkosh played River Falls during the first 3 weeks of the season (the traditional non-conference period)? Which year are you referring to?

Oshkosh and River Falls played each other in nonconference games a few seasons ago as well. 

[Sakman 1111]

Actually it does make sense .....In 2000 OshKosh played River Falls twice. One as a non-conference and one as a conference game. Never doubt Badgerwarhawk....

[KitchenSink]

That was in 2000 - Osh vs River Falls double dip.  (RF swept both)

I saw that two schools in the American Southwest Conf (Mary Hardin Baylor's conf) did that this past season.  Strange, but I suppose it's better than not playing.

[Just Bill]

Platteville and Stevens Point did the same in 2001:

http://www.uwsp.edu/Athletics/football/2001/schedule.htm

[OzJohnnie]

Looks like the WIAC schools are even afraid to play themselves (or is it with themselves) since the obvious answer is to double schedule a couple schools.

Or... it may be that they find it politically expedient, in terms of getting two teams nominated to the playoffs, to continue claiming "We're too tough to get out conference opponents."  Double up in conference and you may take a loss, which is worse than being a game short on the schedule.

[pastprime]

Since we're beating that old horse again of lack of non-conference DIII foes and we (WIAC, not Stout) have the walnut and bronze back, I would like to bring up, how would MUC and St. Johns have done in the last 15 years if they would have been in the WIAC?  Let's not use the roster limit or red-shirting for some lame excuses but I would really like to throw this out there for some post play-off discussion.  

Let's face it, the MIAC and OAC have been one horse conferences for sometime.  Only 2 or 3 games have any bearing on their outcome.  As for the WIAC, each week (except for the last 2 years or so) has brought so much uncertainty as to who will win the automatic bid.  It's wasn't unusual for the outcome to be determined in the last week of play.  What would MUC and St. Johns do if they really had to play every week of conference play?  

[OzJohnnie]

The most objective answer to that question would be to look at the NCAA end of season regional rankings where they balance team strength.  For SJU & WIAC, this is doable since they are in the same region.  MUC?  Someone else has to come up with the brilliant idea, but you're pretty delusional if you think they would finish other than #1 every year but one in ten.

So, using the wayback machine of archive.org to search out past results on NCAASports.com, here are the results:

2004: SJU somewhere in the upper middle
2005: SJU second behind UWW (and Concordia would be third ahead of Oshkosh in fourth)
2006: SJU second behind UWW
2007: SJU second behind UWW (or third if you toss Bethel into the mix)

That's all for archive.org - maybe someone knows where to find the NCAA regional rankings from earlier years.  Short of that, eyeballing the conference standings back to 2000 leads me to believe these results:

2000: SJU second behind Stout (or third behind Bethel at one, then Stout at two)
2001: SJU first (or second behind Bethel)
2002: SJU first (and Concordia would be second in front of LAX)
2003: SJU first (and arguable that Bethel would be second in front of LAX)

One thing is obvious: the MIAC has been far more than a one trick pony.  There are three horses in our stables (and a STO pony waiting to bust out).

A second thing is obvious: SJU has maintained a level of excellence over a number of years.  In only one year of the eight surveyed did SJU fail to land at #1 or #2 on the table (discounting other MIAC teams knocking them down).  Name the WIAC team that delivers similarly consistent excellence.  Must be your strong conference that prevents a team from staying on top.

[bulk19]

OZ Johnnie - you seem to be penciling in an automatic win against UWEC for 2007... Not sure you can do that, no matter what wayback machine you travel into, nor stats you use... Last time I checked, the game was determined on the field, and since St Johns and UWEC didn't play this year, I'm not conceding a fourth place finish in the WIAC, if Bethel and St. Johns were in the conference... The Blugolds have played well against the Johnnies and would probably have done so again this year as well...

As far as the conference goes, I think UW-La Crosse has done well in consistently representing it nationally over the years, with Whitewater taking over the last three years...

[stoutguy]

So, Whitewater, I hear that your coach has applied at Mankato.  What do you think?

[Kira & Jaxon's Dad]

So, Whitewater, I hear that your coach has applied at Mankato.  What do you think?

Is this true?  Does he have any connections there?

[KitchenSink]

Which coach are we talking about?  Z?

[badgerwarhawk]

Since we're beating that old horse again of lack of non-conference DIII foes and we (WIAC, not Stout) have the walnut and bronze back, I would like to bring up, how would MUC and St. Johns have done in the last 15 years if they would have been in the WIAC?  Let's not use the roster limit or red-shirting for some lame excuses but I would really like to throw this out there for some post play-off discussion.

I don't think either would do as well as they have done in their own leagues but I also suspect both would do just fine and would have been consistant contenders for the league title.  They've had good athletes, excellent coaching and systems that are successfull.  Logic says the top to bottom parity in the WIAC would probably lead to fewer wins but regardless of how tough their leagues are or aren't they haven't been as dominating as they've been, for the length of time they've been, by chance or luck.